BallReviews

General Category => Drilling & Layouts => Topic started by: DaveW on January 12, 2010, 07:51:54 AM

Title: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: DaveW on January 12, 2010, 07:51:54 AM: I see a lot of guys struggle to keep the ball off the nose. Many people don't want to put a weaker drilling on a ball they forked out a lot of money for, so that it'll handle the oil when they see it. However they then struggle with too much reaction when they don't.

I know there are some exotic ways to keep a ball mellow, but tell me, what has worked reliably for you, that you would consider your favorite drilling as a velocity-challenged / rev-dominant bowler?

I'll chime in later .. fire away.
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Dave W - Seismic Staff
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Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: the pooh on January 12, 2010, 05:35:54 PM: I have had some success with asymmetric equipment by keeping the mass bias long, like 5" to 6 1/2". This usually equates to a drilling angle of between 70* and 90*. Often, my mass bias ends up in the thumb or slightly left of it. I don't do well with mass bias positions in the forward roll or max early revs positions, unless I am on a flood. Pin lengths from 4" to 6" have worked well. My best val angles seem to be 40* and up, though I can use pin under drillings if I keep the pin distance longer(in the 4 1/2 to 5 1/2 range). Most important for me, is to not get the mass bias too close to the pap.
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the pooh
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Xcessive_Evil on January 12, 2010, 06:56:11 PM: I don't consider myself velocity challenged, but I am rev-dominant. A layout I'm really starting to enjoy is the 78* 4.5 68*. I've tried this layout on a Mars, Kinetic Energy, and most recently a Virtual Gravity a buddy no longer wanted. With that said, the MB is right off of my thumb and the pin below my ring finger.

With this layout, regardless of ball, I'm much further right to start and my movements left aren't as drastic.
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Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: kidlost2000 on January 12, 2010, 06:59:12 PM: I think you have to take it all in to consideration. I wouldn''t buy grit and expect great results in drier conditions. Most bowlers today have no shortage of bowling equipment. At least 2 bowling balls. So why not have one be a milder to medium pearl with a medium aggressive pattern. Plus you can usually get that ball at a much cheaper price then the high performance bowling ball.

You want to make sure you have a ball to match the condition it was intended for.

Now you can easily adjust the surface of a bowling ball for a more desired result. I think surface prep will be the better answer then a specific drill pattern. You can always change the surface as needed, the drill pattern however isn''t as easy.

Polish in the right amount can turn anything into a spare ball or something else in between.
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" men lie, women lie, numbers don''t "

Edited on 1/14/2010 5:14 PM
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: DaveW on January 13, 2010, 05:43:40 AM: I''m with you pooh.

My benchmark ball/layout is the 900 Global Mark Roth Limited Edition (2.48, 0.040, Solid S50 cover), wet sanded to 1500-2000 with 3M Finesse-it polish.

Layout would be 100 x 4.125 x 25.

We started using this drilling on 5" pin-cg blems with high top weight to keep them legal, and have just revisited it recently with good success. Much less midlane torque and more retention of energy than with the MB and inch or 2 closer to the PAP.

I would tend to lay equipment out leaving finger and positive side weight, so that in addition to deep finger holes, a flare reducing balance hole can be used if necessary.

You get a fast revving, but not at all jumpy reaction, and the ability to polish the cover to a high finish without over/under.

Id be interested to see some videos and hear feedback if anyone has success with mb-pap angles of 110+.
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Dave W - Seismic Staff
www.seismicbowling.com (http://"http://www.seismicbowling.com/")
Seismic YouTube Channel (http://"http://www.youtube.com/user/SeismicBowling") - subscribe now!

Edited on 1/13/2010 6:45 AM
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Gunny on January 13, 2010, 07:10:19 AM: my favorite layout is 60Â°x4.5"x35Â°. Being a high tracker, stuff I drill with
long pin to paps and long mb to pap tend to be way skid snap. So the most I go
is 4 3/4" to 5" pins to pap. I've learned to use more hand positions to
give/take away revs as needed. I found that if the ball is drilled somewhat
strong, that I can still take hand out of it and still have a good roll on the
ball, creating the angle I need to carry.
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: JohnP on January 13, 2010, 10:14:56 AM: I choose weak balls and keep them polished. 5 - 5 1/2" pin to PAP with the cg aligned to give positive side and finger weight for use of a balance hole if necessary. Pin either just above or just below finger height. -- JohnP
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Dave_in_Rio_Rancho on January 14, 2010, 10:53:11 AM: For me, a polished strong ball with the pin above the fingers (5.5" from PAP) on the midline with the MB between the thumb and the VAL in the strong position (4.25" from PAP). Very controllable ball with good carry - especially from an inside line.

Edited on 1/14/2010 11:56 AM
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: JohnP on January 14, 2010, 03:34:40 PM: quote:
For me, a polished strong ball with the pin above the fingers (5.5" from PAP) on the midline with the MB between the thumb and the VAL in the strong position (4.25" from PAP).

I think Dave means on the centerline instead of midline. -- JohnP
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Dave_in_Rio_Rancho on January 14, 2010, 06:38:18 PM: Thank you John, I did misspeak/type - centerline it was

From the intersection of the centerline and midline, my PAP in 5 1/8" over and 5/8" up.

Getting older and my ball speed is dropping off however the revs are still there - not always to my benefit

"For me, a polished strong ball with the pin above the fingers (5.5" from PAP) on the CENTERLINE with the MB between the thumb and the VAL in the strong position (4.25" from PAP). Very controllable ball with good carry - especially from an inside line."

This drilling does work well for me - just be careful not to get the MB too near the VAL, or past it, unless you really do want a hook set reaction.

Edited on 1/14/2010 7:49 PM
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Bluff on January 15, 2010, 11:28:24 PM: I use a secret agent drill 6 x 4 with tons of turtle wax
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"A man with no skills can be taught. A man with no honor, has nothing."
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: JohnP on January 16, 2010, 10:15:18 AM: One of the new urethane balls with dynamic cores could give you a more controlled reaction. The Storm Natural is one example. -- JohnP
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: LotsaBalls on January 16, 2010, 11:58:11 AM: For some customers I have gone 105 to 110 with a stronger pin distance around 4 1/4 to 4 1/2 with good success. I really like this on strong pearls, it get length and is very controllable on the back.
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: notsohotshot on January 16, 2010, 03:30:23 PM: What about someone like me that has PAP 5.5 rt up .75 and ball sp around 14.5MPH and 350 revs. I can't seem to find anything that will make a decent corner without overreacting.
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Mike Austin on January 17, 2010, 09:14:39 PM: For a longer/smoother reaction on medium type lanes, I like the pin 5 to 5 1/2 from PAP, under the fingers, MB still strong around 70 degrees. Use a big pin out if possible, and low weight hole.

This will look kinda funny, pin will be left of my ring finger, CG above right of my thumb hole, or around the thumb. Pins above/left of fingers store too much energy and jerk too much down lane.

Really good length with a smooth reaction down lane, won't change direction very fast. Adjust surface to taste. A little shine will get more recovery, some balls can be "too" smooth. Fury Pearl was soooo wonderful like this. The nuts for the house shot too.
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Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Bluff on January 18, 2010, 12:58:09 PM: quote:
What about someone like me that has PAP 5.5 rt up .75 and ball sp around 14.5MPH and 350 revs. I can't seem to find anything that will make a decent corner without overreacting.

you need to throw ball faster no need for new equ
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"A man with no skills can be taught. A man with no honor, has nothing."
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Cobalt Bomb on January 18, 2010, 01:02:39 PM: quote:
What about someone like me that has PAP 5.5 rt up .75 and ball sp around 14.5MPH and 350 revs. I can''t seem to find anything that will make a decent corner without overreacting.

I have similar specs and have had success with symmetrical balls 6" pin to pap, 3" from the VAL(pin up). Usually with light surface (4k no polish).

Edited on 1/18/2010 2:03 PM
Title: Re: ITT - Rev Dominant Players post their favourite layout.
Post by: Dave_in_Rio_Rancho on January 18, 2010, 03:31:26 PM: ''Bluff

"notsohotshot wrote:
What about someone like me that has PAP 5.5 rt up .75 and ball sp around 14.5MPH and 350 revs. I can''''t seem to find anything that will make a decent corner without overreacting."

you need to throw ball faster no need for new equ''

I can''t speak for notsohotshot but this older bowler doesn''t have a lot speed adjustment left - and arthritis has left fewer release adjustments - so, what used to be a bowler adjustment is now a ball change

Edited on 1/18/2010 4:35 PM