A. many of the touring pros have very neutral angles in their thumbs to allow versatility

B. Tish has away pitch and always has...and I've known her since we about 16

 

Just Rico,

 

I am surprised on Tish Johnson but my friend who very appropriately uses away pitch also moves his arm out towards the gutter also.

 

I wonder what her coke bottle says..

 

Regards,

 

Luckylefty

PS Just...would you say that many of the pros you are observing with these neutral set of pitches are short of the old style Full Span? 

Just to add to this I (along with 2 others) am in the process of writing a book in regards to today's game and fitting plus drillings....it addresses all of this as well as more.

 

You have commented that what we are seeing or using in today's fitting as politically correct is more of a correction of older theories. You can compare to other sports but, quite simply put, when you are carrying an object weighing up to 16lbs and applying a force that can create 3-4 G's where the object is now between 48-60lbs....fitting is to be used for a static as well as dynamic fit. As stated before you are fitting a bowler for what their hand may dictate as well as what their body dictates along with how a person swings the bowling ball. You want to keep going back to the coke bottle test...quite honestly there are so many more variables than simply or merely that. Much more than can be touched on here....and you can call it lateral in or out....it is an angle pure and simple and every bowler has a zero angle that accomodates their hand & span.

not sure what questions haven't been answered

XXX,

 

Suitcasing?

 

Just..

 

.I'm sure in your book you will have many more concrete suggestions to match fit with armswing, span, hand etc....

 

Regards,

 

Luckylefty

For instance I have a "coke" bottle measurement.   Everytime I use it, I end up having my thumb go numb and it causes a dead feeling with some pain that runs from my thumb to my shoulder.   The grip feels great, the results after the release, not so great.

 

The way I release the ball, does not correspond to the book fit.   Now as a pro shop guy, would you just keep telling the bowler to deal with it, because it's correct  or would you get down to the root of the problem and fit the ball correctly for the bowlers release?

 

 

LL,

 

Do you really go up to every good bowler in your area and ask them 20 questions about their fit and pitches and how their coke bottle test went?  Isn't that a little overly anal?  Heck, most of the people I know, including the top bowlers, couldn't even tell you if they had forward or reverse in their thumb.  They may have had similar tests done some time in the past, but the pro shop guy kept track of that and any subsequent changes, not the bowler himself.

Ummm,

 

Wow,,,

 

XXX you sound great and like a professional driller.  As to pain,,,I've never ended up with a bowler having it after applying Bill Taylor rules(Including Coke bottle test), Mo Pinel bevel tips(very important), and watching release and thumb wear and ball roll  and making slight tweaks off above.

 

Someone on watching everyones pitch and grip....I like watching the very best, the very worst in all form sports in general.  To me it is interesting why people are very good and very bad, fun.  For you it would be anal! 

I also watch those who ask me and say...things like..."it hurts", "it hangs up", "I can't turn it", and "Would you help me?".  Usually they get better.

 

Just Rico, on details and what you are going to explain.  It sounds like many of the details will be in your book.  I'm convinced it will have in it....ie lateral pitch....when a specific case is discussed it will say more than...."it's just another angle".  That is why you are writing a "Book", to expand on that idea...I am sure.  I do look forward to it because it has been a long time since Bill Taylor wrote his classic.  I was fortunate to meet him several years ago while he expanded on the ideas in that book personally.  I have also been flattered to discuss with Mo Pinel many of his ideas on fit.

 

To me it is a fascinating subject and I liked some of the discussions above on hard hand, soft hand, etc.  That was informative and enjoyable....Thanks.

 

Regards,

 

Luckylefty

PS I just looked at some of the pictures and graphs in Bill Taylors book and I saw many different release positions discussed, put in photos, and then illustrated in his pictures of ball, fingers and tracks.  Way back in 1974 he sure seemed to discuss a lot more than the classic what I used to call "Suitcase" which I remember a teeny bit as what we also call 90 degree axis rotation or I think as Bill Taylor called 3 O'clock.