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Author Topic: Negative Pin Label?  (Read 8107 times)

Shermster

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Negative Pin Label?
« on: March 24, 2010, 08:19:11 AM »
I was watching this video of the Dynamo X2 and Tony's drill type states 'negative pin label'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qANgM1Oz6yU

What's the benefit of a negative layout? His ball reaction seems to be pretty nice.
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JustRico

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Re: Negative Pin Label?
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2010, 08:39:10 AM »
Uhm DJ, we in this conversation know what the reference was. But AGAIN, there is no such thing as a negative pin. It is pin to PAP...nothing more, nothing else. Grip is irrelevant to layout other than changing the core dynamics.
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JohnP

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Re: Negative Pin Label?
« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2010, 11:58:34 AM »
quote:
You are correct....whatever the distance from the PAP to cause inverted flaring or back ward flaring, would be a negative pin.


I STRONGLY disagree with this terminology, it is very confusing to most bowlers and even many drillers.  A ball with a 7 1/2" (for example) pin to PAP is simply that, not a "negative pin".  Yes, the track's bowtie will be located such that the flare is in the opposite direction from normal layouts.But so what, how does that make it "negative"?  --  JohnP
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Shermster

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Re: Negative Pin Label?
« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2010, 04:04:03 PM »
^ So being 7 1/2" basically means....a long azz distance from PAP? lol

Why would one need such a layout? Something that's smooth and easy to control? or to stir-up controversy? haha
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kidlost2000

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Re: Negative Pin Label?
« Reply #19 on: March 25, 2010, 04:22:38 PM »
Long story short people see the pin on the other side of the center grip line and they say it is negative.

Maybe because we do the same for static weights. positive and negative.

It is all relative to your PAP.
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…… you can't  add a physics term to a bowling term and expect it to mean something.

JustRico

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Re: Negative Pin Label?
« Reply #20 on: March 25, 2010, 09:56:46 PM »
A 7 1/2" pin to PAP, I would see that as a 6" pin from the NAP. You can disagree with whatever you wish....it is what it is.
And of course my question would be why would you need a 7 1/2" pin to PAP. Secondly, if you use the original Patrick Girard layout, which is a 5 1/2" pin from the NEGATIVE Axis Point 1 1/2" below the thumb to control the bowtie. It is PLAIN and SIMPLE.

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JohnP

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Re: Negative Pin Label?
« Reply #21 on: March 26, 2010, 04:34:25 PM »
I don't know any reason to lay a ball out with a 7 1/2" pin to PAP, I used that strictly as an extreme example.  The reason I disagree with the terminology "negative pin" is that it's (mis)applied frequently to any layout with the pin on the side of the centerline that's away from the PAP, no matter what the pin to PAP distance is.  So if I lay a ball out for a customer who has a 4" horizontal PAP component and want to use a 5 1/2" pin to PAP distance I know someone's going to tell him I gave him a ball with a negative pin.  And we all know he's going to come back to me ranting about how I layed his ball out wrong, no matter how it performs for him.  --  JohnP
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