I saw this term on a FB page and was wondering what exactly it is?  Anyone drill their balls this way or have experience with it?  Wanted insight before I decided to spend the $12.95 that he is asking.  Thanks!!

^^^^ Correct. Couldn't have explained it better.^^^^

If this fitting method is based on science and truths then shouldn't there be a more scientific method of measuring the lateral thumb pitch than "add 1/4 to 1/2" more lateral away pitch on the thumb"?

First of all, I agree that generally, the more we learn and experiment, the better we will become in discovering what works and what doesn't for each individual bowler.
This goes also for the whole science of biomechanics and how it relates to the physical game of bowling. Along the way, it is important to keep our minds open to any new concepts and see where they will take us. Credit goes to Joe for his
 efforts to learn how we can take our games to the next level.  I read his columns
with great interest and have applied many of his concepts to my game, with great results. 

However, it's important to keep in mind that his suggestions are almost
entirely geared to the "elite bowler"---to those who aspire to master the contemporary game. I am not, nor will I ever become an elite contemporary bowler
at this stage of my life. I am just north of 60 years of age and I have been a student
of this game for longer than I can remember and I still compete at a fairly high level (including PBA 50 regionals).

The mechanics of my game are not compatible with
the requirements of today's elite bowler. It is not a matter of not trying (I have).
It is simply due to the fact that the shoulder, back,hand, and arm positions of
today's elite bowler place my body in a much weaker position from the standpoint
of leverage and accuracy. From a physics standpoint ( I am a physics major, 42 years removed) they are incompatible in maximizing leverage and transferring "power" at the release point in my game.nFor most strokers, we must use less lateral and forward spine tilts, for better leverage and accuracy. This also requires different
hand measurements that allow a bowler like myself to obtain optimum wrist strength
and which allow me to take maximum advantage of a gravity-fed swing and which will allow me to transfer power at the foul line much more efficiently.

I would further argue that the excessive spine tilts and 3rd quadrant hand releases associated with today's game
do precisely the opposite of what they purport to do, which is to maximize physical
leverage. In fact, they do just the opposite. The combination of excessive lateral tilt coupled with the fingers being under and behind the ball, will almost always cause to the wrist to collapse by itself due to the fact that the ball is now at its "heaviest"
position at release and also due to hand acceleration (the hand is now going faster than the velocity caused by gravitational momentum). It is virtually impossible to for the wrist NOT to collapse in this biomechanical position . Strokers require shoulder leverage.
Leverage that is maximized by using the larger muscle groups of the back to keep the
bowling shoulder in a fixed and for the most part (erect position). Excessive lateral tilt
transfers the load to the much smaller lower (back) muscles--- a much weaker biomechanical position. This will often cause the shoulders to more easily pivot in the vertical plane and results in an EXCESSIVE drop of the shoulder at release. The end result is often a pulled shot and a "topped" release, since strokers are on the side of the ball. This is opposite of the power player (in today's game, "power" is somewhat of a misnomer, since the power in today's game comes from the body being in a weakened position, in terms of leverage as it is often defined).

I also agree that what feels comfortable statically, may not necessarily translate into
what works dynamically. At the risk of oversimplification, I will use the analogy of
a baseball hitter. Statically, it is much more comfortable for the hitter to hold his bat
directly in front of his body in his stance, with his gripping hands held belt high. This
is the position where his body and muscle symmetry feel most natural. However,
this is not where most elite hitters hold their bat. They have to raise their arms higher, and literally cock their front shoulder. Elite batters will often use different
grip pressures, bat sizes and barrel diameters depending on how they hold their bat
(statically) so that they can maximize the transfer of energy through the swing (dynamically). They know that what might feel comfortable statically does not translate into performing optimally once the swing gets going. The biomechanics of a batter's swing are necessarily different from a bowler's (swing) but many of the
principles still apply. What works for one bowler will not always work for another, due to an individual's style, physical makeup, etc. (although I would argue that a bowler's style generally dictates what biomechanics apply).

So what does all of this mean? Once again, we should never shut the door on new and innovative ideas, including the ADT method of drilling balls. In the end, I too desire a modicum of comfort, but the proof of any new idea rests with the dynamic results achieved at the pins, and this will differ depending on the bowler's style and own physiology.


 

Plus 10,000!
Good read..

First of all, I agree that generally, the more we learn and experiment, the better we will become in discovering what works and what doesn't for each individual bowler.
This goes also for the whole science of biomechanics and how it relates to the physical game of bowling. Along the way, it is important to keep our minds open to any new concepts and see where they will take us. Credit goes to Joe for his
 efforts to learn how we can take our games to the next level.  I read his columns
with great interest and have applied many of his concepts to my game, with great results. 

However, it's important to keep in mind that his suggestions are almost
entirely geared to the "elite bowler"---to those who aspire to master the contemporary game. I am not, nor will I ever become an elite contemporary bowler
at this stage of my life. I am just north of 60 years of age and I have been a student
of this game for longer than I can remember and I still compete at a fairly high level (including PBA 50 regionals).

The mechanics of my game are not compatible with
the requirements of today's elite bowler. It is not a matter of not trying (I have).
It is simply due to the fact that the shoulder, back,hand, and arm positions of
today's elite bowler place my body in a much weaker position from the standpoint
of leverage and accuracy. From a physics standpoint ( I am a physics major, 42 years removed) they are incompatible in maximizing leverage and transferring "power" at the release point in my game.nFor most strokers, we must use less lateral and forward spine tilts, for better leverage and accuracy. This also requires different
hand measurements that allow a bowler like myself to obtain optimum wrist strength
and which allow me to take maximum advantage of a gravity-fed swing and which will allow me to transfer power at the foul line much more efficiently.

I would further argue that the excessive spine tilts and 3rd quadrant hand releases associated with today's game
do precisely the opposite of what they purport to do, which is to maximize physical
leverage. In fact, they do just the opposite. The combination of excessive lateral tilt coupled with the fingers being under and behind the ball, will almost always cause to the wrist to collapse by itself due to the fact that the ball is now at its "heaviest"
position at release and also due to hand acceleration (the hand is now going faster than the velocity caused by gravitational momentum). It is virtually impossible to for the wrist NOT to collapse in this biomechanical position . Strokers require shoulder leverage.
Leverage that is maximized by using the larger muscle groups of the back to keep the
bowling shoulder in a fixed and for the most part (erect position). Excessive lateral tilt
transfers the load to the much smaller lower (back) muscles--- a much weaker biomechanical position. This will often cause the shoulders to more easily pivot in the vertical plane and results in an EXCESSIVE drop of the shoulder at release. The end result is often a pulled shot and a "topped" release, since strokers are on the side of the ball. This is opposite of the power player (in today's game, "power" is somewhat of a misnomer, since the power in today's game comes from the body being in a weakened position, in terms of leverage as it is often defined).

I also agree that what feels comfortable statically, may not necessarily translate into
what works dynamically. At the risk of oversimplification, I will use the analogy of
a baseball hitter. Statically, it is much more comfortable for the hitter to hold his bat
directly in front of his body in his stance, with his gripping hands held belt high. This
is the position where his body and muscle symmetry feel most natural. However,
this is not where most elite hitters hold their bat. They have to raise their arms higher, and literally cock their front shoulder. Elite batters will often use different
grip pressures, bat sizes and barrel diameters depending on how they hold their bat
(statically) so that they can maximize the transfer of energy through the swing (dynamically). They know that what might feel comfortable statically does not translate into performing optimally once the swing gets going. The biomechanics of a batter's swing are necessarily different from a bowler's (swing) but many of the
principles still apply. What works for one bowler will not always work for another, due to an individual's style, physical makeup, etc. (although I would argue that a bowler's style generally dictates what biomechanics apply).

So what does all of this mean? Once again, we should never shut the door on new and innovative ideas, including the ADT method of drilling balls. In the end, I too desire a modicum of comfort, but the proof of any new idea rests with the dynamic results achieved at the pins, and this will differ depending on the bowler's style and own physiology.


 

I'll try to find out what I can from the sports dept. and ortho specialist for the hands. I left these dept. four years ago and the guys in the bio mech dept may have left too. But I'll make some calls...

xray,
You're probably closer than anyone else here to have some contacts.  Find someone studying sports biomechanics and convince them to do their thesis on bowling.  Then we could have some scientific studies instead of everyone's theories.

To those that have tried it, are you changing any of your pitches other then the thumb away?

If so, what was the reasons why?

As for the Thumb away 1/4-1/2 on top f your normal specs, are you starting at 1/2"  and working back as needed?

Thanks

Is anyone else using or working with this ADT grip besides me?

I absolutely LOVE it. It may not be for everyone, but it definitely is for me.

I am beginning to bowl higher scores with it, missing less spares, getting way better pin carry, have more revs, better ball movement, hand doesn't tire as easy and etc.

The ball now fits my hand like a glove. Prior to now, I haven't liked my grip for the last 2-3 years and have spent umpteen $$$$ making changes trying to find something that I liked and would work.

I followed the instructions perfectly and the ball worked great beginning with the very first throw. I am now in the process of "fine tuning" my grip with a couple of minor adjustments of which I feel will make it better yet.

Anyhow, just wondering about others here. I can understand high average and elite bowlers sticking to what they have if no problems with their grip, but for people like myself that aren't in that class, to me it is worth a try if a person is not happy with their current grip and/or the results they are currently getting with their ball.