Author Topic: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock? (Read 1975 times)

bamaster · « **on:** December 02, 2003, 07:46:37 PM »

I've read that side weight has very little to do with the ball's reaction. That most of the balls characteristics can be attributed to surface/coverstock.

How true is this?

I mean I know if I have two Vendetta Solids. One with the pin at 11:30 and the other at 2:00, I'll have two VERY different balls. It would seem that surface plays a "tweak" role at this point.

I'm more inclined to think the layout of the ball has the strongest influence on ball performance.

Thought?

Tony
http://www.allBowling.com

mumzie · « **Reply #1 on:** December 03, 2003, 11:40:03 AM »

Coverstock (about 70%), then surface (20%), then layout.

According to Jerry Francomano, if I recall the percentages correctly.

TheDude · « **Reply #2 on:** December 03, 2003, 11:42:16 AM »

When you say 11 and then 2 o clock directions your now talking about the direction the CG is in relation to the pin is placed at. Two balls with pins placed at identical positions but cgs shifted in different directions will effect the shape of your break point and also to a small degree the length of the break point as well.with the cg in the 11 o clock zone you are pushing the cg to the right, offsetting the Ball's center of gravity and pushing mass farther to one side of the ball. On a typical ball( symtemtrical) this will cause a slightly earlier break point and more recovery on the backends. with a cg in the 2 o clock position you are putting the CG in a more neutral zone in a sense in that it's not offsetting any mass from side to side. this break point shape will be a smooth stable arcing position for most.

CG location effects break point shape, stacking a cg and pin in line will create the hardest and sharpest break points.

Coverstock is the ball's traction on the lane and shiney covers tend to save energy longer but expell it quicker when they find the dry parts of the lane. dull covers roll earlier and tend to loss energy soon in the lane, the result shiney ball will in general skid, dull will arc.

So even tho you place the CG at the same place on two different balls if the covers are different they will reaction very differently.

I'm sure can give a much more conclusive demonstration and examples than i can though.
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I am Canadian Dude!

Phillip Marlowe · « **Reply #3 on:** December 03, 2003, 04:24:19 PM »

This discussion is, as usual in these types of discussions, misleading. Of course the coverstock is the most important factor in how the ball moves. However, most companies have coverstocks designed to handle certain types of oil -- i.e., more aggressive to less aggressive coverstocks. If you have two of the same ball, a tweak in the coverstock will change the ball, but the base coverstock remains the same, meaning what you are doing is not changing the amount of movement but rather, when the ball hooks. Changes in drill pattern change the shape of the hook. I find greater differences between two of the same type of ball when one is drilled say 4.5x2 and the other 4.5x5.5 than in two balls of the same type with similar drill patterns and but having a one or two level (say 1200 to 800 grit smooth) change in the finish on the coverstock.
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"I don't mind if you don't like my manners. I don't like them myself. They're pretty bad. I grieve over them on long winter evenings."

C-G ProShop-Carl · « **Reply #4 on:** December 03, 2003, 11:13:40 PM »

Coverstock is very meaningful.

I see the surface as most important though. Sand a plastic ball down to 220 and it will hook.

Surface, say 400 on a particle vs 400 on a urethane you will see the difference. THUS the reason coverstock is so meaningful as well.

Side weights, or static weights are almost meaningless in a ball. Probably 5-10% of total reaction...IF THAT is determined by the static weights.

jimensminger · « **Reply #5 on:** December 04, 2003, 10:29:44 AM »

I'm "old school", and to me static weights are very important in setting up a ball. I set up every one of my balls with static weights being a factor. Pin and CG position determine static weights. Balance holes also effect statics. I use statics to give me the "look" that I want a specific ball to have. Coverstock and surface are important, but with the wrong static combinations you can be defeating your purpose of ball selection.

Mike Austin · « **Reply #6 on:** December 05, 2003, 01:16:19 AM »

Jim,

Me and you be cool and all, but I have to disagree with you on the static weights. Just for conversation, let's say we have a pin out ball, 3", pretty much any top weight. We will put the cg on the center of your grip. Now, put the pin at 10:00 in your track (Ball one). Ball two with the pin over your fingers on your span line. Ball three with the pin at 2:00 to the cg.

You have three completely different layouts, all will have similar static weights after drilling, and most likely three different "looks" on the lane.

Statick weights just don't make that much difference anymore.

Keep up the good bowling!!!

--------------------
Mike Austin
Mike Austin's Precision Pro Shop
Houston, TX
strikes4days@sbcglobal.net

Onward through the Storm!!!!

Check out my web site - www.BirdDogBowling.com

jimensminger · « **Reply #7 on:** December 05, 2003, 08:22:42 AM »

We'll agree to disagree, I use pin and cg positions to layout the ball for the reactions I want,...but I still ensure that the statics "tune" the layouts. je

Author Topic: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock? (Read 1975 times)

bamaster

Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?

mumzie

Re: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?

TheDude

Re: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?

Phillip Marlowe

Re: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?

C-G ProShop-Carl

Re: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?

jimensminger

Re: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?

Mike Austin

Re: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?

jimensminger

Re: Side weights, pin location, or coverstock?