win a ball from Bowling.com

Author Topic: my experience on surface changes  (Read 5168 times)

icewall

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
my experience on surface changes
« on: March 22, 2010, 11:41:09 PM »
First I would like to compare surface mediums available.

these would be scotchbrite, abralon, sia air velvet, wet/dry sandpaper. (never tried trizact)

scotchbrite - available in maroon/burgandy (~P600), green (P1100), lt. grey (P1500). there are
others but dont really offer anything worth getting as scotchbrite for the most part is really only
 good for scuffing the ball.

abralon / sia air - based on the p scale / fepa standards. very uniform finish. many already know
about these so ill only say that I only use sia air now as ive found them to last at a minimum 10
balls where I felt abralon didnt last anywhere near as long, plus sia air comes in many grits that
abralon doesnt.

wet-dry - works as good as abralon or sia air but leaves many sanding lines and really isnt needed if you have abralon or sia air pads as they leave a more uniform finish.

next I would like to discuss "how the heck do I get my ball back to OOB":

this section is for modern balls only. meaning finishes of 1000, 2000, 4000 and the ever elusive 1500 grit polished!

now every manufacturer is different. I believe most ebonite family balls are 500, 1000, 2000, 4000 stepped balls and are to be sanded on a spinner for ~40 seconds with each grit till the final surface is achieved. They recommend light pressure always.

but heres the tricky ones such as 500 / 4000 or 500 / 2000

per storm:

4000 OOB
take 500 grit pad and sand all 4 sides for 15 seconds on each side. then
take 4000 grit and sand LIGHTLY for 60 seconds all 4 sides

2000 OOB

take 500 grit pad and sand all 4 sides for 15 seconds on each side. then
take 2000 grit and sand LIGHTLY for 50 seconds all 4 sides

1000 OOB

take 500 grit pad and sand all 4 sides for 15 seconds on each side. then
take 1000 grit and sand LIGHTLY for 30 seconds all 4 sides

1500 grit polished:

ahhhh the one thats very hard to figure out! but if you follow storms directions it comes out perfect. BUT I will warn you that your ball wont look super shiny like OOB. you have to look at the outer portion of a ball to see a balls actual surface and it indeed is very shiny like OOB and the reaction is the same

(you will need a 320 grit compound rated at 1500 grit) which means it passes the surfacing medium thru a 320 grit mesh screen and when applied to a ball it surfaces to 1500 grit.

here we go:

take 500 grit pad and sand all 4 sides for 15 seconds on each side. then
take a lt. grey scotchbrite pad and sand all 4 sides with LIGHT pressure for 40 seconds a side
polish using storm step 2 on 2 sides 15 seconds each with a damp towel. LIGHT PRESSURE!!!

if you dont have a 320 grit to 1500 grit compound, many have said the closest is
500 / 2000 followed by a gritless polish but I havent tried it out lately.

I retract any statement I ever made saying you can achieve this finsh using lt grey pad plus gritless polish. the pad I was using was a lt grey pad from lanemasters, which when compared next to a scotchbrite lt. grey pad are VERY different. supposed to be the same but I doubt it and no longer recommend it.


the key to these surfaces is deeply grooving or sanding the balls surface and then smoothing the top of these deep grooves using a higher grit AND doing so with light pressure for longer.

It has been my experience that this works and indeed does produce the OOB finish of my bowling balls. just remember, regular/firm pressure with the first deep grit, then lighter and longer on the final grit(s) .

these surfaces have been tested on a rapid fire solid, t-road pearl, visionary gladiator solid, and roto grip rogue cell. I knew the rogue cell the best as it has a voodoo like roll at 500/4000 OOB and I cant use it when there is carrydown. surfaced it and it rolled EXACTLY like the OOB, very clean thru the heads a grip in the midlane then nothing in the back due to the carrydown and the momentum the ball got due to it skidding thru the heads so much. which is exactly how it reacted for me OOB.
--------------------
tweener
300 revs
16 mph
17 degrees of tilt

when you''''''''re feeling blue,
just say to yourself "what would BallBaggins do?"

Edited on 3/23/2010 7:42 AM

Edited on 3/23/2010 7:52 AM

 

icewall

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2010, 08:16:11 AM »
Another thing I have noticed is that 2000 abralon plus polish is = to storms polished OOB surface. This makes sense as before you apply storms compound you are already at P/Fepa 1500 grit. you only touch the ball lightly for 15 seconds with this compound, therefore it wont drastically change the underlying grit.

I personally prefer to use abralon/sia air then a gritless polish as this will give you more consistent results.

Coolerman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 680
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2010, 08:48:59 AM »
Icewall,have you seen this about  Columbia's Abranet system.This is from the article I
posted on the Ebonite Interview.

 I don't use a lot of Ebonite's products or their other lines they own,so this kind of took me
by surprise.

 Abranet® is a new type surface preparation technology used for this first time by a ball manufacturer. The Abranet® material provides a polishing technique without grit. It consists of an Aluminum oxide weave bonded to a  Abranet® is a new type surface preparation technology used for this first time by a ball manufacturer. The Abranet® material provides a polishing technique without grit. It consists of an Aluminum oxide weave bonded to a polyamide fabric. This alters the surface of the ball in a way not seen with grit pads such as the Abralon disk pads which use silicon carbide particles bonded to a fabric face When combined with a 1000 grit Abralon pad, a pattern shape of micro-surface scratches emerge which gives the result the Columbia 300 R&D team were seeking. The problem with most polished balls is they look great on the shelf, but need to be modified to fit a desired reaction. By design, polished balls tend to go very long before changing directions, on most lane conditions you have to take the shine off to get them to hook. With the Abranet® finishing process used on the new Columbia 300 Pure Swing, the end result is a polished ball that hooks sooner.polyamide fabric. This alters the surface of the ball in a way not seen with grit pads such as the Abralon disk pads which use silicon carbide particles bonded to a fabric face When combined with a 1000 grit Abralon pad, a pattern shape of micro-surface scratches emerge which gives the result the Columbia 300 R&D team were seeking. The problem with most polished balls is they look great on the shelf, but need to be modified to fit a desired reaction. By design, polished balls tend to go very long before changing directions, on most lane conditions you have to take the shine off to get them to hook. With the Abranet® finishing process used on the new Columbia 300 Pure Swing, the end result is a polished ball that hooks sooner.

charlest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24526
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2010, 08:54:05 AM »
Coolerman,

Siaair also uses aluminum oxide.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
"None are so blind as those who will not see."

Coolerman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 680
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2010, 09:06:41 AM »
Thanks Charlest.I have so many Abralon pads.wet dry sandpaper,and scotch brite pads
at home that I don't need to purchase any for another year.I drill my own equipment at my friends pro shop,but they don't use Siaair  pads.I forgot that they use aluminum oxide.I don't own any
Siaair pads because of the rest of the junk I have.Did not think about trying them until some
of the Abralon pads are gone.

qstick777

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5188
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2010, 08:53:00 PM »
Really wish there was a standard grit - I always forget that wet/dry is ANSI and Abralon/Sia Air is "P" rated.

http://home.earthlink.net/~litefrozen/downloads/bowling_grit_chart.pdf

I stick with wet/dry - it's cheap!  I can't see spending $5 for an Abralon pad that is only good for around 3 uses, not when I can get 20 9x11" sheets of wet/dry for $12-20 (depending on grit).

I do use the green scotchbrite, and I think I may have a few white pads packed away somewhere.

If 1500 wet/dry is the same as 4000 Abralon, what is 2000 wet/dry?  I picked up a couple of sheets of that today.

charlest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24526
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2010, 10:23:26 PM »
quote:
Thanks Charlest.I have so many Abralon pads.wet dry sandpaper,and scotch brite pads
at home that I don't need to purchase any for another year.I drill my own equipment at my friends pro shop,but they don't use Siaair  pads.I forgot that they use aluminum oxide.I don't own any
Siaair pads because of the rest of the junk I have.Did not think about trying them until some
of the Abralon pads are gone.


Not trying to convert you.

Just trying to put info out "on the table", for everyone's use.

--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
"None are so blind as those who will not see."

EFFEN 10

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 341
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2010, 12:37:00 PM »
"If 1500 wet/dry is the same as 4000 Abralon, what is 2000 wet/dry? I picked up a couple of sheets of that today"

I also use wet/dry sandpaper for that same reason,cost of abralon.I have used 2000 wet/dry and it's gotta be close to 5000 ab.The ball surface is very smooth and looks almost polished.
--------------------
The more I practice,the luckier I get.
The more I practice,the luckier I get.

taige690

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 154
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2010, 01:45:07 PM »
Ny gamebreaker was hard for me to read till I went to 2000 paper, I have went as high as 2500 paper but to my surprise that was a bit too much, 4000 abralon did not work for me and this particular ball. Just my experience.

Brickguy221

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9918
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2010, 02:41:00 PM »
quote:
Ny gamebreaker was hard for me to read till I went to 2000 paper, I have went as high as 2500 paper but to my surprise that was a bit too much, 4000 abralon did not work for me and this particular ball. Just my experience.  


My Gamebreaker NIB worked great for me.

When it came time to resurface, I tried 4000 Abralon and it didn't work, so like taige, I tried 2000 Abralon and that made the ball work like NIB again.
--------------------
"Whenever I feel the urge to exercise I lie down until the feeling passes away."

Brick
"Whenever I feel the urge to exercise I lie down until the feeling passes away"

Brickguy221

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9918
Re: my experience on surface changes
« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2010, 03:05:47 PM »
For whatever reason, I don't seem to get the same results on "P" grade sandpaper vs wet-dry sandpaper as the chart lists.

For example, I had a problem getting my Red Death back to or close to NIB surface. At NIB, it was 2000 grit. I assume this is "P" grade grit but don't know that for fact. When I sanded it to 500 grit Abralon and then to 2000 grit Abralon, it was weaker in oil than it was NIB......When I re-sanded to 800 grit with "P" grade sandpaper, then to 1000 grit wet-dry sandpaper and followed with 1500 grit wet-dry sandpaper, that seemed to put it very close to NIB.....Yet, according to the chart, 2000 "P" falls between 1000 and 1200 which would really be 1100 wet-dry. Yet the surface of both don't compare because the 1500 wet-dry is more duller than 2000 "P" and makes the ball perform closer to NIB than the 2000 "P".
--------------------
"Whenever I feel the urge to exercise I lie down until the feeling passes away."

Brick
"Whenever I feel the urge to exercise I lie down until the feeling passes away"