I have the Turbo/R and Destiny solid! There's no comparison between the two! The Destiny solid is a lot stronger mid lane and overall hook, but the Turbo/R is a really nice ball when they break down or you have enough friction. They are both drilled with the pin above my ring finger, which ends up being 4" to pap! I have the Destiny pearl that I haven't drilled yet, but I don't know if I need it since I have the Juke. I really liked the Cyclone and when they added the stronger cover and a solid, I had to get both. Just my $.02, Bruce