BallReviews

General Category => Drilling & Layouts => Topic started by: thirtyclean on October 18, 2004, 04:50:31 AM

Title: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: thirtyclean on October 18, 2004, 04:50:31 AM
Maybe someone can help me with this. A customer
brought in a Track Animal with the C.G 3 inches
left of where the PIn/MB lineup, and it had a 4
inch pin. The ball was bought online, in which I
wont mention until this question is answered. The
guy wanted it drilled strong, he is right handed,
but I think the way the ball is layed out, you cant
do much because of where the CG is. Tell me if I am]
wrong. The online retailer told the guy that nothing
is wrong with this ball. Please Advise.

Thirtyclean ...
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: Ishmael on October 18, 2004, 12:58:23 PM
First thing to do is verify the cg location.  It may be mismarked.
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: cgilyeat on October 18, 2004, 01:00:27 PM
Unless I am mistaken, (gurus, correct me if I'm wrong), since the Animal has a marked MB, the location of the CG is really irrelevant. In looking at Track's drill sheet for the Animal, all of the drillings reference the pin and the MB and ignore the CG.
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: jimensminger on October 18, 2004, 01:04:01 PM
I think that's what I'd do also, then draw a new Mb line.
--------------------
www.dynothane.com
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: Ishmael on October 18, 2004, 01:18:55 PM
cgilyeat, you are correct for the most part.  The problem is, with the cg that far offline you can really be limited in your layout options to keep the static weights legal.  With the cg way left, a stacked drill near the grip would put the cg pretty far out on the negative side for a right hander.  That could leave you with a lot of negative side weight or even require a weight hole on the negative side of the ball.
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: Goof1073 on October 18, 2004, 01:56:41 PM
It's still possible to have the CG close to the bowler's grip center and have a strong drilling depending on the bowler's PAP and Track Circumference.  Depending on the bowler's tilt he might need a MB out towards their VAL so this could work.

You really need to mess around with the layout but it's possible to make it work...just isn't the best starting point in the world!

Good luck!
--------------------
-Chris: DJ's Pro Shop : Auburn, MA
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: smitty8288 on October 18, 2004, 04:38:16 PM
what is the top weight of the ball? if it less than 2.5 you could just swing the cg with the pin under the ring finger. you will probably need a weight hole though.
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: loose5682 on October 18, 2004, 04:49:15 PM
Dyno, I think they're right, on the marked MB balls (especially the Track ones which have at least a somewhat stronger MB) the CG is really irrelevant in the layout, now with the static weights and making it legal, then there may be an issue.  Drillings with the MB in a strong position (i.e. close to the right side of the thumb) will put the CG in the negative side and like Ishmael said, would have a TON of negative side weight.  This could result in the need for a balance hole somewhere on the negative side, which gets scary depending on where the guy tracks.  It would be ideal, i think, if he's a low tracker because then wouldn't you be able to put a balance hole just to the left of the thumb?  This would counteract the CG in negative and would still allow you to put the MB in a strong position.

--OR--

You could also put the MB out towards the VAL and bring the ball down to about 600 grit.  In theory, doesn't the MB on VAL give you a more even reaction?  It may not necessarily be STRONG, but it'd still hook if you tune the coverstock properly.
--------------------
Andrew Loose
"King of Them All"
"Evolutionary. Revolutionary."
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: Wilbert on October 18, 2004, 05:11:21 PM
Tough question, but I am willing to take a try at it.  Assuming that he top is decent and you have to deal with static weights and the bowler wants the ball for oil.  I would put the mb in the strong position.  Put the pin an 1-2 inches from the PAP.  (The pin could be above the PAP.) This would put the CG in the positive/finger weight are of the drilling.  I would try to get max side with some finger weight.  I would want the ball to rev up and still finish.


o--o
--------------P
----CG------------PAP


-o--mb

Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: shimozukawa on October 18, 2004, 05:25:12 PM
This actually shouldn't be too much of a problem.
3" offline to the left means you can drill the ball VERY strong while not having to use a weight hole. Something to consider is what the customer means by "strong". Do they want a strong "look" on the backend or a strong "movement" across the lane?

If the numbers you gave are accurate, the cg-mb distance is about 5".

Depending upon where the bowler's PAP is, you might be able to do ALOT with this particular configuration. Without knowing anything other than the guy is right-handed and wants a strong ball, it's difficult to comment on anything.

Send me the bowler's specs. I'll pm you a drilling suggestion in a couple days.
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: thirtyclean on October 18, 2004, 05:25:37 PM
I found where the CG and it is marked where I thought.
It is 3 inches to the left of the PIN/MB line. It may be
irrelevant, but this guy is a cranker, and I have never
drilled a weight hole past anyones track yet. He will
sell this ball to a lefty which I believe will have more
options.
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: shimozukawa on October 18, 2004, 05:30:35 PM
Correction: It ends up being 5.08". Sorry for making an approximation.
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: Strider on October 18, 2004, 09:19:37 PM
I think danesei has the right idea.  CG left of the pin-mb line allows the mb to be moved toward the VAL without needing a huge balance hole.  Put the pin around 4" from his PAP, mb near or past the VAL depending on how early he wants it to move.

Something like:

.........O..........O.......V...
...................P..........A...
...............................L...
....................................
.................cg................
....................................
.............................mb..
...............O..................
....................................

--------------------
Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: the pooh on October 19, 2004, 02:29:01 AM
The ball you have is great for a righty,not so good for a lefty!!!
--------------------
THE POOH
Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: khamûl on October 19, 2004, 10:40:11 AM
quote:
If the customer was LH, you'd have to put the mb out in their track which is considerably weaker.


Bullpucky.

The starting top weight of the ball would be a potntial limiting factor for a lh'd drill, but you would not be "limited" to a mb in track layout.

Kudos to danesei and strider for good info...
--------------------
two of nine

Title: Re: CG 3 inches left of PAP/MB Line - Help !
Post by: Goof1073 on October 22, 2004, 08:22:07 AM
Funny thing with this thread...one of the Rules I just got in has a CG atleast 3" offset.  We will see how it goes when it gets drilled.
--------------------
-Chris: DJ's Pro Shop : Auburn, MA