Author Topic: Could The Sarge Easter Grip Be My Saviour? (Read 7864 times)

Jeff The Chef · « **on:** July 15, 2004, 07:44:37 AM »

About me:

Right handed, high rev, higher speed, inverted track, tweener with 75-90 degree axis rotation

My issue:

My combination of revs and my axis rotation (a la Pete Weber) makes any ball that I throw (except plastic) take a left turn on the backends which is very hard to control on some of the conditions I see in my area.

My question:

Would the Sarge Easter grip significantly reduce my axis rotation/smooth out my reaction? I have read info that says it is supposed to keep your hand under the ball more, hence the smoother reaction, but was wondering if anybody could offer their personal experiences or observations as to exactly how much it smoothes out one's reaction.

FWIW I am fairly versatile in my hand/finger positioning and can keep my hand under the ball more if need be - which is what I have been doing as of late - but I have found that I still get around the side of the ball fairly well even when I try not to. Would the sarge easter grip keep my hand under the ball even more?

I have tried various layouts on my equipment but they really don't do a whole lot when the backends are as fresh as they are at the houses I frequent.

I am not afraid to try new things, I just wanted some input before I plugged a ball and redrilled it. Any other ideas as to how to cut down on my entry angle would be appreciated as well. Please help! Over-reaction is killing me at my home house!

Thanks,
Chef
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

Edited on 7/16/2004 0:00 AM

Goof1073 · « **Reply #1 on:** July 16, 2004, 08:13:07 AM »

Chef...

The only input I can offer about the Sarge Easter grip is the follow article written about Robert Smith:

http://www.bowlingmembership.com/PDF/thompson/tt200109.pdf

Hard to say what it will do to you?

About you having a violent backend reaction some of this can be cured with a hand position change and going more up the back of the ball. The other issue I can see looking at your profile is that you really don't have a control ball in there. The Mojo is probably as close to one as you have...but that Power Groove has such a high spin rate that I'm not surprise you can't control it on fresh (lots of snap!!). Maybe looking into a ball like the Storm Razor Wire, Flash Point or something in that range could help. One thing to keep in mind is if the backend are really flying then a ball with some surface will cut done the reaction in friction and putting the pin closer to your axis will make the ball roll more.

Just some thoughts...
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-Chris : DJ's Pro Shop : Auburn, MA

Jeff The Chef · « **Reply #2 on:** July 16, 2004, 01:18:11 PM »

quote:
One thing to keep in mind is if the backend are really flying then a ball with some surface will cut done the reaction in friction and putting the pin closer to your axis will make the ball roll more.

Thanks for the reply, I have read that article on R. Smith before and you're right, it is hard to say what it will do for me. I do actually have a control ball in my Teal Rhino as it is drilled fairly weak, but I need to have heavy oil in the heads to use it or it wants to roll at the arrows. This is also the problem with putting say a 1000 or 1500 grit surface on a ball - I never see enough head oil that would let me get a ball with such a surface through the heads.

In regards to the Mojo and Power Groove.....they are identical in reaction (I had no idea the PG was so strong when I bought it), just the Mojo can handle a bit more oil. Maybe I could redrill or put a different surface on one of them?

I also have a NIB Teal Rhino I could drill for control if need be, but I am worried that the amount of polish needed to allow the ball to work on Med - light oil would give the ball a snappier reaction which is not what I need.

So you can see how I am getting frustrated.....for every step forward I take 3 backwards LOL. Perhaps I just need to "gently persuade" my local establishment to put out more/longer oil

Thanks again, anybody else have anything at all?
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

TheBowlingKid25 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 16, 2004, 01:24:55 PM »

Whey dont you just get a strong urethane ball?
--------------------
16 years and still going strong! 16 years old that is!

The names Warrior Princess, Xena..Warrior Princess
And why would I "saw" pins in half, THATS A WASTE OF PINS!

Jeff The Chef · « **Reply #4 on:** July 16, 2004, 01:38:57 PM »

quote:
Why don't you just get a strong urethane ball?

I have a purple urethane groove and I have the same problems with it as I do my other balls.......too snappy when polished and doesn't get through the heads sanded. I guess what I need is a polished ball that will go long and not snap. My Killer Instinct Pearl sort of fits this bill with the layout that is on it but like the Rhino it needs heavier head oil and even then it still likes to start up at 40 feet where I'd prefer it if it went about 45 - 50 feet before turning over.
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

Jeff The Chef · « **Reply #5 on:** July 16, 2004, 03:00:48 PM »

Forgot to mention that I can't get Rotogrip, Dynothane, Visionary, or Lane 1 in my area, otherwise I would look into getting a XXXL, Barrage, Sonic X series ball, or something else along those lines and drill them extremely weak.
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

Goof1073 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 16, 2004, 03:06:48 PM »

I recently drilled up a Barbed Wire for a condition fairly similar to what you described. I putt the pin about 5-3/4" from my PAP and the CG on my grip centerline. This put the put below and slight to the left of my middle finger (right handed). This ball gets down the lane pretty good because of the coverstock by the drilling make the ball controled at the break point.

As an experiment I bought a power groove off of Ebay and drilled it pretty close to pin axis. This ball is all about roll, but it still kicks off the corner more than the barbed.

About not being able to get certain companies from your local shop...just order it from BuddiesProShop or one of the other trusted online dealers. If you know your specs most dealers also offer drilling service at fairly competitive rates.
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-Chris : DJ's Pro Shop : Auburn, MA

Jeff The Chef · « **Reply #7 on:** July 16, 2004, 03:25:15 PM »

quote:
Jeff i have the exact same problems as you do. I have to much hand and the ball will never roll out. Always takes a hard turn left. The alley i bowl at is like yours also 40 years old fried up. They just got resurfaced but still they dry up fairly quick. If you do drill a ball sarge easter and it helps let me know.

I think I will go ahead and try a Sarge Easter Drill, if it doesn't work then it's only $25 that I lose which I am willing to accept. I will definitely let you know if it helps, it may be awhile before I find out though as my local center is closed for the summer and the proshop in the next town over is only open once or twice a week.

Goof - I got to thinking after reading your last post and thought, "Why not try a layout like you suggested AND a Sarge Easter Grip on the same ball?" Surely a combination of both ideas as well as me continuing to use a more "up the back" release will tame my reaction down by at least a few boards in the backend. As I said before, I am not afraid to try new things so I might as well go for the gusto and try a 2-fer-1.

Now I just need to decide which ball to sacrifice.....I am leaning towards the PG since they are cheap and easy to replace (should something go horribly awry!

)
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

Jeff The Chef · « **Reply #8 on:** July 16, 2004, 03:36:50 PM »

quote:
No offense jeff.

None taken

quote:
a power groove may be a ball that you wont get the best results from. Maybe a high end ball would give u better results. But that's your choice let me know what you think.

I really don't care which ball I use, I was just thinking that since my Mojo and PG overlap so much I would use one of them, but maybe a redrill of the Killer Instinct Pearl is in order instead. After all it is already drilled fairly weak so maybe I could get away with just moving the ring finger hole down to the conventional grip length and throw a finer grit of polish on it?

Proshop guys, what do you think? Still looking for other suggestions as well.

Thanks,
Jeff
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

Goof1073 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 16, 2004, 04:08:21 PM »

I would look around Ebay for ball to mess around with...unless you really want to mess with one that you already have? Depending on what weight you throw you can pick up various balls for under $40 shipped too. There are a ton of Shooters on their last time I checked or maybe even one of the early reactive hammers.

It's really up to you...but if you want to see the direct result of the grip change plugging a current ball would be the best way to A/B the difference.

On a side note...what kind of pitches do you currently have in the ball?
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-Chris : DJ's Pro Shop : Auburn, MA

Jeff The Chef · « **Reply #10 on:** July 16, 2004, 04:40:20 PM »

Great suggestions guys, please keep 'em coming!

Stone 9 - With regards to the axis drilling I don't know how well that would work because I think the backends are fairly dirty/spotty, I just don't notice it because my balls are turning so hard that I play for a breakpoint at 3-5 board at about 40 ft so I guess I'm really not using the backends a whole lot? (if that makes any sense). So I don't know that the backs are clean enough to allow me to use such a layout? Heck, I'll try it anyways, I have nothing to lose.

Goof - I'd much rather try to convert one of my existing balls to suit my purpose as I have too many balls as it is (most of them I got as gifts or won or got at severely discounted prices anyways so it's not like I have any worries that if they don't work out I will have wasted my money).

As for your question, I have 0" pitch on my middle finger, and 1/8" reverse on my ring finger (I think read my specs sheet right, forgive me if that doesn't make any sense as I am not well versed in proshop lingo).

Bob7 - I think that my Teal Rhino may have more reverse pitch in the fingers than my other balls as it was a used ball that I purchased and never changed because it fits fine. I don't necessarily get less side roll when I throw it (as far as I can recall), but my hand does lay on the ball a lot more comfortably so I may change my pitches just for that reason.

Thanks again and keep the ideas coming,
JTC
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

Fluxuateher · « **Reply #11 on:** July 16, 2004, 04:51:28 PM »

Jeff, sounds like you need to learn to use more than one hand position. Its kind of like a baseball pitcher, they usually have several releases so that they can throw more than one pitch. To me, bowling is the same. You need to be able to change releases from time to time to play the different conditions that you can encounter. All balls made in the last 20 years hook! Sometimes you got to tone it down with your hand.

Good luck.

Jeff The Chef · « **Reply #12 on:** July 16, 2004, 05:26:09 PM »

Fluxuateher - Believe me I've tried as many different releases and hand positions as I could. I've limp wristed it and it wouldn't turn the corner or it would roll out and leave 8-10's all day. I've tried a spinner release to delay the hook, I have had moderate success coming up-the-back of the ball but the lanes still get so dry that even this release still overreacts.

I am also limited in where I can move for my approach because of the old-style long ball returns so once plastic starts over-reacting I am scr3w3d because I can't move in any further, nor can I throw it faster than about 19-20 mph without tearing my shoulder apart. I have also employed all of Ron C's finger dancing tips in conjunction with the above-mentioned techniques but again, they only work for so long before the lanes get so dry that even they do not help to keep my ball on the right side of the pocket.

The only thing that I can do to keep my ball in the pocket for the duration of a league night is to take my plastic or weak reactive and throw it with only my thumb in the ball. Of course this results in such little turn (as my fingers are not in the ball), that it rolls out at 30 feet and lopes into the pocket. This also results in 8-10's, 7-8-10's, and all sorts of nasty back row splits.

If it were up to me I would not bowl there, but unfortunately I do not have the option of driving to the next town to bowl. I am in quite the fix and am getting frustrated. Maybe I should just buy a new plastic ball (as mine is quite damaged), and drill it with a Sarge Easter Grip LOL

Jeff_The_Slowly_Going_Insane_Chef

P.S. it is going to be about a month or so before I get anything done to my equipment so hopefully they will start putting more oil out.....but after a year of insanely dry conditions it doesn't seem like a change is on the horizon.
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http://www.ohmytrance.com

TheBowlingKid25 · « **Reply #13 on:** July 16, 2004, 05:45:37 PM »

My god dude if plastic is over reacting, you must have like massive revs!!! I think the sarge easter grip would be good, same thing robert smith uses. Why not simply try a negative drilling? Like a lefthanded label drilling
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16 years and still going strong! 16 years old that is!

The names Warrior Princess, Xena..Warrior Princess
And why would I "saw" pins in half, THATS A WASTE OF PINS!

janderson · « **Reply #14 on:** July 16, 2004, 05:59:15 PM »

quote:
Since you are experimenting, you might want to try a axis drilling on a reactive ball.

I agree with StoneNinePin on this one - get the ball to begin its move earlier on the lane and don't drill balls that are designed to go long and snap. It sounds like your style already produces all of the "go long and snap" you need! Use your choices in equipment and drills to compliment your style. Pin-on-Pap is a great way to tone down the back-end you naturally provide. The layout makes the ball want to react sooner on the lane (where the oil is) and less on the back end (where the oil is not) meaning you get more of an arc than a snap.

Your plan for testing is a good one. Grab a $20 used ball and try it on one of those first.

Keep us up to date! I'm interested in hearing what you find works for you. Good luck

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Kill the back row (or maybe this should read "make your spares, dummy")

Edited on 7/16/2004 5:54 PM

Author Topic: Could The Sarge Easter Grip Be My Saviour? (Read 7864 times)

Jeff The Chef

Could The Sarge Easter Grip Be My Saviour?

Goof1073

Re: Could The Sarge Easter Grip Be My Saviour?

Jeff The Chef

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TheBowlingKid25

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Jeff The Chef

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Jeff The Chef

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Goof1073

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Jeff The Chef

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Jeff The Chef

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Goof1073

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Jeff The Chef

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Fluxuateher

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Jeff The Chef

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TheBowlingKid25

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janderson

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