Author Topic: Xxcel (Read 18542 times)

admin · « **on:** December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM »

Ball NPS Score: 100.00

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Length Rating: 10.75 (scale of 1-30, early to late)
Overall Hook Rating: 30.00 (scale of 1-30, least to most)
Breakpoint Angle: 9.85 (scale of 1-10, smooth to sharp)
Color: Black/Red/Bright Blue
Style: 029744-621

Target Line: Track Area and Inside Angles
Lane Conditions: Medium to Heavy Oil
Coverstock: Bomber Light Load Particle 1000 Grit Abralon Pad 6 3/4" from the pin, through the CG
Core: Modified Scalien Core Desgin

Weights: 16 15 14
RG: 2.52 2.51 2.50
Differential: .056 .063 .075

BowlerKidR · « **Reply #1 on:** March 04, 2005, 04:22:58 PM »

i threw this bad boy at a Pro Shop Employee demo day. As all hammer and ebonite demo day balls are drilled, this one was stacked with pin below the ring finger. Let my just start off by saying, i was bowling on more of a medium condition, and even though this ball is for heavy oil, it had been used in demo's so it had a slight polish to it from lane usage and oil. Anyway, by no means is this ball good for playing up the lane the way this is drilled. Totally for playing deep inside lines.

So, my first impression on this ball is that it over hooks. The reason? well the fresh backends were over come by this balls coverstock and new core, so it just took off like someone kicked it in the other direction. This sharp angle was WAY to strong, and i was leaving wack splits, and pins ive never left before, and everyone else using it had the same problem.

BUT....one you hit carry down THIS BALL SHINES. It didnt flip or ark, it was inbetween depending on how many revs u have, or how u throw it. anyway, i was carying every shot near or on the pocket, and i was getting amazing pin action.

Comparison between xcel particle and xxcel:
The xcel particle is a great ball, but it is not as aggressive as the xxcel. The xcel is more of a arc ball by far, and teh xxcel by far is more of a flipy ball. Both were great in the heavy oil, but i liked the xxcel better (once there was carry down)

Overview:
My overview of this xxcel, is that it is a great ball added to an already great line up of balls by ebonite. if u dont have a heavier oil ball, and u need one, consider this ball...you wont be sorry. the only downside to this ball is that it isnt a good first game ball. If u bowl in a first league with fresh backends, hold this ball till the second or third game, because it will over react. none the less, a great ball.

Ryan
--------------------
High Game- 287
3 Game High Series- 808
4 Game High Series- 901
I LIKE TO BOWL

BigHand868 · « **Reply #2 on:** March 14, 2005, 02:54:55 AM »

Well, I thought my Xcel Pearl made the turn....this ball is perfectly discribed in the BJ ball review section. When this thing finishes rolling 50ft it seriously looks like someone is kicking it left. Being associated with a pro shop I don't think I am gonna reccommend this to anyone who throws the ball slower than 17 mph. If you have any hand whatsoever put a serious coat of polish on this beast, rev it up and send it DEEP and prepare to be amazed! I would say with out a doubt this balls outhooks anything I have EVER thrown! This ball makes the wetter sport patterns look like fresh house patters. But if you have 350+ revs put some shine on it, keep the ball speed up, and keep it in some oil or trust me your goin high. Oh yeah, and this ball will clear the deck with a blink of an eye, like a semi smashin into a VW mini...and if it doesn't your gonna witness the best pin hoe down you ever done seen! (They go Fly'n).

schwaig · « **Reply #3 on:** March 18, 2005, 01:37:54 PM »

I agree, this ball is to much of an animal on lanes with fresh back ends or when the heads go. But give this ball a little carry down and you won't have to worry about the over under anymore just whether you'll carry or not. On the scratch lg shot I bowl on with alot of head oil and fresh back ends I've been stuggling like crazy, first game snapping to hard then the heads start to break down and your off to the races and I haven't been able to get left far enough or fast enough yet. Last weekend though bowling in county singles and doubles we had the same shot early but had carry down before we even got done with shadows and the ball worked extremly well shooting back to back 700s. I'd like to polish this ball but am waiting for ABC's , maybe after that.

Long Roller · « **Reply #4 on:** March 19, 2005, 09:51:33 PM »

I wasn't that impressed with the hook of this ball with the box finish. I put some polish on it and will bowl a tournament tomorrow. I've been reading the posts that say the ebonite box finish leaves much to be desired. I throw the savage flip now and can barely miss on a house shot. Averaging 225. But I am looking for a ball on synthetics for tournaments. I'll know more tomorrow and will post back then.

shane

Long Roller · « **Reply #5 on:** March 20, 2005, 06:25:21 PM »

Just finished a tournament with a polished xxcel. I won the tournament and averaged just under 250. I would recommend changing the factory finish to a polish or something different than the way it comes. Hell of a ball!!

Shane

thegame · « **Reply #6 on:** March 21, 2005, 01:54:45 PM »

After throwing this ball at an Ebonite seminar, i was very impressed with the hook, and power this ball gives me at the pins. I decided to drill one, especially since I was having trouble with some of my oil balls I currently had. Drilled it close to stacked leverage, except kicking the mass bias, about 2 inches to the right of the thumbhole (right handed). After throwing it in league, I noticed it rolled early, but still finished very strong. Gave me a very predictable look, and after my Total Annihilation started getting a little jumpy off the breakpoint, the Xxcel hooked almost as much, but with a little more control. Went to ABT the next day in the same center, and same reaction, same results, got me a 252 and 215 in my 2nd and 3rd games, then the lanes got a little too dry for it. I had been a little leary of Ebonite products because of the problems with the Primal Instinct and such, but this is certainly a winner, and I would definitely be open to future Ebonite purchases. Good job guys.

SCOOTER_26 · « **Reply #7 on:** March 28, 2005, 05:05:08 AM »

All the reviews below me are saying put a coat of polish on it what effect will this have on the ball exactly!!!

Brian Green · « **Reply #8 on:** April 08, 2005, 12:53:05 AM »

Bowler Profile:

Hand : Left

Pap: 5 1/2 in over right on center of grip

Revs: Above Average

Speed: Above average

Average 216 (2003-2004 book average)

Conditions Bowled on:
House Shot
And Modified House shot

Ball Specs before drilling
weight 16 lbs
Pin 3-4 top top 3 1/4

Drill Pattern:

Pin above ring finger, cg kicked out 2 1/2 inches on the grip center line. Bomb around 45 degrees weight hole on axis

Ball Reation on house shot:

This ball really didnt work well on the house shot for me, there was too much dry for the ball it would burn up way too early in the out of box finish.. with polish i bet this thing would eat the house shot alive.... more often then not i couldnt keep this ball off the headpin

Ball Reaction on Modified house shot:

{THe oil pattern is very similiar to the house shot just a little more oil in the heads and the pattern is flatter. the shot is very playable but if u make a bad shot you dont get rewarded.......}

The xxcel was definately the ball to buy for this condition. in the out of box surface this ball allows me to open up the lane and not worry about the ball not finishing... this ball just turns up in the midlane like a partical ball normally does but it doesnt quit.. it turns and drives right through the pins...

Over all Opinion Of Ball:

The Ebonite xxcel is one very impressive bowling ball. If your looking for a ball for medium heavy oil that will get down the lane longer than a triditional particle ball but have the drive of a resin ball than this is the ball.. I usually drill brunswick balls but the xcel line as intrigued me from the start and i can honestly say the xxcel opened my eyes to ebonite equipment again...
my over all rating on this ball out of 10 with 1 beeing the worst and 10 being just plain awesome is a 8.... Very Impressive Job Ebonite you guys have my attention again

Brian Green

--------------------
you can laugh at the way i bowl but i will be the one laughin when i am takin your money

Dwight Albrecht · « **Reply #9 on:** April 13, 2005, 06:47:58 PM »

Ebonite XX-cel Particle:

Ball Specs
The ball being drilled was a 3â€ pin out with 3.00 oz top weight.
Drilling: Pin 3 1/2" from PAP and Mb 4 3/4" from PAP (approximately 60 degrees) pin is Above Ring finger, 3" above grip midline. Weight Hole 2" past my pap.

Bowler Information:
Track diameter is 10 1/2.
PAP is measured at 5 1/4 over and 3/8" up.
Average ball speed (foul line to head pin) is 17 mph.
Axis rotation is typically 90 degrees
Initial rev rate is typically 300 rpm, "Tweener"
Lane Condition and Pattern: Village Bowl in Memonomee Falls WI. Wood Lanes Oiled to 40 feet, semi-clean backends. Bowlero Lanes. HPL 9000 Panel. Oily up front, semi clean backends, carry down issues all year.

REVIEW:
One Word: BRAVO. Bravo Ron Hickland. What a ball. Best Ebonite ball I've thrown. Now this is a ball. Quick Revving like the X-cel, but Ron added the two small flip nuggets to the side of the core and now this ball corners. Definately a ball for oil and low rev players. I don't think the high rev players will like it unless the ball was shined and drilled with a length drilling. One of the hardest hitting, fastest spinning balls I've thrown. As long as I had oil in the heads this ball threw pins everywhere. Ball reacted well on both the HPL panel and the wood lanes of Village. Not for dry and not the ball for dry heads, otherwise, you will love it. Great Job Ron!!!

Compared to my other Balls:

Big Bully:. The XX-cel spins up quicker than the Big Bully, The XXcel hooks 3-4 boards more with stronger backend.

Absolute Inferno Sanded: The Absolute does not rev up as quick but is much cleaner through the heads and is more angular than the XXcel. The XXcel's breakpoint is much earlier.The XXcel is 1-2 stronger over hook than the sanded Absolute Inferno.

Thanks for reading my review.

GateCityProShop · « **Reply #10 on:** April 16, 2005, 11:50:49 AM »

Drill Pattern: Pin 5 1/2 by 45 degrees
No Weight Hole
Surface: Changed to 1500, w/ Ebonite Particle Polish

The XXCel is definitely the best ball Ebonite has ever released in my opinion, and could easily be one of the most versatile on the market.
Originally I threw this with the box finish, even though the ball wanted to read early it still managed to conserve energy pretty well. Once the surface was changed to what I mentioned above, the ball reaction became 10 times better. This surface won't work for everyone, but if you are a higher rev player try it, I guarantee you will love this ball.

In comparison to what I have thrown in the past couple weeks, the XXCel is stronger by far than almost anything I have thrown, the Hammer Big Deal is close but is still a completely different look at the breakpoint. Great Job Ebonite!!

Bowl Great!

--------------------
Jimmy Martin
Gate City Pro Shop
Greesnboro NC

dizzyfugu · « **Reply #11 on:** June 19, 2005, 05:24:42 PM »

The XXcel in a nutshell (on popular demand )

Strong solid light load particle ball - this ball moves a lot!

Arcing but relentless move at the break point

OOB best suited for medium-oily shots, fits well under XXXcel

With sanded surface great for deep/long oil or sport shots

Make sure you have a driller who knows to set the ball up for you.

This ball is awesome! I was looking for a state-of-the-art performance ball and wanted a strong, controllable reaction for medium to med-oily conditions.
A pearl reactive like the Absolute Inferno was out of discussion for me, since I often have problems controlling balls of this type. But since I ever fared well with light load particles like the Fuze Eliminator or the Eraser Particle Pearl, I gave Ebonite's Xxcel the try – especially, because I have some very convincing older Ebonite balls in my arsenal (TPC Player and TPC Shooter). And: the Xxcel simply looks very nice with its 3-colour surface and bright green engravings. It's not only substance, but also style...

And I got BOTH!

The ball and its setup:

I wanted to make this ball a complement to my Fuze Eliminator, which handles heavy oil very well and shows the typical Brunswick early rolling motion. So I asked for a later reaction on medium-oily conditions. Once more, many thanks to Michael Kraemer in Duisburg, Germany, for his competent drilling support. The ball does a perfect job!

About me:
Style = Stroker/mild Tweener, right-handed
Speed = 13,5-14,5 mph
PAP = 5" & 7/8"^
Axis tilt = 18,7°
Revs = 250-300 RPM at release
For more details, check out my profile, please.

My Xxcel is a 15 lbs. 2 oz. ball with 3 3/4 oz. top weight before drilling.
It is a 3 3/4" pin-out, with the CG kicked out 1 1/2“ to the left from the direct line between pin and BOMB due to some odd core placement.

All in all, my Xxcel received a drilling similar to Ebonite's standard pattern #4, adjusted for more length with the pin above the fingers: Pin at 4 1/2" from PAP and directly at 1:00 above the ring finger hole.
CG ended up in direct line below the ring finger hole, 1/2“ to the right of the midlane/grip center. The BOMB marker was placed 2“ away at 4:00 from the thumb hole, effectively in a strong position at ~75° from PAP. Due to the CG shift inside of the ball to the left, no X-hole was necessary to keep the ball legal. Silicone oval finger inserts and a polystyrene thumb slug completed the job.

======*==
===o=o===
=========
=====#===
=========
====O====
=======b=

* = Pin
# = CG
b = BOMB marker

The surface remained in the shiny, polished 1.000 grit box condition. This already offers a lot of traction and is very clean in the heads when there is some oil.

For a picture and surface changes, see the addendum below.

Some general performance notes:

This ball shows an astonishingly strong performance: a violent, late reaction, with a STRONG move in the backend (O.K., it's drilled to produce this, but the way it performs lets you grip your seat). My Xxcel seems to float down the lane, break smooth and strong as spider silk and deliver its energy with a burst of revs and a wide, curving hook to the pocket.

It is not flippy at all and does not have a sharp breakpoint, rather a typical particle reaction. Somebody used the picture of a truck being driven by a drunk: goes straight down the road until the driver jerks the steering wheel left, and 40 tons of steel start turning... My Xxcel reminds me of this.
This ball recovers from almost anywhere on the lane and blasts the deck! I never thought that I, as a stroker, could produce such a ball reaction!

It is stronger than I expected it to be.

The testing program:

40' crowned (6:1 ratio) pattern:
The Xxcel shed bright light immediately during its maiden tests after drilling and thumb hole adjustment. I was able to play very different lines on a slick new synth surface with equal succcess:
* standing at 20 with right shoe tip, playing over 2nd arrow
* standing at 24, aiming at 12th board
* standing at 30, aiming at 16th board and the area 3' behind
* standing at 33 and playing over 4th arrow

Anyway, with my drilling I get a steady breakpoint at 42-44' on the 6th board down the lane, where the ball turns so violently and relentlesly towards the pocket. With its light-load particle coverstock the Xxcel is also quite unimpressed by carrydown and even very safe at spare-shooting across the lane. It grips like velcro tape, but it is still surprisingly clean through the front. A very god balance between grip and skip.

Only when the oil in the head area burns away and the track turns dry after some games, the Xxcel loses some of its energy prematurely, but it still remains very predictable and stable. Only a slight adjustment deeper (1 or 2 boards) is enough to keep it in play. I guess that this 40' oil with a slick surface is ideal turf for this ball, after some experience on other occasions this ground turned out to be the best house to use the XXcel.

Flat 42' sport pattern:
A though shot with a 1994 Brunswick synth surface, featuring a general low grip level. Here, on a fresh lane, the Xxcel could finally be pushed to its grip limits. The ball started out slipping beyond control – tribute to the polished surface, I think. When the lane was played down a bit after about 10 games in total, a track opened up and the ball started to move and carry much better.

On this occasion I tried two lines:
* standing at 23, aiming at 12
* standing at 27, aiming at 15
The latter worked quite fine until the end of the session, again with convincing performance, carry and control. Due to the late and strong recovery, a swing shot seems to be the best option. Down-and-in results in a weak/steep entry angle for me which leaves more 10 pins and the like.

On another occasion in summer 2005, with high temperature (almost 90°F) and tropical air humidity, the Xxcel's coverstock proved its traction ability: on a flying backend, the ball could only be kept in the pocket with force and excessive speed. Much too often it started to move earlier than on "normal" conditions and went for Brooklyn. So, you definitively need some head oil.

Short 32' Christmas tree pattern with dry outside boards:
Just to see what it would do, I also tried the Xxcel on my local "desert wars" THS with its short & spotty oil, very grippy, dry backend and a 7 board wide, bone-dry walled shot. It is almost impossible to play a strong ball there with some hand... Well, I just completed one game, since the XXcel was definitively NOT made for this. But I was curious how the Xxcel would react?

With the length drilling, its tencency to arc and the glossy coverstock the Xxcel was astonishingly playable, although I needed to stand at 40th board and beyond, aiming between 3rd and 4th arrow area and having the ball make a long, long journey across the lane towards the right gutter and back to the pocket. I even made some strikes! The Xxcel still went rather far down the lane and retained its good carry, but it was impossible to keep it consistently in the pocket – either it burnt out or went for Brooklyn. Speed helped, but I sacrificed exact ball placement. Yet, a positive surprise even on this scorched condition, confirming my experience from the toasted 42' sport pattern in summertime before.

Some conclusions:

The Xxcel is predictable, versatile, even looks great and (thank god) does not smell like a blue berry

. This ball HOOKS - lots of it! But the good thing about it is that it's in the player's hands (literally) to make it move or not - although I struggle sometimes to tame it down for straighter shots. It just wants to move...

Lane utility for tested ball (pattern length vs. oil volume):

|S M L
|h e o
|o d n
|r . g
|t
_______
|0 0 +| Light volume
|0 X X| Medium volume
|+ X 0| Heavy volume

Legend:
X = Best suited with effective control & carry
+ = Fairly suited (works, somehow, but lacks control)
0 = Unsuited (ineffective, either slips or burns up)

The chart concept is borrowed from Storm's 2003 catalogue. Surface prep and drillings may change the results, it is just personal experience with my style

On medium to medium-oily conditions and long patterns of 40' or more I give it a personal solid 10 out of 10 - but only in this condition window.

From my tests and ongoing experience, I would not recommend this ball for light oil or shorter patterns, a 6 or 7 out of 10. It will run off, moving, moving, moving... it arcs and seems unstoppable! And then, it can become hard to control or just burns up. Additionally, I have been struggling with this ball to work on several lane surfaces. For me, it is a bit condition specific and has not found its place in my tournament bag, since it only works perdictably in 1 local house. I am not sure whether it is me or the ball itself? That's the only drawback so far.

The Xxcel is not itchy on the dry like a strong pearl reactive would be, therefore you get very good manual control - just what I wanted from it. I think that the box surface is the ideal match for the coverstock. With the original 1.000 grit polish you can get it surprisingly far down the lane and make it react late, unleashing a real burst of energy which the modified Scalien core with its added flip nuggets saves very well.

The Xxcel can handle a burnt track in the heads and the midlane quite well. Just move 1 or 2 boards inside, find some oil, and you stay in the game. If not, you are in trouble... Maybe, with a real 1.500+ grit high-gloss polish, it could be made playable on less than medium conditions or short patterns?

A true flood is definitively too much for the Xxcel, at least in box condition or when you are not able to adjust release and speed to let the ball make its move by physics. Wet sanding it to 1.000 or 800 grit matte should make it playable on tougher oil, but there are also the Xxxcel and the Xcel Particle who should do this job in box condition.

To me it does not appear that the Xxcel is starting to roll as early as Ebonite claims in the technical specs. Initially, I expected it to be very similar to my Fuze Eliminator, but it is definitively not: the Xxcel is by far not as rolly, has much more length. Even a friend's Absolute Inferno in box condition starts to roll much earlier than this particle beauty.

In direct comparison to a friend's Xxxcel with a similar drilling as my Xxcel, the OOB Xxcel has more length and a sharper hook, while the Xxxcel has a slightly higher overall hook potential and starts to break 4-5' earlier, needing more oil to be handy and being better suited for a flood.

Although I play rather slowly, I think that high speed and/or high rev players can greatly benefit from this ball since it goes so cleanly down the lane OOB and shows a very stable reaction. The more I can push it, the better it seems to work on any condition.

To conclude, a quote about boxing about Mike Tyson which fits the Xxcel well, too: "Move like a butterly – sting like a bee".

Real high-end stuff! Despite some personal problems with the ball, a great job, Ebonite!

Addendum 5/17/06:
After my XXcel suddenly lost its great back end after about only 50 games and building up a visible track, I tried soaking it but it did not help much, so I had the ball resurfaced. This brought the ball immediately back to its former hook level.
Since I wanted to move the XXcel "away" from my Eliminator, I had the ball sanded to 800 grit for heavier conditions and longer oil I face in league and on tournaments. Here is a picture of the ball.

The matte finish has dramatically changed its reaction shape: The XXcel is much, much more arcing now. Visual target and foot position on the approach are much the same as before, but the ball is much smoother now and there is no flood I was not able to conquer with this orb so far. It reads the lane much earlier with the matte surface - about 10' sooner! Midlane traction and backend move are both impressive.
The overall hooking action will probably tame down a bit over time as the surface wears off, but I hope the ball will not need constant sanding to keep the performance up - a real drawback I had with an X-Factor RE-Loaded, very time- and material-consuming.

Addendum 10/23/06:
Ball still at 800 grit, and it has not lost any power so far (even though I did not have much opportunities to use it in summertime). It shines on true heavy shots and on carrydown on high oil volumes. It surely has a place in my tourney bag this season!

Addendum 02/08/08:
Sad day, but true: my XXcel, sitting still in the shelf and waiting for duty, cracked yesterday evening without a plausible cause. I just heard from the neighboring room a popping sound, as if you were bending a PET bottle. I did not think of anything bad, But next morning, when I checked my equipment for an upcoming league start, I found my XXcel with a straight crack from the ring finger all around the ball to the thumb!

I did not use the ball for several weeks, due to lack of oil on local lanes,a nd that might have been the cause. Last thing I did with it was wet sanding its surface gently by hand with a grey pad under flowing warm water in the sink - nothing hot or anything I could think of what could have caused tension in the coverstock or between surface, filler and core. Last oil extraction in the bucket had been months ago. It just sat there, and cracked out of a sudden!

Very sad event, since it had been my heavy oil ball - and a very good one, too. Looks as if I will have to reanimate my old Eliminator...

--------------------

DizzyFugu --- Reporting from Germany
Team "X" league website: http://homepage.mac.com/timlinked/
"All that we see or seem, is but a dream within a dream..." - Edgar Allen Poe

Edited on 26.09.2011 at 7:39 AM

TrimMan · « **Reply #12 on:** June 27, 2005, 09:38:34 AM »

15lbs 3oz
3 1/4 tw
3-4 pin
pin 4 1/2 from pap, under ring finger. MB right of the thumb hole. No x-hole
4000 grit abralon

38' THS Have used this ball only for a few shots in this house just to strong, just reads the lanes to early for me.

41' THS I bought this ball for this house. At first I had the finish at 2000 abralon was reading the lanes to early and was leaving alot of 4 pins and 4-9 splits. Changed the finish to 4000 abralon WOW. I understand why USBC now has changed rulings on differrential. This ball flat out flares, when it turns it is strong and keeps coming. I have made alot of money pot bowling with this ball. When everyone else is complaining about how tight the shot is I have plenty of room. I have been easily exploiting this shot.

Overall, you need oil and longer oil patterns. At this finish this not a true flood ball, but usable. Perfer my GP2 on that condition. Bought this ball to go under my GP2 and that is what I have. Another great product by Ebonite.
--------------------
You have your whole life to have fun, but you have only one chance.

Ball DR · « **Reply #13 on:** September 24, 2005, 05:38:22 PM »

This is my favorite ball in the Ebonite line. It is just plain smooth. Low enough RG to not squirt and no hint of early reaction. Used this ball exclusively at the ABC tournament in Baton Rouge,LA. Shot 1943 all events without a series over 650 (64?,64?,64?). Pretty solid considering the toughness of the scoring environment this year.
--------------------
www.strikingdifference.com

ebonick · « **Reply #14 on:** September 30, 2005, 12:29:23 AM »

Bowlers specs:
Speed - 22-24 MPH
Revs - About 450

Desription:
Weight - 15lbs
Pin to CG distance - 3-4in.
Surface prep - Out of Box

Drilling: - I'm not good with drills, but It's a modified Drilling Pattern #1 on the Ebonite Xxcel sheet

Conditions:
I bowl at 2 houses.

House #1: They use a Med. Christmas Tree Pattern. I don't know the lenght of it, sorry. It seems to move well on it. I play over the 4th arrow out to 4-5 board. It moves back very nice and crushes the pocket. I leave more nines with this ball than I do with my others. It seems to work well until I get to the lighter oil.

House #2: They put down something different almost every week. If I want a pattern the laneman don't mind putting it down, so it is a little hard to tell how it works here. The main pattern they use though is a 42ft. Med. THS. This ball is perfect here. Don't really have to worry about lanes drying here, but I do deal with a lot of carry down. This ball acts great in carry down. Can't even tell its there

Ball path shape:
This ball has great backend on it. It gets to dry and kicks left. With my drilling it has a nice snap to it. The ball will not work well if the heads are burnt. I have real trouble with this on Sun. Youth/Adult so I have to throw it in the bag, but when theres oil, it will rip through it and shred the rack.

Author Topic: Xxcel (Read 18542 times)

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