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Author Topic: PSA position  (Read 5731 times)

Mr Bass

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PSA position
« on: November 21, 2005, 11:08:36 AM »
What is the strongest position (in degrees) that you or anyone has their Zones drilled and what reaction did the ball have?
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dizzyfugu

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2005, 02:22:19 AM »
PSa at 90° from PAP should give the most dramatic result. Closer to PAP will tame the backend down, making the ball "arcy", further away you can make the ball more aggressive in the midlane and have a rather rolly backend. Great as a control option.

Nevertheless, be careful not to place the PSA marker on the nagetive side of the ball and too close to the track. With a strong differential RG and a high mass bias, you could track over your finger or thumb holes and even create negative flare!

Take at a look at Brusnwick's asymmetric Zone ball drilling sheets, and check out http://www.ballreviews.com/Forum/Replies.asp?TopicID=74110&ForumID=16&CategoryID=5
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Edited on 11/22/2005 6:27 AM
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Mr Bass

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2005, 03:24:38 AM »
Thanks
I was able to find this

http://www.rollrite.co.uk/secrets.php?id=11
--------------------
"Smokey this is not 'Nam this is bowling, there are rules"
"Maybe those Ebonite balls hit too hard. They're too good" -Jason Couch after leaving a stone 8 pin
"Yeah but the Brunswick ones get all ten though" -Brad Angelo
"One thing I love about bowling you never have it all figured out" -kingpin76
¡Viva la nación!
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dizzyfugu

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2005, 03:10:02 AM »
It is as a general, very good source. Thank you for the link, too!
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DizzyFugu --- Reporting from Germany
Team "X": http://homepage.mac.com/timlinked/
"All that we see or seem, is but a dream within a dream..." - Edgar Allen Poe
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LuckyLefty

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2005, 07:44:46 AM »
I'm confused by your wording of further away.  IF "further away from the PAP the PSA is "

I believe your statement is incorrect.  The further away the PSA is from the PAP the less the midlane.  (if you meant further away from grip then I have incorrectly read your statement and you are right)

The strongest PSA position is "strong" about 1 1/2 inches from thumb. Combines medium midlane and big backend move..

Further away from thumb and near PAP leads to a lot of midlane and an archy backend or "rolly".

A PSA near the thumb reduces midlane the most on these strong mass bias balls.

It is only the strong mass bias on these balls tha that can cause negative flaring and this CAN happen for some bowlers when the mass bias is out near the track on the negative side!  FOR very strong mass bias balls.  Like the Zone series, the shock and awe series at Morich and the Triples from Storm.

Other more moderate mass bias balls CAN have the mass bias out on the track.  And certainly this is done all the time in symmetric balls thru drillings called label leverage.

REgards,

Luckylefty
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BackToBasics

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2005, 09:04:23 AM »
The strength of the MB location is relative to the bowler's axis point and not the grip.  Three bowlers with different PAPs will have different strong MB locations. One could be left of the thumb, on the thumb or 2" right of the thumb.
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Brickguy221

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2005, 09:31:57 AM »
I can tell you from my personal experience that a workable MB position for a bowler depends on the bowler's revs. For example take myself. I am rev challanged and have low revs....really low revs, so if I put the MB any further from my PAP than what my PAP is, the ball won't turn the corner like it should and won't be strong on the backend for me for me. For example, my PAP is 4 3/4 over 1/2 up, so if I don't put the MB more than 4 3/4" from my PAP, it will work for me, but if I put the MB 5 3/4" from the PAP, the ball won't turn like it should and will be weak on the backend. As I have already said, this has been my personal experience with the MB locations. Whether it is the same for someone else with really low revs like myself, I cannot say.

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LuckyLefty

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2005, 09:59:56 AM »
Chappy...you are absolutely 100% percent right.

However for 90% of bowlers or 80% of bowlers who have paps near 5 my statement is correct.

For the guy with a 3 1/2 inch pap.  Strong may be on negative side of thumb.

A better way to say it would be.  Less midlane(mass bias on track...except for these very strong mass bias balls).  Medium midlane and big backend(mass bias half way between track and pap).  Big midlane rolly backend(mass bias out on VAL or past).

Hope I'm getting closer to correct.

REgards.

Luckylefty
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Proud owner of a 140 first game average this year!  Don't bowl me the second two games though!  (two warm up balls in league..thanks proprietors)
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TheDude

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2005, 10:29:49 AM »
pap at 4 1/4 my strong position is almost in my thumb. i kick out mb out at all and it all rolls out in the midlane
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DP3

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2005, 10:47:43 AM »
quote:
Chappy...you are absolutely 100% percent right.

However for 90% of bowlers or 80% of bowlers who have paps near 5 my statement is correct.

For the guy with a 3 1/2 inch pap.  Strong may be on negative side of thumb.

A better way to say it would be.  Less midlane(mass bias on track...except for these very strong mass bias balls).  Medium midlane and big backend(mass bias half way between track and pap).  Big midlane rolly backend(mass bias out on VAL or past).

Hope I'm getting closer to correct.

REgards.

Luckylefty
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Proud owner of a 140 first game average this year!  Don't bowl me the second two games though!  (two warm up balls in league..thanks proprietors)



I think you'd be suprised at the PAP coordinates of most bowlers.  The more and more bowlers I drill for in the MD/DC/DE area I'm starting to find out the "average" PAP for people in these areas is around the 4 1/2 - 4 5/8 area.  This could be attributed to drier conditions and humidity and people developing a release according to the conditions they see in the center.  When I see alot of the college players and amateurs from up north (NJ/southern PA/NY city/Long Island bowlers), you see even more low trackers with large track diameters and dramatic PAP coordinates as low as 3"!  I think the craziest thing I've ever seen is a high rev(about 440rpm, 17-18mph) young lefty with PAP coordinates of 3" left and 2 1/4" down.  He had alot of spectators wondering where the hell he learned to throw a ball like that.....come to find out, he grew up bowling in Michael Fagan's home center as a youth.  This was a place that was known for notoriously bad conditions with hardly any oil in the heads.

I'd concur that to have an accurate measurement of the strong PSA position one would have to measure approximately 3 3/4 - 4 1/2 from the MB to PAP.
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Brickguy221

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2005, 11:31:25 AM »
quote:
I'd concur that to have an accurate measurement of the strong PSA position one would have to measure approximately 3 3/4 - 4 1/2 from the MB to PAP.
 


Exactly. I made a post above indicating the MB in this area working best for myself as I am a low rev bowler. Maybe this is true for bowlers with higher revs than myself, I don't know.

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a_ak57

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Re: PSA position
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2005, 01:24:46 PM »
Yeah, they're the same.  PSA means preferred spin axis.  MB means mass bias.  PSA seems more self explanatory.  Mass bias doesn't technically say "oh well this is the axis point about which the ball wants to rotate" which is what the whole significance of it is.
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