Author Topic: Is this a bad layout for all pearls? (Read 3353 times)

Ragnar · « **on:** February 02, 2005, 12:54:17 AM »

I had a Silver Streak Pearl drilled up a while back and hadn't had a chance to throw it until last night. Didn't like the result much. Pin about 1/4" on the negative side (ie, left of middle finger), CG about 1 1/2" from grip center, towards PAP. In the past I've used this layout a couple of times on reactives and it allowed me to play inside, pretty straight and retain energy quite well. This ball seems to lose energy and demand that you really stuff it in the hole to carry. Very little room for mistakes - a board or so tight and it was nose and that much wide would get back to the hole, but leave weak 10's, 7's, 8 - 10's, etc. Oh, yeah, lane was about 39 feet of pretty heavy oil with a hard wet/dry block at about 8 and super strong back ends. My best shot seemed to be standing about 23, 8 at the arrows. I have a notion that this ball and layout might be more successful on drier mids. Unless someone can convince me not to I think I'm going to re-drill with the pin just right of or above the ring finger, CG in the same place. Thoughts?
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"A little sincerity is a dangerous thing, and a great deal of it is absolutely fatal." Oscar Wilde
Ragnar sure likes to throw his purdy Uranium Buzzsaw.

Edited on 2/2/2005 10:07 AM

Edited on 2/2/2005 10:53 AM

loose5682 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 02, 2005, 08:59:56 AM »

Um...unless this is an overseas ball or a new release, I'm not too familiar with the Silver Streak Particle Pearl (trust me, if I was, I'd have drilled 3 by now!) I know of the Silver Streak Pearl (reactive) and the Silver Streak Particle (solid) but no particle pearl that i'm aware of.

That being said, with that pin placement on a particle ball it's going to want to go REAL long, but the particle shell is going to make it want to bleed energy earlier. Two contrasting things, while that works sometimes, not always, and I think this may be one of those times where it doesn't work so well.
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Andrew Loose
"King of Them All"
"Evolutionary. Revolutionary."

Ragnar · « **Reply #2 on:** February 02, 2005, 09:11:04 AM »

Andrew, you are correct, it's a Silver Streak Pearl. The particle somehow snuck in there whilst I was waking.
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"A little sincerity is a dangerous thing, and a great deal of it is absolutely fatal." Oscar Wilde
Ragnar sure likes to throw his purdy Uranium Buzzsaw.

loose5682 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 02, 2005, 09:16:04 AM »

Perhaps this ball is retaining so much energy that it's not getting a chance to release it? I think you're right in the assumption that it would be better for drier mids, or maybe a little scuff to the cover, but that would defeat the purpose of the pin placement.
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Andrew Loose
"King of Them All"
"Evolutionary. Revolutionary."

charlest · « **Reply #4 on:** February 02, 2005, 09:21:25 AM »

So, Rags, is this about resin pearls, particle pearls, or particles???
And, no, you can't drill any one of those classes all the same.

Ragnar · « **Reply #5 on:** February 02, 2005, 09:58:23 AM »

quote:
So, Rags, is this about resin pearls, particle pearls, or particles???
And, no, you can't drill any one of those classes all the same.

It's a resin pearl. And I'm more convinced than ever that the layout is entirely wrong for the condition; perhaps wrong in any event. So, I'm going to redrill it either pin by ring, cg out or stacked.
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"A little sincerity is a dangerous thing, and a great deal of it is absolutely fatal." Oscar Wilde
Ragnar sure likes to throw his purdy Uranium Buzzsaw.

Phillip Marlowe · « **Reply #6 on:** February 02, 2005, 10:04:54 AM »

I've reconsidered. Negative layouts should not be used on particle pearls or particle balls because they bleed energy needed to sustain the arc. I have also tried negative layouts on pearls and found that the layout creates too much length and without the flare creates a fluffy hit from the inside. A pearl ball drilled this way is, for me, useable only out where it is very dry, with angle created by coming from the outside to the hole.
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"I don't mind if you don't like my manners. I don't like them myself. They're pretty bad. I grieve over them on long winter evenings."

Ishmael · « **Reply #7 on:** February 02, 2005, 12:49:06 PM »

quote:
I have also tried negative layouts on pearls and found that the layout creates too much length and without the flare creates a fluffy hit from the inside.

This is exactly what I've seen. Even with above average revs, I just can't get any hit with negative layouts. (Maybe my ball speed is too high?)

charlest · « **Reply #8 on:** February 02, 2005, 03:52:45 PM »

Rags,

So much depends on the ball, the Core and its RG differential, Your "hand" and the lanes you are on (oil & surface) that you just can't make that generality.

A ballreviews guy, NextLevelPS, has enough "hand" that his Triple X Factor drilled with the pin above his ring finger works great for him. I've seen him throw it.

I have a couple of balls, one pearl and one solid right now, with the pin above the center of the bridge, which places the pin 5.5" from my PAhP. Both work well for me, but I no longer dare go further towards the middle finger than the center of the bridge. Like Phillip MArlowe, I did that with one ball and while it tamed it down nicely, it was of far too limited a use for me to keep it.

You really have to judge each ball independently, for the use for which you intend to use it. Then drill it suitably. There are more than a few people who start off drilling ALL balls with the pin above the ring finger. I think that's ... unintelligent, to put it as kindly as possible. Unless you're playing or testing a ball or an unnkown ball, you buy a "ball reaction", you don't buy a ball. (OK, getting off the soap box now.)

RSalas · « **Reply #9 on:** February 02, 2005, 04:03:23 PM »

I have a really dumb question. How are you all defining the term "negative layout?" By this term, do you mean layouts where the *pin* is left of the centerline, the *CG* is left of the centerline, or both?
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"Dispensing conventional wisdom to a fingertip world."

Horrid in Doubles, torrid in Singles...
...that's The Curse of Dusty.

Strider · « **Reply #10 on:** February 02, 2005, 04:10:51 PM »

Ron Clifton drilled up a ball (solid particle, but maybe the same problem) like your SSP. Putting the pin that far away from your PAP greatly reduces your flare potential. The ball rolls over the same spot the whole way down the lane. You end with a slick track that might be making it's own "carrydown".

To get more length and recovery, I put the pin very high on my SSP. It's probably 3" over my fingers, but closer to my VAL so it's still about 4.5" from my PAP.

Also how many games on the ball? Original box finish? Mine was very flaky OOB. Once the surface broke in a bit, the ball settled down a lot. It's now one of my favorites. I get to pick it back up tonight. While home for a few days, I took 4 balls to my local proshop to redrill with my new span and pitches.
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Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive

Leftyhi-trak · « **Reply #11 on:** February 03, 2005, 02:40:17 PM »

With such a layout and given the wet/dry you spoke of i would believe as you hinted around that when the ball finally starts to read the lane it is already in the dry. Like Loose said maybe drawing a little surface might help or bringing it(pin) back to a more flare area which will also make it read earlier. I had a Nighthawk with about the same layout (pin over middle finger) and loved it but being a solid i would also bring the surface down to 800 then polish it up. It worked great for shorter shots inside or right down the gutter.

Bluff · « **Reply #12 on:** February 05, 2005, 10:39:53 AM »

quote:
Rags,

So much depends on the ball, the Core and its RG differential, Your "hand" and the lanes you are on (oil & surface) that you just can't make that generality.

A ballreviews guy, NextLevelPS, has enough "hand" that his Triple X Factor drilled with the pin above his ring finger works great for him. I've seen him throw it.

I have a couple of balls, one pearl and one solid right now, with the pin above the center of the bridge, which places the pin 5.5" from my PAhP. Both work well for me, but I no longer dare go further towards the middle finger than the center of the bridge. Like Phillip MArlowe, I did that with one ball and while it tamed it down nicely, it was of far too limited a use for me to keep it.

You really have to judge each ball independently, for the use for which you intend to use it. Then drill it suitably. There are more than a few people who start off drilling ALL balls with the pin above the ring finger. I think that's ... unintelligent, to put it as kindly as possible. Unless you're playing or testing a ball or an unnkown ball, you buy a "ball reaction", you don't buy a ball. (OK, getting off the soap box now.)

Hey what you mean buy ball reaction. You buy the ball !

don't your like some color of some ball ?

Man I got to get that you

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Honestly I got a lot of balls. Not kidding.

Author Topic: Is this a bad layout for all pearls? (Read 3353 times)

Ragnar

Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

loose5682

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

Ragnar

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

loose5682

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

charlest

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

Ragnar

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

Phillip Marlowe

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

Ishmael

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

charlest

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

RSalas

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

Strider

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

Leftyhi-trak

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?

Bluff

Re: Is this a bad layout for all pearls?