Author Topic: Super-Flex cover question (Read 10265 times)

dougb · « **on:** December 06, 2011, 04:33:50 PM »

How strong is the cover on modern lane conditions? I know this was on many Columbia 300 and AMF balls in the past, including the Beast, Messenger, Jazz, and Scout series. My impression is this is a fairly weak cover, more for lighter oil conditions. Am I correct?

Edited by dougb on 12/7/2011 at 1:36 AM

Strider · « **Reply #1 on:** December 07, 2011, 04:56:39 AM »

Super Flex with a good core is still a solid medium oil cover on a house shot. I continue to use an AMF Nighthawk M2 (pearl) as my main THS ball. I had a pearl Beast as well, but it was more of a med/light ball for me.

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completebowler · « **Reply #2 on:** December 07, 2011, 05:21:30 AM »

The Beast line from what I remember began with a urethane (blue) then transitioned to Flexcell in the purple Beast. I believe this was a urethane/reactive mixture. But to the best of my knowledge they never put SuperFlex on a Beast except the SuperBeast. And I think the NightHawk Menace had a particle/mica load in it. Here is a partial list of balls that had SuperFlex. In my opinion the Boss and the NightHawk were the best two ever built.

As to the topic...I have used an original NightHawk on med/dry house shots with some pretty good success.

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charlest · « **Reply #3 on:** December 07, 2011, 06:15:19 AM »

I've learned that Super-Flex is still sort of chameleon, particularly the solid version. When sanded or dull, it can still handle some pretty heavy oil, especially with cores with a decent amount of flare/RG differential or around .050". Given a low RG core, like many of today's stronger ball, oh, say 2.48 or thereabouts, a sanded (P1500 - P2000 grit) SF ball can still handle today's medium-heavy oil.

When polished, it has the ability to handle light to medium light, especially with milder cores, RG of 2.51- 2.55 and RG diff of .035 -.040 (900Global Creature is an example of such a ball)..

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dizzyfugu · « **Reply #4 on:** December 07, 2011, 06:57:27 AM »

IMHO, it is pretty comparable to Brunswick's PK18. It is not a weak material, but it does not react as spontnaneausly to friction as more modern covers. The stuff covers a wide range of conditions - as already mentioned, the core and the surface prep play a major role for the ball's utility. With a high RG core you get very good length even on lighter conditions, but with some sanding a low RG core a Super-Flex ball covers much heavier conditions. The cover is IMHO very good and still up to date, you just have to check what you want and if the ball design matches the purpose. I would not call it weak!

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Good Times Good Times · « **Reply #5 on:** December 07, 2011, 07:15:37 AM »

I LOVE my pin up shiny Jazz on light mediums when the backends are clean. I will say that this cover ISN'T for toasted heads, I have to ball down to the MoJave for that, but when there is plenty of hook downlane it has quite a "pop" off the spot. It will not freak out and go left though. I did try it with some surface and it wasn't a good look at all for me.....

But it's a good cover and seems durable.

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dougb · « **Reply #6 on:** December 07, 2011, 08:25:38 AM »

Thanks everybody, this is really helpful. I have a Lane #1 Retro Buzzsaw THS. From what I understand, the BASF Bleeder Coverstock is really Super-Flex as this is when C300 was pouring for the company.

This, along with the medium RG (2.502) and low differential core (0.035), explains why the ball is so super-smooth on THS shots. I have found it takes well to adjustments too, much like PK18.

I'm wondering how it would compare to the Seismic Solaris Blackout, which has a weaker cover and similar stats (although the RG is slightly lower).

Since Charlest just bought a Blackout, maybe he can weigh in!

charlest · « **Reply #7 on:** December 07, 2011, 11:09:30 AM »

I just ordered it, Doug. WHo knows when I will get it and when I can get it drilled ...

Actually I was watching the video and was thinking of where and by whom it is made (900Global). I had the thought that, are you sitting down, it might just be pure solid Super-Flex, given the overall reaction supported by the very low RG and the relatively low Differential (.035"). My friend had one and indicated the reaction is not all that small. In the video on BBE, look how deep one of those guys is playing (laydown point is around 35, maybe deeper.) As I said above, polished solid Super-Flex can be played on medium-light oil, supposedly the Blackout's forte, strength. Given the above, the Blackout could be a remake of the Villain (Villain). The core is ever so slightly different in its stem.

dougb wrote on 12/7/2011 9:25 AM:Thanks everybody, this is really helpful. I have a Lane #1 Retro Buzzsaw THS. From what I understand, the BASF Bleeder Coverstock is really Super-Flex as this is when C300 was pouring for the company.

This, along with the medium RG (2.502) and low differential core (0.035), explains why the ball is so super-smooth on THS shots. I have found it takes well to adjustments too, much like PK18.

I'm wondering how it would compare to the Seismic Solaris Blackout, which has a weaker cover and similar stats (although the RG is slightly lower).

Since Charlest just bought a Blackout, maybe he can weigh in!

"None are so blind as those who will not see."

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completebowler · « **Reply #8 on:** December 07, 2011, 12:02:27 PM »

Oh yeah...forgot about that one when stating the Boss and NightHawk were the best two balls with SuperFlex. The Retro THS would definitely have to get some votes in that category too. Still have mine sitting around..aybe I should dig it out tonight.

dougb wrote on 12/7/2011 9:25 AM:
Thanks everybody, this is really helpful. I have a Lane #1 Retro Buzzsaw THS. From what I understand, the BASF Bleeder Coverstock is really Super-Flex as this is when C300 was pouring for the company.

This, along with the medium RG (2.502) and low differential core (0.035), explains why the ball is so super-smooth on THS shots. I have found it takes well to adjustments too, much like PK18.

I'm wondering how it would compare to the Seismic Solaris Blackout, which has a weaker cover and similar stats (although the RG is slightly lower).

Since Charlest just bought a Blackout, maybe he can weigh in!

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LookingForALeftyWall · « **Reply #9 on:** December 07, 2011, 01:28:18 PM »

I was using a Ti Messenger that has a Super-Flex cover for a few weeks last year. Comparing it to a ball today, I would say that the ball had the hooking power of a Freeze. And for what it's worth, I'd define myself as a stroker and I didn't have any problems throwing it on a low volumn THS.

TDC57 · « **Reply #10 on:** December 07, 2011, 02:48:40 PM »

I have Ti-Pearl Messenger Blk/Gold with the Super-Flex cover and it is still the best medium house shot ball I've ever owned. Fairly strong in the oil and a great backend. I also owned an original Wicked with the solid Super-Flex and it was very versatile with a great explosive hit.

dougb · « **Reply #11 on:** December 07, 2011, 10:11:29 PM »

I hope you pulled the THS off the shelf. One of the most underrated balls out there from any company, IMO.

I ended up ordering the Solaris Blackout. I'm going to put a rico drill on it and will post a review when I get some games with it. I expect it will roll a little sooner and be just as smooth.

completebowler wrote on 12/7/2011 1:02 PM:Oh yeah...forgot about that one when stating the Boss and NightHawk were the best two balls with SuperFlex. The Retro THS would definitely have to get some votes in that category too. Still have mine sitting around..aybe I should dig it out tonight.

dougb wrote on 12/7/2011 9:25 AM:
Thanks everybody, this is really helpful. I have a Lane #1 Retro Buzzsaw THS. From what I understand, the BASF Bleeder Coverstock is really Super-Flex as this is when C300 was pouring for the company.

This, along with the medium RG (2.502) and low differential core (0.035), explains why the ball is so super-smooth on THS shots. I have found it takes well to adjustments too, much like PK18.

I'm wondering how it would compare to the Seismic Solaris Blackout, which has a weaker cover and similar stats (although the RG is slightly lower).

Since Charlest just bought a Blackout, maybe he can weigh in!

ALL STAR BOWLING & TROPHY
LANGAN'S ALL STAR LANES
IBPSIA MEMBER
WALLED LAKE MI

All Star Bowling & Trophy

dizzyfugu · « **Reply #12 on:** December 09, 2011, 02:11:54 AM »

dougb wrote on 07.12.2011 9:25 AM:
Since Charlest just bought a Blackout, maybe he can weigh in!

The Blackout has a solid Super-Flex cover? That would explain some things to me...

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charlest · « **Reply #13 on:** December 09, 2011, 03:50:20 AM »

That is only a guess on my part. Unfortunately all resin looks alike and any one can be made in any color.

dizzyfugu wrote on 12/9/2011 3:11 AM:

dougb wrote on 07.12.2011 9:25 AM:
Since Charlest just bought a Blackout, maybe he can weigh in!
The Blackout has a solid Super-Flex cover? That would explain some things to me...

DizzyFugu - Reporting from Germany
2010/11 Benrather BC Club Champion
Confused by bowling? Check out BR.com's vault of wisdom: the unofficial FAQ section

"None are so blind as those who will not see."

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dizzyfugu · « **Reply #14 on:** December 09, 2011, 04:13:27 AM »

Ah, I thought it was a confirmed info. But that would make sense, from my experience with Super-Flex and the way the Blackout moves and behaves. It is, at least, a plausible theory (but makes the rather huge price tag on the Blackout a bit more exaggerated...).

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2010/11 Benrather BC Club Champion
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Author Topic: Super-Flex cover question (Read 10265 times)

dougb

Super-Flex cover question

Strider

Re: Super-Flex cover question

completebowler

Re: Super-Flex cover question

charlest

Re: Super-Flex cover question

dizzyfugu

Re: Super-Flex cover question

Good Times Good Times

Re: Super-Flex cover question

dougb

Re: Super-Flex cover question

charlest

Re: Super-Flex cover question

completebowler

Re: Super-Flex cover question

LookingForALeftyWall

Re: Super-Flex cover question

TDC57

Re: Super-Flex cover question

dougb

Re: Super-Flex cover question

dizzyfugu

Re: Super-Flex cover question

charlest

Re: Super-Flex cover question

dizzyfugu

Re: Super-Flex cover question