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Author Topic: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!  (Read 3228 times)

LuckyLefty

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Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« on: August 22, 2008, 01:39:40 AM »
Well I'm sure many of our ball drillers know all this.

But I didn't so I'll post my impressions so far!

My previous with powerlift finger insert setup!

4 31/32 span on ring, 3/8 left pitch, 1/8 reverse pilot hole, 4 7/8 span on middle, 3/8 right pitch, and 1/8 reverse pilot hole.  Thumb 5/32 reverse and 3/32 left pitch(palm under lateral for this lefty!)

Now I receive a ball in trade....almost the same span...and just the old fashioned just fingerholes in a ball(3/16 bridge).  

IMMMEDIATELY I notice pain on the left side of both fingers(this would be on the right...for most of ya'll)!!  Yikes...I measure lateral pitches and they are very similar to my insert pitches above.  Say 1/4 left for my ring and 1/4 right for my middle....Yikes OHHHHHHH!

SOO....I move the pitches to the left (this would be similar to a move right for you righties!)....Now I find even at 1/8 right for my middle and 7/16 left....still soreness on the left of both my fingers!!  Yikes!

Finally I end up at 1/16 right middle finger and 1/2 left ring!

Wow.....this is like right out of the old Bill Taylor books! He recommends 0 middle finger lateral and 5/8 out lateral ring!

ALSO I note I can no longer have as long a span without the inserts(was I squeezing them shorter?).  I go 4 7/8 ring and 4 3/4 middle(basically 1/8 shorter!)  BUT with the same thumb pitch I can't get out very fast and seem to be hanging with same bevel and pitches as with inserts.  In addition I am not getting around the side of the ball like I usually do and am playing much more direct than usual(surprisingly scoring pretty well playing this simple direct lefty game!)

NExt step I add another 1/16 reverse ....now I am very near the Bill Taylor forward reverse tables for my thumb.  In addition it feels like because my fingers are more directly BEHIND the ball.....NOW I must go more lateral under palm to get a similar release as before(ie like my Coke Bottle test of 1/4 lateral left!).

This is the step I am taking next...1/4 lateral from my current 3/32 left.

Summary!!

Standard naked holes....seem to force one(at least in my case!)
Shorter span....more lateral left in the fingers, more lateral and reverse in thumb...ie sort of like the old fashioned Bill Taylor tables spans and pitches from his old but still well known drilling book.

Drilling gurus....have you found this to be true for your clients that these tweaks are needed when going from inserts to naked holes or back again?

Is the reason for the change in lateral the dramatic change in net bridge...ie with inserts near 1/2 inch finger spread and without inserts a true 3/16 to 1/4 inch bridge??

Drilling gurus....your help and comments appreciated!

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS I am finding the roll to be very good and very heavy all of a sudden....I like it!

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Open the door...see what''s possible...and just walk right on through...that''s how easy success feels..

Edited on 8/22/2008 3:33 PM
It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

 

LuckyLefty

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2008, 03:34:27 PM »
Balldrillers???  Do you have to make these changes also? When your clients switch from inserts to non inserts?

REgards,

Luckylefty
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Open the door...see what's possible...and just walk right on through...that's how easy success feels..
It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

JohnP

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2008, 10:02:13 PM »
I don't think I've ever had a customer switch that direction.  I have had one or two add finger grips to a ball drilled bare holes.  --  JohnP

J_Mac

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2008, 10:30:49 PM »
FWIW, I just went with a slugless and insertless 3 piece urethane ball as spare ball.  Left the fingers relatively sharp, and they are at the same pitches as my new specs call for.  The effective bridge is narrower though since there are no inserts in the mix.

Shot 277 last night with that ball with only a few shots being made with my new Emerald Vibe.

The only difference I notice is my thumbnail drags on the way out sometimes.  The core filler is a big textural difference from a urethane thumb slug too.
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noturcuzin

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2008, 10:34:56 PM »
I bowl with no finger grips and no thumb slug. The grips and slug make my fingers actually hurt, plus with bare holes I can get my revs up or down easier. Not sure why but with grips and slug I have a harder time controlling the ball.
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LuckyLefty

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2008, 08:23:06 AM »
John P....have you noticed having to use different pitches in general?

For people with inserts?  And people without?

I mean the pain was immediate with my old(with inserts pitches) placed into naked holes!

Stopped bowling...went home....knew I had to make a dramatic change to bowl without pain with the naked holes!

REgards,

Luckylefty
--------------------
Open the door...see what's possible...and just walk right on through...that's how easy success feels..
It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

JohnP

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2008, 11:43:03 AM »
I haven't noticed any difference, but most of the balls I drill with bare holes are drilled conventional instead of fingertip.  Was the pain you felt joint pain or friction (pressure) pain?  If it was friction pain you might need larger finger holes without the give you get from the grips.  --  JohnP

NJStroker

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2008, 12:12:54 PM »
lucky did u compensate for the forward pitch i think it is that the lifts have automatically?
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Im so glad people are brainwashed to think that TRACK sucks. And its even funnier when im carrying with my TRACK ball and they're going flat ten with their BRUNSWICK ball.

LuckyLefty

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2008, 01:31:36 PM »
it was friction pain...and was solved immediately as related above by going left!

With inserts 3/8 left ring.  3/8 right middle.
Without inserts started there...friction pain...and went 7/16 left for my ring and 1/16 right for my middle.

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS on forward reverse....from above I was 1/8 reverse pilot hole with inserts(power lifts probably 1/4 forward pitch built in) and now without inserts I've tried 1/16 reverse and 0 forward reverse with the naked finger holes.
I've had to add reverse to my thumb also to get out cleanly!
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Open the door...see what's possible...and just walk right on through...that's how easy success feels..
It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

luv2C10falll

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Re: Conversion from inserts to Naked holes in ball!
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2008, 07:51:22 PM »
Ive gone from grips to non about 4 yrs ago.I noticed more rev's an easier to change hand positions.I started drilling holes at 3/8 an 3/8",about 9 months ago I started drilling my holes 0"middle x 3/4" ring with the Clt drill.Feels really nice an comfy( also have 1/4" under).The only time I have pain is when I dont bevel the holes enough.I start with them really sharp an work from there till I get the right fit
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