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Author Topic: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???  (Read 11900 times)

ignitebowling

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(asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« on: May 14, 2018, 06:12:20 PM »
Round two of pin up vs pin down.

Moving forward we have the Ebonite Real One (int diff .029)to try with our same bowler from the symmetric demo to see what the results look like. Looking at the affects on core numbers, tracking the ball on the lane, and the bowling balls track flare.

Less detailed then the previous article. More so to let the pictures provided tell the story. See what you think.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-DR2e3lee0Dx92o64FW4wkZb9aswt9bE
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HackJandy

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2018, 06:37:09 PM »
GJ thanks for the data.  :)
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imagonman

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2018, 11:20:41 AM »
So what does this say about dual angle layouts? VAL angles? Drill ratios etc.?
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Impending Doom

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2018, 12:24:26 PM »
Mo is going to come knocking on your door mad as Hades!!!

Love the article, man. Keep it up.
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ignitebowling

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2018, 02:22:50 PM »
Mo used the help of blueprint when the did the track flare studies on asymmetric and symmetric article a few years ago.  The information isn't new to him,  or to manufacturers.
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tkkshop

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2018, 02:30:23 PM »
is this with a plugged weight hole or nah?

 :D :D :D

good stuff
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DP3

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2018, 02:51:08 PM »
Just save your money on drilling and throw it no holes, out of a towel like Norm Duke. It's gonna face up and destroy the hole anyways.
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Impending Doom

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2018, 02:57:20 PM »
Quote from: DP3 on May 15, 2018, 02:51:08 PM
Just save your money on drilling and throw it no holes, out of a towel like Norm Duke. It's gonna face up and destroy the hole anyways.

#noholesmatter
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imagonman

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2018, 03:13:44 PM »
Quote from: ignitebowling on May 15, 2018, 02:22:50 PM
Mo used the help of blueprint when the did the track flare studies on asymmetric and symmetric article a few years ago.  The information isn't new to him,  or to manufacturers.

Then why do we continue to drink the 'dual angle is great' Kool-Aid when these 2 blueprint sims you've done show NO difference in ball positions @ 60ft. , the roll phase distance, or angle entry between VAL angles of 20* vs 70*???
As you know, according to the 'information' out there, there should be a BIG difference between those to balls as to
A) length of hook zone
B) 2nd transition - i.e. roll phase
Why do we not see that in either of the 2 sims you've recently shown us?????
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leftybowler70

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2018, 04:24:39 PM »
Quote from: DP3 on May 15, 2018, 02:51:08 PM
Just save your money on drilling and throw it no holes, out of a towel like Norm Duke. It's gonna face up and destroy the hole anyways.

Almost laughed out of my pants.  😂
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ignitebowling

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2018, 04:33:05 PM »
Quote from: imagonman on May 15, 2018, 03:13:44 PM
Quote from: ignitebowling on May 15, 2018, 02:22:50 PM
Mo used the help of blueprint when the did the track flare studies on asymmetric and symmetric article a few years ago.  The information isn't new to him,  or to manufacturers.

Then why do we continue to drink the 'dual angle is great' Kool-Aid when these 2 blueprint sims you've done show NO difference in ball positions @ 60ft. , the roll phase distance, or angle entry between VAL angles of 20* vs 70*???
As you know, according to the 'information' out there, there should be a BIG difference between those to balls as to
A) length of hook zone
B) 2nd transition - i.e. roll phase
Why do we not see that in either of the 2 sims you've recently shown us?????


Heavy friction house conditions blend out the ball reaction of many bowling balls and layouts. Next we will see how things changed going into some heavier oiled conditions.
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HackJandy

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2018, 05:15:46 PM »
Quote from: imagonman on May 15, 2018, 03:13:44 PM
Quote from: ignitebowling on May 15, 2018, 02:22:50 PM
Mo used the help of blueprint when the did the track flare studies on asymmetric and symmetric article a few years ago.  The information isn't new to him,  or to manufacturers.

Then why do we continue to drink the 'dual angle is great' Kool-Aid when these 2 blueprint sims you've done show NO difference in ball positions @ 60ft. , the roll phase distance, or angle entry between VAL angles of 20* vs 70*???
As you know, according to the 'information' out there, there should be a BIG difference between those to balls as to
A) length of hook zone
B) 2nd transition - i.e. roll phase
Why do we not see that in either of the 2 sims you've recently shown us?????

I think it might be somewhat bowler specific as to how much it matters but honestly based on everything I have seen and read over at BTM most people think it matters far more than it does.  Personally I think its more a fine tune carry type thing more than anything.  Don't even a lot of PBA guys for the most part only stick with a few layouts?  Seems like a lot of the people I have seen that insist a 1/4" in a layout matters are THS warriors spraying balls all over the place anyway.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2018, 05:21:33 PM by HackJandy »
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six pack

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2018, 09:29:17 PM »
I used to fall into this layout trap back in the day but have learned my lesson. Now I put my 1 favorite layout one all my symmetric balls and let the manufacture's intent dictate ball reaction. I even try my own interpretation on the factory cover finish. I've been pleased with the results and have focus on what really maters, my game. I really don't see a need for asymmetric balls anymore for my game either. It's all marketing IMO.
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Strapper_Squared

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Re: (asymmetric) Pin up vs Pin down???
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2018, 04:26:59 AM »
This core looks similar to others recently that have been designed to minimize removal of core material during drilling.  These help to keep starting core Dynamics (or minimize changes).  Wouldn't anticipate much of a change from these.  Radical scoop core comes to mind.

That being said - interesting results - always like to see data supporting conclusions.
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