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Author Topic: Balance hole...Understanding  (Read 13711 times)

eugene11

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Balance hole...Understanding
« on: September 17, 2013, 05:47:28 AM »
USBC states you may not have more then one ounce of side weight.
Guess my question is. Do you have to have a balance hole to make your ball legal?
Had the local pro shop drill all my balls. All my balls have a balance hole drilled in them.
5 balls total.
One thing I have noticed is all the really good bowlers at are house (200+) don't
have balance holes drilled in there balls. Are these balls legal?
confused.........Need help on this to understand    learn me  PLEASE!!!!
« Last Edit: September 17, 2013, 07:48:01 PM by eugene11 »
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TWOHAND834

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2013, 08:51:26 AM »
Quote from: eugene11 on September 17, 2013, 05:47:28 AM
USBC states you may not have more then one ounce of side weight.
Guess my question is. Do you have to have a balance hole to make your ball legal?
Had the local pro shop drill all my balls. All my balls have a balance hole drilled in them.
5 balls total.
One thing I have noticed is all the really good bowlers at are house (200+) don't
have balance holes drilled in there balls. Are these balls legal?
confused.........Need help on this to understand    learn me  PLEASE!!!!

They should be legal as long as the CG is in the grip center somewhere.  If the CG is kicked out a ways from the grip center and there is no weight hole, then there is a possibility that the balls are not legal.  It all depends on the top weight of the ball.  If the top weight is around 2 ounces, then you can kick the CG farther out before needing a weight hole.  If the top weight was 4 ounces, then the CG would need to stay closer to the center of grip in order to keep the static weights legal.  You would not be able to kick it out as far.  EX:  a ball with 2 ounces of top weight could mean the CG can be kicked out 1.5 - 2 inches from grip center before needing a weight hole.  A ball with 4 ounces of top weight may only be able to get kicked out an inch before it needs a weight hole. 

Other factors could come into play.  But the CG placement and top weight are the two most important ones.
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Steven Vance
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storm making it rain

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2013, 08:57:26 AM »
Keep in mind also that the fingers could be drilled to different depths.  For example if you were to drill the ring finger deeper, that would take out "side weight".  So the middle finger could be drilled let's say 1.5" and the ring finger drilled at 3.5", that would take out some of the excess.

I don't believe your higher average guys have any advantage or disadvantage using a balance hole or not using one.  The balance hole placement can either strengthen or weaken reaction possibilities or even have a very minimal effect on ball reaction. 
« Last Edit: September 17, 2013, 09:03:35 AM by storm making it rain »
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spmcgivern

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2013, 09:12:54 AM »
To me, a ball driller (for the most part) shouldn't have to add a balance hole BEFORE the bowler has tried out the ball.  I find it hard to believe a competent driller can't drill a ball legally without a balance hole.  This driller is adding balance holes for what reason I wonder?  There are a few instances where he could put one in before trying the ball, but 95% of the time, shouldn't the bowler get the ball initially WITHOUT a hole?
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Aloarjr810

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2013, 11:27:20 AM »
Before you got the ball's drilled did you discuss with the driller how they would be drilled? or after they were drilled did you ask why he drilled it the way he did? why a hole was added? If so what did he tell you?

That would be the first place to start in finding out why.

Before getting a ball drilled you should discuss the drilling with the driller before drilling and ask questions if there's a change after drilling to what was discussed before drilling.
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Aloarjr810
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dmonroe814

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2013, 01:26:36 PM »
I have balance holes in all my balls except my spare.  The hole in different places in the ball, makes the ball start rolling sooner, or delays the roll for a sharper hook on the back end.  Your better bowlers are probably not using balance holes because of the way they throw the ball and the reaction they want out of them.
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kidlost2000

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2013, 06:56:41 PM »
It is funny what you read sometimes and peoples perceptions of things.

Weight holes can be added that have absolutely no affect on the ball other then balancing the static weights. They can also be added to manipulate the balls reaction for more desired results. Why people think anything other wise I am not sure. It has nothing to do with the drillers skill level, or the bowlers skill level.


A great driller and a terrible driller can drill any bowling ball and not have a weight hole. Depending on the ball, if it is symmetric or asymmetric, what the top weight is, and the pin distance are the biggest factors when laying out a ball and determining if a weight hole is needed or not. The bowlers style, span, and PAP location are also factors.

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kidlost2000

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2013, 07:05:57 PM »
Pictures are fun so lets try this.

If you have a ball with a 2" pin and lets say 2 ozs of top weight here are your options in the picture.

If you are NOTadding a weight hole you have to keep the cg in the red box.

If you ARE adding a weight hole you have expanded it to the area in the blue box.

If the ball has 3 ozs of top weight the red box is even smaller. So why limit your driller and your results for a new bowling ball if you have no reason to?
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eugene11

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2013, 08:07:56 PM »
OK,WOW. First I'm a stroker, right handed, High track.  Got back into bowling and the game has changed. New balls with cores, lanes and so on..... I bought a Lucid, Super natural, Sync, and a First blood. Different balls, different reaction. Right?
Wrong... Why, they are all drilled the same way. All have a 4" pin. Top weight I do not know. The pin is just right of my ring finger and the CG and MB are in a straight line right of the thumb hole. The guy at the local pro shop drilled all my balls with a balance hole. When I asked him about the balance hole he told me it was to make them legal. I just found it odd that the pro shop guy and his buddies all their balls don't have balance holes. they all bowl different, crankers, tweener and strokers.
If you had to drill balance holes in my balls to make them legal and none of them have balance holes what would you think?
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kidlost2000

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2013, 09:08:18 PM »
So you have all of these different bowling balls and they all roll the same is your concern or they all have weight holes is your concern? They are all drilled identical?

You think since the guy in the proshop and his "buddies" don't have weight holes there is something up?

How about a pic of all of them so we can maybe see better what your talking about.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2013, 09:13:34 PM by kidlost2000 »
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eugene11

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2013, 12:56:57 AM »
Hope I understand this right. USBC rule no more then one ounce of side weight.
So after your ball is drilled if it has more then one ounce of side weight that is when you put a balance hole. Right? If this is true, I understand cause your removing  material or weight to get it balanced and to get it to comply to USBC rules.
Correct? If your not putting balance holes there must be an advantage to this unless
the CG is in between fingers and thumb like your picture (that would make it balanced anyway). Is there an advantage not putting a balance hole if the CG is out of the red box? OH yes I think something up.
No doubt  about it.
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itsallaboutme

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2013, 05:38:19 AM »
Without putting a ball on a scale it is all speculation.  The red box in the diagram is a simplified guide for you to look at, but that is all it is, a guide.  Good luck calling him out and then getting him to weigh out his ball. 

As for your equipment, the easier the lane condition the closer in reaction all your balls will be.
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Strider

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2013, 06:08:26 AM »
I have several balls that didn't need weight holes to begin with.  After throwing them, I wanted to slightly alter the reaction, so some of them got weight holes, some of them did not.

Here are two balls drilled pretty similar.  One I added a weight hole, one I did not.  No conspiracy.  Also, if you bowl nothing but house shots, the shot itself covers up a great majority of the differences in the balls.

Sorry can't get the images to work right now.  Look at the link in my profile and look at the pictures of the Nuts Pearl and Black Widow Bite.





« Last Edit: September 18, 2013, 07:16:51 PM by Strider »
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kidlost2000

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2013, 06:43:28 AM »
Hope I understand this right. USBC rule no more then one ounce of side weight.
So after your ball is drilled if it has more then one ounce of side weight that is when you put a balance hole.

Correct no more then one once side weight, finger weight, or thumb weight. If it exceeds any of those you will add a weight hole to get it back to legal regulations.

But, You can also add a weight hole to any bowling ball to change the bowling balls reaction if desired.

If your not putting balance holes there must be an advantage to this unless
the CG is in between fingers and thumb like your picture (that would make it balanced anyway).

Some believe that having over the legal limit of side weight in the ball (say 1.5 ounces) will make the ball hook more or do something magical. This isn't actually the case. It isn't till you get close to 3 ounces of side weight that the effects are clearly visible, and not always in a good way.


Is there an advantage not putting a balance hole if the CG is out of the red box? OH yes I think something up.
No doubt  about it.

Actually the advantage would be having enough side weight to add a very large weight hole to the ball. Depending on the location this will cause the ball dynamics to change and can make the bowling ball much more aggressive.

Here is some videos to watch that demonstrate the effects of a weight hole and its location

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPJSmtr75Ts

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgDL0xqaodk

difference in side weight. Showing a right handed bowler throwing a ball with 1 3/4 ounces positive side weight compared to a ball with 1 1/2 ounces negative side weight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipSCwh-E8Fw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8vX_yoM0Q4
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…… you can't  add a physics term to a bowling term and expect it to mean something.

JohnP

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Re: Balance hole...Understanding
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2013, 08:33:58 PM »
Here's a link to an article that explains some of what can be done to modify ball reaction by adding a balance hole.  --  JohnP

http://wiki.bowlingchat.net/wiki/images/4/4a/Gradient_Line_Hand_Out.pdf
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