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Author Topic: Spike Core  (Read 3131 times)

BallsDeep

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Spike Core
« on: June 12, 2008, 07:22:29 AM »
I personally don't really care for the spike core design that is featured in the NV series.  It seems like they kept increasing the strength of the covers in the one series and they felt like they needed a longer core design to allow the covers to get through the heads.  They then came out with the NV series and the spike core design.  To me however, the continuous motion that was offered with the one series was lost in the fray.  The spike still creates a great deal of flare, and it gets through the heads well, but it doesn't really get through the pin deck all that well.

I would have loved to see what would happen if the NV covers were put on the Raid block.  Though the Raid core design is tamer than the Centrex (Ones) and the Spike, it seems to have a more continuous motion than the spike, somewhat like that seen in the Zone Asym series from Brunswick.
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Gazoo

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2008, 03:51:47 PM »
"That's what I'm talking about!"
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mrbowlingnut

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2008, 03:55:02 PM »
I agree the raid block would have a better matchup, I personally miss the propeller core from the TPC series.

Shot many great series with the Player and Shooter xl, got better since then and with that core shape and new covers think I would shoot lights out some nights with that combo.
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themachine300

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2008, 04:56:44 PM »
The overseas Air Raid has the Raid's core with the Total NV's cover.  We can only dream....
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charlest

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2008, 06:09:00 PM »
I believe you're mistaking potential high flaring continuity with strong mass bias causing a fixed breakpoint. You have to drill so that the Mass bias does not force a ball to to roll too early, like many/most MoRich designed cores. If you place strong mass bias cores so that the MB is positioned too close to the PAP/VAL, then you will lose continuity and gain fixed, strong roll at a potentially too early a breakpoint.

It is a very cautious balancing act. I believe you're losing continuation at the breakpoint for a fixed, very rolly breakpoint, but not placing the MB maker far enough away from the VAL/PAP. That is, the PAP-pin-MB angle is not  a large enough angle.
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BallsDeep

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2008, 10:23:13 AM »
I have made that mistake in the past, Charlest, but not with the NV series.  I made it with the Epic Odssey from roto.  In that particular instance, the mb was swung out near the val and the ball rolled consistently, but without any pop whatsoever.

My NVS, on the other hand, is drilled with a pin to pap of 5" and a mb to pap of 4 1/2" with the pin above the midline by 3" or so.  The mb winds up at least a 2 inches away from the val.

For me, the ball gets through the fronts pretty well, and then gets angular on the back but doesn't have that continuation that I want.  I have a Domination from storm that is drilled the same, which offers a much more continuous motion on the backend and through the pit.

I don't really know if the mb strength was the real issue.  It was just that the mb strength, and the differential of the core design were lessened from the centrex to the spike, which is odd for a company to do unless their covers are getting too strong for the previous core design.  The real issue, I feel may be the manner in which the spike is shaped.  It looks like a multiplanar asym, like that of Morich stuff.  While I have had success with Morich and multiplanar asyms, the stuff that is dual planar (not sure about that term) like the Bruns asyms, or the raid always seems to be more readable and continuous to me, with my favorite drillings.
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charlest

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2008, 01:20:08 PM »
quote:
I have made that mistake in the past, Charlest, but not with the NV series.  I made it with the Epic Odssey from roto.  In that particular instance, the mb was swung out near the val and the ball rolled consistently, but without any pop whatsoever.


Yup. The stronger the mass bias, the further you need to put the MB from the VAL/PAP actually the larger the angle, PAP-pin-MB, you need to use to insure continuity.

quote:

My NVS, on the other hand, is drilled with a pin to pap of 5" and a mb to pap of 4 1/2" with the pin above the midline by 3" or so.  The mb winds up at least a 2 inches away from the val.


That sounds very reasonable.

quote:

For me, the ball gets through the fronts pretty well, and then gets angular on the back but doesn't have that continuation that I want.  I have a Domination from storm that is drilled the same, which offers a much more continuous motion on the backend and through the pit.


I don't know, but a possible (not necessarily correct) reason could be that the NVS coverstock is stronger (I know both are pearls) than the Domination cover FOR YOU.

quote:

I don't really know if the mb strength was the real issue.  


From all my personal testing (never got to actually use the darned things) of MoRich balls, I can guarantee that mass bias strength makes a huge difference.

quote:

It was just that the mb strength, and the differential of the core design were lessened from the centrex to the spike, which is odd for a company to do unless their covers are getting too strong for the previous core design.  The real issue, I feel may be the manner in which the spike is shaped.  It looks like a multiplanar asym, like that of Morich stuff.  While I have had success with Morich and multiplanar asyms, the stuff that is dual planar (not sure about that term) like the Bruns asyms, or the raid always seems to be more readable and continuous to me, with my favorite drillings.
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OK. You'd have to ask a Physicist or Mo Pinel or Ron Hickland about that degree of technicality. All I know is coverstock, pin and MB and increasing MB strength requires a larger angle, as mentioned above.

sorry I couldn't help.
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Edited on 6/14/2008 3:58 PM
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themachine300

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2008, 03:54:21 PM »
The Complete NV seems to have a very strong continous motion from what I've seen.  It looks to be the best out of the NV series so far imo.
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BallsDeep

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Re: Spike Core
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2008, 09:07:19 AM »
Thanks for the reply Charlest.  I'm going to try a couple more things with that ball before retiring it totally.  The length that I'm getting is long enough to make me think that its not burning up, but the ball motion (tailing) is indicative of burn up.  I think that I'm going to try to take up the surface to 800 + storm xtra shine to see if I can get it to react late enough to get through the pit with some angle.

I doubt that the shine will work however so I may see if a weight hole to create some more flare might help.  This would aid burn up, if that is the problem, but that should be ruled out by the higher finish that I'm going to try first.

As a short aside, I decided to give the NV series another try as I got a Total NV drilled yesterday.  I went with a lower pin position than the NVS and a stronger overall drill.  It seems pretty good from my initial impressions.  I'll probably post on it after I get a few more games on the ball.
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