Author Topic: CG on the PAP (Read 7198 times)

Juggernaut · « **on:** January 13, 2004, 08:08:51 PM »

I just bought a used granite gargoyle. The span is right for me, but it is drilled with the pin below and to the right of the ring finger and the cg is on the pap. I am a right-hander and was wondering what type of reaction to expect from this drilling. I have never thrown anything drilled like this, so any input from knowledgable drillers would be appreciated! I have a vicious particle-pin under ring, cg 1/2 in poitive and a powergroov proactive-pin above fingers,cg1 inch positive with a weighthole on pap. Thanx.
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Just call me Stan, it's much easier to say!

Edited on 1/14/2004 11:03 PM

Jeffrevs · « **Reply #1 on:** January 14, 2004, 11:10:20 AM »

pin UNDER RING,......cg on PAP....cg/axis drill.........

ROOOOOOOOOOOlllllllllllll!! moderate backend, smoooth!
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JEFF
Hello, I just lowered my track !

Juggernaut · « **Reply #2 on:** January 14, 2004, 11:17:05 AM »

OK Jeff, how early will it roll? I have a vicious particle with the pin under the ring finger and the cg shifted out 1/2. This ball has a little polish on it but it doesnt roll, it SNAPS, and hard. Is that due to the cg being closer to the grip center or is it the polish, or maybe just a combination of both?

I currently am throwing a pro-active groove, pin ABOVE fingers with cg kicked positive 1 inch with a weighthole close to my pap. How do you anticipate the gargoyle to be different than these two balls?
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Just call me Stan, it's much easier to say!

Jeffrevs · « **Reply #3 on:** January 14, 2004, 11:24:39 AM »

quote:
OK Jeff, how early will it roll?

pretty darn early...

quote:
I have a vicious particle with the pin under the ring finger and the cg shifted out 1/2. This ball has a little polish on it but it doesnt roll, it SNAPS, and hard. Is that due to the cg being closer to the grip center or is it the polish, or maybe just a combination of both?

more than likely, yes...many factors, all of them. cover to core combo, etc...tough to say.......

quote:
I currently am throwing a pro-active groove, pin ABOVE fingers with cg kicked positive 1 inch with a weighthole close to my pap. How do you anticipate the gargoyle to be different than these two balls?

It should fit right in between nicely! Medium heavy to heavy, medium to medium heavy, and medium light...makes sense to me

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JEFF
Hello, I just lowered my track !

channel surfer · « **Reply #4 on:** January 14, 2004, 05:56:40 PM »

I would imagine it would have a pretty good backend? Guess im wrong.
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charlest · « **Reply #5 on:** January 14, 2004, 06:24:07 PM »

Wrong! wrong! wrong and Wrong!

The correct answer is ... it depends. As always!!
It depends on
- the oil pattern and amount.
- the bowler's delivery: speed, axis rotation, tilt angle, track/axis point
- coverstock preparation.

the more oil the better th eskid and the final hitting power.
the more speed and the higher the ratio of coverstock grit to oil the better the overall "Look".

Guys, we have been through all this too often for such stock answers "it will roll early" to mean anything at all. "It depends" will the THE answer 99% of the time!

Nuff said.
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"Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it."

Jeffrevs · « **Reply #6 on:** January 14, 2004, 07:20:50 PM »

charlest, as usual , you are correct and can't argue much there. However....

IN GENERAL........a CG on pap drill w/ pin under the ring on a ball like the Granite would.........IN GENERAL........its' going to roll....

there are a bunch of things it depends on to be specific, but it's tough to argue that the characteristic of the ball itself, is a roll early drill.

On 55 feet of heavy oil.....it won't break for squat, but it will WANT to roll,...yes ?
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JEFF
Hello, I just lowered my track !

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #7 on:** January 14, 2004, 07:46:21 PM »

I agree with Plus 40's first comments regarding reaction.

Up the backers can virtually not make this hit, it will arc but almost on all conditions not hit.

Moderate rev high rotation side release players like myself can make this work, it will still only arc and we will probably need a reaction increasing weighthole, past the pap.

Higher axis rotation high rev players can make these work easily on strong backends.

REgards,

Luckylefty

Jeffrevs · « **Reply #8 on:** January 14, 2004, 07:49:39 PM »

all true.....

but IN GENERAL, the ball is going to WANT to roll, regardless of what it actually does on the lane, it's going to WANT to roll.

Is that a fair statement ?.........
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JEFF
Hello, I just lowered my track !

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #9 on:** January 14, 2004, 07:53:27 PM »

Completely, weightblock laid almost on side. Even if high rg drilling if weightblock seen as a rolling pin it is laning on its side and the x axis dominates.

Roll and a wide slurve without a lot of punch.

REgards,

Luckylefty

Juggernaut · « **Reply #10 on:** January 14, 2004, 10:04:34 PM »

Geez guys,(LOL) all I wanted was a general comparison to the two balls I mentioned. If you must be technical, I am a high rev(350-400) player mith medium speed(14-15mph) that has a high track and about 45 degrees of axis rotation and very little axis tilt. I am playing the powergroove proactive with my feet on the 39th board and playing it over 17 at the arrows. it gets good length and has a stong hook/flip move to the pocket.

Hand I got, accuracy I got, average last year was 216. Just never had a ball drilled like this, so didn't know quite what to look for, especially with one as aggressive as I've heard this one is.
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Just call me Stan, it's much easier to say!

T-GOD · « **Reply #11 on:** January 15, 2004, 11:28:06 AM »

jAB, It seems to me that with your revs and medium speed, a Granite Gargoyle will either hook off the lane and/or roll out for you, drilled like this or any other way for that matter. This is just my observation. =:^D

Juggernaut · « **Reply #12 on:** January 16, 2004, 08:30:33 PM »

T-GOD
You are probably right, but the curiosity of it finally got to be more than I could stand. I don't know why I've always wanted to try one of these balls (granite), I just have. I was also wondering how much polish affects this ball?

I've had balls in the past that polish just killed them completely, and others it didn't seem to affect adversely at all.
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Just call me Stan, it's much easier to say!

tenpinspro · « **Reply #13 on:** January 18, 2004, 05:57:37 PM »

Hey Jab,

This is similar to a recommended drill pattern listed on the Columbia drill sheet for the old Rage/Outrage series. It will be a little more even vs another position but should have an arcing finish. Not familar with the Gargoyle though, can't help you with total reaction there.
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Rick Leong
Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Pro Shop Staff
Vise Grip Staff

Author Topic: CG on the PAP (Read 7198 times)

Juggernaut

CG on the PAP

Jeffrevs

Re: CG on the PAP

Juggernaut

Re: CG on the PAP

Jeffrevs

Re: CG on the PAP

channel surfer

Re: CG on the PAP

charlest

Re: CG on the PAP

Jeffrevs

Re: CG on the PAP

LuckyLefty

Re: CG on the PAP

Jeffrevs

Re: CG on the PAP

LuckyLefty

Re: CG on the PAP

Juggernaut

Re: CG on the PAP

T-GOD

Re: CG on the PAP

Juggernaut

Re: CG on the PAP

tenpinspro

Re: CG on the PAP