Author Topic: Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results... (Read 2078 times)

JessN16 · « **on:** May 27, 2008, 05:01:01 PM »

Two balls, very similar. Both had their strengths and weaknesses.

Ball #1
* 1/8 reverse, 1/8 away. Cut-to-cut span of 4 1/8 (middle) and 4 1/4 (ring)
* Strengths: Slightly more revs, easier to tilt, easier to impart changes in hand positions, better carry.
* Weaknesses: Had to use more grip pressure, not as consistent in hitting my mark, harder to shoot right-side spares.

Ball #2
3/16 forward, 0 lateral. Cut-to-cut span of 4 1/16 (middle) and 4 1/8 (ring)
* Strengths: Much easier to hold the ball, easier to go up the back of the ball, easier to shoot extreme left- and right-side spares, more accurate, easier to project downlane.
* Weaknesses: Fewer revs, span felt strange (and too short), very difficult to tilt/loop the ball consistently, carry seemed to suffer.

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In other words, a mixed bag. I'll probably keep playing around with things but I can tell it's going to take some trial and error. The next one I do, I won't shorten the span. That would tell me if I could drop-plug all my current stuff if I needed to, or whether I'd have to fully plug the thumb hole and move it up 1/16. I also need to know whether I should stop drilling the middle finger span shorter than the ring because it felt really strange.

One thing I can say is that I tested these balls side-by-side, switching back and forth and had no problem going from one pitch to the other. So if anyone out there is scared to do it for fear they're going to rip their thumbs off, I wouldn't worry.

The two best things about the forward-span ball were clearly comfort and the ability to get behind the ball. For playing up the boards, I found it tough to replicate the same shots with the same accuracy using the reverse-pitch ball.

But if I needed to tilt it big and go around it, it was practically impossible to do so with the forward pitch ball. Maybe that will just take some practice.

Jess

Edited on 5/28/2008 1:07 AM

a_ak57 · « **Reply #1 on:** May 28, 2008, 05:27:17 PM »

Ron Clifton would tell you that a person has to learn how to throw forward pitch. My original pitch used to be 1/4" reverse. Even moving to 1/8" and then 0, I found the same thing you did in terms of results. The common factor was that I always threw the old pitch ball better than I used to. Eventually, after visiting Ron, he taught me how to throw a ball with forward (i.e. no gripping), and now I throw 1/2" and feel I could go more (although I'm not really sure it'd do anything for me).

And, people will yell at me for this, but don't worry about the span. I've never understood why people feel they must change their span when changing thumb pitch, unless it's wrong to begin with. If you move an 1/8" forward, but shorten your span, you're basically just canceling out the forward move and therefore will have the same feel you did before. Think of Bill Taylor's fitting chart, the whole 63 degree thing. In order to keep the same feel by going to a shorter span, you have to add (comparatively) more forward. So if you're trying to get the feel of forward, why would you shorten your span? My friend has a 4 3/4" span or so, and he's currently at 3/4" forward, and didn't adjust span at all.
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- Andy

Lillen · « **Reply #2 on:** June 01, 2008, 06:59:00 AM »

quote:
I've never understood why people feel they must change their span when changing thumb pitch

I've gone from 1/4 reverse to 1/4 forward (a few steps in between) without changing my span and it works for me..
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www.teamtuba.se

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LuckyLefty · « **Reply #3 on:** June 01, 2008, 08:04:15 AM »

I think your observations on here are very good.

I hope I am remembering this accurately....it seems some really good bowlers on here(Jim Emsminger) if I remember right would use his reverse and right thumb pitch for league top hats, and his closer to 0 lateral and 0 forward reverse for more testy shots where one must split boards!

To me as a former golfer this makes so much sense.

In the summer when the courses were hard I would often end up with a slightly less strong grip(less knuckles showing for less rotational potential of my forearms in the swing). This would we result in a higher softer landing fade flight (more control). When the courses were softer and I wanted maximum length I went to a stronger grip(more knuckles on the left hand showing).

I believe these ideas make so much sense in bowling. More right lateral for the righty = both more around the side of the ball and more holding power leading to less need for forward. Theoretically should lead to creating more area in a top hat.

Along these lines I have noted two newer bowlers(two to three year) in my area creating tremendous area on top hats(I thought each was a no thumber based on release). One has an 837 to his credit and the other numerous 760s to his credit.

Both upon further examination have about 5/16 right pitch and over 1/4 reverse on spans of about 4 1/2 to 4 3/4. With this setup their sum seems to come up quite early while fingers seem to stay in forever....

No thumb look with thumb in ball seems to equal tremendous area on a top hat!

Just some thoughts!

REgards,

Luckylefty

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Open the door...see what's possible...and just walk right on through...that's how easy success feels..

mrbowlingnut · « **Reply #4 on:** June 05, 2008, 02:36:20 PM »

Went from 1/8 reverse and 1/8 left lateral to 1/4 forward and 0 laterals, shortened just the ring 1/8 of a inch. Middle was unaffected after the change the finger pads are still making good contact and the fingers look correct in the finger holes.

I find it gives an extra split second it actually feels like forever now, I am an up the boards guy that is pretty accurate so this makes me even more so. I gained revs because the total trick is to relax your hand fully now, trust your grip and watch the rev rate will go up. I would put me in 350 rpm area now from 320 or so, if i try too hit the ball it hooks less.

But if i relax watch out the midlane and backend move increase 5-6 boards or more easily, plus more accuracy and stuff on the ball.

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #5 on:** June 18, 2008, 09:03:26 AM »

Dead,

And you know you are right!

Again as I stated adjusting ones grip for different conditions and shots is the most natural thing in the world for golfers!

REgards,

Luckylefty
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Open the door...see what's possible...and just walk right on through...that's how easy success feels..

Author Topic: Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results... (Read 2078 times)

JessN16

Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results...

a_ak57

Re: Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results...

Lillen

Re: Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results...

LuckyLefty

Re: Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results...

mrbowlingnut

Re: Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results...

LuckyLefty

Re: Experimented with forward in the thumb today, results...