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Equipment Boards => Brunswick => Topic started by: DANGERZONE on November 11, 2005, 02:40:46 AM

Title: diff pin classic zones
Post by: DANGERZONE on November 11, 2005, 02:40:46 AM: I know this has been talked about a dozen or so times but I can't find any posts on the subject using the search tool. Can someone tell me the difference between the 3 that is red pin, green pin and original. Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: nd300 on November 11, 2005, 10:49:39 AM: I had thought it was the Slay/R cover on the red pins...........if I'm wrong then I apologize.
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Chris
Lane#1--nothing else hits like 'em.
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Jeffrevs on November 11, 2005, 11:13:57 AM: quote:
Theres only 2 different Classics, Red pin and green pins.

Red pins are blems, the activator cover cured to fast making them harder. There about an arrow+ straighter have similar reactions down lane as the Green pins.
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- Joe
Brunswick
www.Brunswickbowling.com
www.BrunswickInsiders.com
If you ain't throwing Brunswick, you ain't maximizing your abilities!

Is that the case really, or where they made that way and they had a few left over when making the Elite rs48? So they called them the "CZ red pin" ?

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JEFF
"...each anothers audience outside the gilded cage.."

Edited on 11/16/2005 6:54 AM
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: DANGERZONE on November 11, 2005, 01:49:30 PM: so I have an original CZ this is the same thing as a green pin?
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: DANGERZONE on November 11, 2005, 02:08:27 PM: thanks for clearing that up for me.
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: shimozukawa on November 11, 2005, 11:31:05 PM: Hey Lefty,

What is your basis for this claim? Do you have anything that you can cite as a reference?
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Strider on November 12, 2005, 01:07:43 PM: This has been beaten to death many times. Green pin = activator. Red pin = activator that cured too fast, so it's much less aggressive. Ric Hamlin and Robert Lawerence have both verified this.
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Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: bigearv14 on November 12, 2005, 05:43:23 PM: i too was under the impression that the Red Pins were Powerkoil LS covers. can some Big B rep clear this up once and for all?!?!?!?!
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: stanski on November 12, 2005, 05:49:12 PM: its called the search feature for those that need confirmation. All brunswick reps have agreed it is hardened activator.
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stanski
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: a_ak57 on November 12, 2005, 06:35:02 PM: Ric Hamlin, Robert Lawrence and Tom Tomaras have all backed up the activator-cured-too-quickly thing.

Jeff, maybe so but you would think brunswick would have sold them all the Elite, rather than the stores who are selling them for $65 or under, meaning brunswick got even less for them than that. Of course, that's assuming elite would have paid them more for the same ball.
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- Andy
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: bigearv14 on November 12, 2005, 06:40:40 PM: that sucks. i was thinking of getting one. i loved the slay/r and would loved to see a stronger core in the PK LS. oh well.
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: a_ak57 on November 12, 2005, 06:47:42 PM: quote:
that sucks. i was thinking of getting one. i loved the slay/r and would loved to see a stronger core in the PK LS. oh well.

Why not get it anyways? You don't know that you would like PK LS with an aysmm. core or that you wouldn't like this just because it has an odd cover. I have one and I like it a lot. It's the ball I switch to in the middle of the second game/third game. Strong arcing motion for me.
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- Andy
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: JCLives on November 12, 2005, 08:04:53 PM: Where can you buy one of the red pins?
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Born Again and Heaven Bound (Ask Me How, if Interested)
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: bigearv14 on November 13, 2005, 01:10:30 PM: quote:
quote:
that sucks. i was thinking of getting one. i loved the slay/r and would loved to see a stronger core in the PK LS. oh well.

Why not get it anyways? You don't know that you would like PK LS with an aysmm. core or that you wouldn't like this just because it has an odd cover. I have one and I like it a lot. It's the ball I switch to in the middle of the second game/third game. Strong arcing motion for me.
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- Andy

The way you're saying it, no one would know if they would like any ball, so why not get them all. Well, heck, why not get any ball then? I know I won't like it because I have had very poor luck with the Activator and its successors. Not saying it's bad, cause I can make any ball work, just doesn't match up with my game enough for me to buy one. I tend to prefer asymmetrical cores with Big B covers, such as the Ravage, but have tried all of the Infernos and haven't had much luck, a little with the OI, but not much. I would like to see an asymm. line with PK covers, sort of like the Time Zone. LOVE THAT BALL!!!!
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: a_ak57 on November 13, 2005, 01:16:01 PM: I said that because you can't know that you'll like a ball with PK LS around the zone aysmm core, because the ball you liked PK LS with had a completely different (symmetrical) core. I don't mean to be an a-hole, but think about it. Remember the blazing inferno? It had activator. TONS of people loved activator on the original inferno, but few liked the blazing even though they shared the same cover.

Not starting a fight, just explaining my post.
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- Andy
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: bigearv14 on November 14, 2005, 07:29:17 AM: OH, I don't think you're strating a fight. This is a good discussion. I liked the Slay/r, but always wished it would finish a little bit stronger, plus, I love Asymm. balls mostly already, so I am almost positive I would like that type of ball. I have thought about this and I promise I am not just running off my big fat mouth (even though I do have one, lol). I don't get upset easy, so feel free to argue your point all you want. It's not like I'm harrylegthigh or anything.

*cheap shot, then runs*
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: bigearv14 on November 14, 2005, 07:30:33 AM: Oh, any BTW, the Blazing was bad because of the block, not the cover. The Smokin'/Blazing core gave me a buttload of 10-pins that made me sick!!!
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: shimozukawa on November 16, 2005, 04:19:21 AM: I used the search feature. Outside of this thread, the Activator curing statement was only found once... and it wasn't stated by a Brunswick staffer. I did a 30 day lookback, as that seems to be the maximum.
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Nails on November 16, 2005, 04:05:10 PM: The search only goes back so far, but I found this post in less than a minute. I can find some others if you wish. Some accounts will let you see very old posts if you never changed your preferences. For example, I can see 147 pages of Brunswick posts, going back to April of 2003.

http://www.ballreviews.com/Forum/Replies.asp?TopicID=97301&ForumID=2&CategoryID=2

In case you can't view all of the replies, he is a quote from Robert Lawerence:

quote:
gotogo, You say "It says that it has the Monster Slay/R coversock as opposed to the Activator". Who says or what says? Like DC said, it is indeed Activator, those just did not come out right. The Red Pin is indeed a ball for medium to light oil, whereas the Green Pin is more like an Original Inferno with stronger layout options because of the assymetric core.

RoB LAW

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Looks like it's back to the left side again for me.
ALL BRUNSWICK...ALL THE TIME !!!

Brunbert Von Leftwich

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Telling it like it is.
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: a_ak57 on November 16, 2005, 08:52:06 PM: quote:
quote:
Where can you buy one of the red pins?
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Born Again and Heaven Bound (Ask Me How, if Interested)

Look on ebay, there's usually plenty of them there. Cheap too.
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I've seen some of them go for the 9.99 starting bid price (plus shipping). For a good NIB ball, you can't beat that.
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- Andy
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Strider on November 16, 2005, 10:11:45 PM: I just picked one up from Ebay. Seems like most of them end up selling for $25-35 + shipping. I'll be interested to see where it fits withing my dry lane equipment. Goodness knows I need lots of dry lane options lately.
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Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Strider on November 21, 2005, 08:34:00 PM: Got my red pin CZ drilled this afternoon. Pin 5.5" from axis, MB just to the right of my grip center below the thumb. This might just be what the doctor ordered. This wasn't my toasty league shot, but I'll know tomorrow. Today (new house for me) was a medium oil house shot, but no super dry parts outside of 7. Obviously it wasn't the best place to test it, but even if I slowed it down and revved it up, it didn't hook much and had no snap on the backend. It was a good 5 boards weaker than my Power Groove. Tomorrow, as long as it's dry like it has been, I'll get to compare it to the Power Groove, a Storm Blue Hot Flame, and a Visionary Slate Blue Gargoyle. I used the Gargoyle last week and squeaked out two 200's after trying the resin balls for the first game and a half. The Power Groove was way too snappy. Carry was good when I could hit the pocket. The Blue Hot Flame was OK for finding the pocket, but carry wasn't great. With the look I had with the Classic Zone today, I'm feeling pretty confident.
--------------------
Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Strider on December 06, 2005, 12:49:17 PM: I'm starting to warm up to the red pin CZ. Took me a little while to get used to it. Started using a new driller since I moved so far away from my old shop. Took a little fine tuning to where the ball feels good on my hand. Didn't shoot much the first two weeks, but I certainly wasn't throwing the ball very good. Also strange seeing a ball with a lot of length that has so little backend. It's like something between a pearl resin and plastic. Managed to shoot 714 in my toasty afternoon league. Definitely not a board coverer (hello 10 pin), but a tight line from inside is very effective. Certainly gives me what I needed, no over reaction at the break point.
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Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: RSalas on December 06, 2005, 12:56:51 PM: Strider, did you put the pin above the fingers, or below?

Also, did the layout you chose require an XH?
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...formerly "The Curse of Dusty," and "PoÃ¶ter BoÃ¶f" before that...
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Strider on December 06, 2005, 01:32:20 PM: The pin is just above the bridge, CG is just right of the grip center, MB below the thumb, and barely right of the center line, no weight hole necessary. I think the fingers were drilled a little deeper than normal because it was around 7/8 oz finger weight originally (started with around 4 oz top).

First drilling (for dry lanes) on page 3 here.

http://www.brunswickbowling.com/uploads/images/887/Zone_Classic.pdf
--------------------
Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: Strider on December 13, 2005, 08:43:26 PM: This ball has been a very good find for me. Shot a solid 673 today. Won the second game high pot, and just 6 pins from the high series pot. Nice 8 pin in the ninth frame of the last game! Best part was a clean series. No over-reaction. I threw 3 or 4 trip 4's that would have easily been splits with just about any other resin ball. Of course, a few of the 2's and 2-4-5's might have been strikes with a ball with more recovery, but ya can't have everything.

I might even look for another of these to drill little stronger to get a little sharper move at the break point. Anyone have a Red Pin drilled close to the 2nd drilling (med to dry lane condition) on page 3 of Brunswick's Asymetric Drilling Sheet (http://"http://www.brunswickbowling.com/uploads/images/887/Zone_Classic.pdf")?
--------------------
Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
Title: Re: diff pin classic zones
Post by: RSalas on December 14, 2005, 11:52:26 AM: quote:
Anyone have a Red Pin drilled close to the 2nd drilling (med to dry lane condition) on page 3 of Brunswick's Asymetric Drilling Sheet (http://"http://www.brunswickbowling.com/uploads/images/887/Zone_Classic.pdf")?

I don't personally, but I can say that two asymmetric Zones, drilled with the same pin position, but with different locator line angles, can yield significantly different ball reactions; I've seen this myself. So if you like the general shape that the Red Pin gives you, but you want to get some midlane help, then you might want to try the "medium-dry" layout. After all, those Red Pins are cheap enough these days...
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...formerly "The Curse of Dusty," and "PoÃ¶ter BoÃ¶f" before that...