I only average between 170 and 185 depending on the house/shot, but 2nd league game with the Hater, rolled a 252, and have had some games in the 220’s and 230’s too. But it’s very unpredictable. Sometimes it’s a hook monster and sometimes it manages to find an oil spot at the worst time.

Am honest about my limitations, but something about the Hater makes it very unpredictable and unforgiving.

Has anyone else had this trouble with the Hater or another ball?


Most of my other/older equipment is much easier to read. I may not be happy with the results, but I’m not constantly surprised and irritated with them, even when my accuracy is off.

Without knowing my specs you are spot on with your assessment.

Am a senior citizen and have always been speed dominant or rev challenged, and even your comments on the lane conditions are correct.

Bought the ball primarily for use on heavier oil patterns and not for the house I bowl at most often which is a very dry house shot. And it’s been more consistent at two other houses with heavier patterns, but even there it’s the unpredictability that drives me crazy.

Have other equipment that is aggressive and a challenge to throw if there’s not enough oil, but they’re not unpredictable. When using those balls, am very aware that they don’t match up with the current condition and I’ll get what I get. High reward/hi risk.

Actually considering changing the surface to get more length from it, but would that require periodic maintenance of the change? I.e. will it gradually revert back to the current surface over time?

Also thinking because it’s a Hybrid and my other balls are either pearls or solids, that THAT is my problem. I recall having a similar issue with two other balls even as they aged. A Brunswick “HPC-C” and a “Trauma Emergency” (can’t recall the brand), which was a Partical Ball.

Biggest mistake is I bought this ball cause I liked the name (“Hater), which obviously I won’t ever do again 

Lesson learned.

Without knowing my specs you are spot on with your assessment.

Am a senior citizen and have always been speed dominant or rev challenged, and even your comments on the lane conditions are correct.

Bought the ball primarily for use on heavier oil patterns and not for the house I bowl at most often which is a very dry house shot. And it’s been more consistent at two other houses with heavier patterns, but even there it’s the unpredictability that drives me crazy.

Have other equipment that is aggressive and a challenge to throw if there’s not enough oil, but they’re not unpredictable. When using those balls, am very aware that they don’t match up with the current condition and I’ll get what I get. High reward/hi risk.

Actually considering changing the surface to get more length from it, but would that require periodic maintenance of the change? I.e. will it gradually revert back to the current surface over time?

Also thinking because it’s a Hybrid and my other balls are either pearls or solids, that THAT is my problem. I recall having a similar issue with two other balls even as they aged. A Brunswick “HPC-C” and a “Trauma Emergency” (can’t recall the brand), which was a Partical Ball.

Biggest mistake is I bought this ball cause I liked the name (“Hater), which obviously I won’t ever do again 

Lesson learned.

The hybrid style cover has nothing to do with it.  It is the fact that the ball is likely too strong for the condition.  Even if you polish it, the strength is still there.  It is just the hook shape is going to be different.  It might make the ball more playable on the house condition or it might not.  But it doesnt hurt to try and see what happens.  As a former PSO; as you being a senior, I would never recommend a higher end asym unless your ball speed is at least 18 mph at your release and even then it could still be too strong of a ball for the condition.  You can still be speed dominate and yet your ball speed is more like 15-16 at release.  I am a 51 year old two hander and my league ball is the Columbia Explosion.  My specs are 18.5 at release and 525 rpm rev rate.  Even at my ball speed, I have nothing asym.  The 4 balls I take to league are that Explosion, Scorpion, Fate, and Beast.  That is 2 hybrids and 2 pearls, all symmetric.  If you do decide to put polish on he Hater; rule of thumb is you want to freshen it back up after about 9 games.  With you being more rev challenged, the polish should hold up longer because you are not creating as much friction to the cover as a higher rev player would.  But the main thing, is that being rev challenged, friction on the lane is your friend because it will help you to create ball motion you need.  So you need to look at balls that can match up to that friction without going completely sideways when the ball hits it.  Bowled with a senior a couple years ago who was around 14 mph at release and low rev rate and a PSO had him in a Night Road which forced him into playing close to 4th arrow from game 1.  He struggled because the cover was too strong to play outside but the core did not give him much help.  I put him into a Hustle and he was able to stay around 2nd arrow the entire night while giving him miss room.  It was a much better matchup for him.  You may be in a similar situation where lower end ball will give you a better look on the lanes than what the Hater is gving you.

Just a quick update:

Situation has resolved itself somewhat. 


Realized I had way too much tape in the thumbhole, which was restricting me on delivery. Corrected that and also have determined the ball seems to work better in relief or out of the bullpen.

If I begin with it either in league or open bowling,  it seems erratic (or I’m erratic WITH it). But when struggling with another ball  the Hater is a good change in relief.   Not sure WHY, but that seems to be the case.

I’m not real knowledgeable on grit specs, but I did have the surface changed a few weeks ago (shinier, more length)  and it is just as you described. It goes a little longer and comes in very strong —-most of the time, which IS what I wanted. It’s the unpredictability that makes me “hate” it sometimes.

Am not a pro bowler and of course I throw errant shots plenty of times. And most of the time it is “operator error” and I know as soon as I release the ball —-even if I get lucky and ball ends up in the pocket in spite of me. The Hater frustrates me cause often it feels great coming off my hand —-like it did in the previous frame—-but either hooks harder or not at all.

Was aware when I bought it that it was a high risk/high reward kind of ball. Just not to the extent it has been so far.