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Author Topic: Black Widow vs Angular one  (Read 2662 times)

cranker89

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Black Widow vs Angular one
« on: November 14, 2006, 09:10:23 PM »
How do these balls compare? which has more hook? which is snappier?

thanks
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Bowling is like Fvcking, its always the same booring stuff... in, out, in, out...
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TWOHAND834

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2006, 05:26:57 AM »
Well, for one, the BW is a solid whereas the Angular is a pearl.  The Angular is going to be the snappier of the two, although the Angular is not what I call snappy.  At the demo day we just did, the Angular was slightly longer than the Infinite with more continuation around the corner.  I think the Infinite and the BW are closer comparisons than the BW and the Angular.  Hope this helps you out.
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Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator

If anyone out there is worried about the scores being too high, try duckpin!!
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Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

cranker89

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2006, 08:31:35 AM »
BW has more overall hook?
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Bowling is like Fvcking, its always the same booring stuff... in, out, in, out...
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trogdor

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2006, 11:26:32 AM »
Go here and look for the Angular One vs Black Widow
http://www.ebonite.com/products/one_series_spotlight/

quote:
BW has more overall hook?
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Bowling is like Fvcking, its always the same booring stuff... in, out, in, out...

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Storm Paradigm Passion
Storm Eraser Ragin' Banshee
Lane#1 Uranium Buzzsaw
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wulfpackbwlr

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2006, 01:28:19 PM »
trogdor is right.  Just look at the videos.  With the same finish the angular outhooks by quite a few boards.
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NCSU 2006
All Dyno-Thane

Edited on 11/15/2006 2:19 PM
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chitown

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2006, 09:38:10 AM »
quote:
trogdor is right.  Just look at the videos.  With the same finish the angular outhooks by quite a few boards.
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NCSU 2006
All Dyno-Thane

Edited on 11/15/2006 2:19 PM


Sometimes vids can be a little deceiving.
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Necromancer

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2006, 02:29:58 PM »
quote:
trogdor is right.  Just look at the videos.  With the same finish the angular outhooks by quite a few boards.
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NCSU 2006
All Dyno-Thane

Edited on 11/15/2006 2:19 PM


These videos make no sense and I say this because:

1) In most of the videos, the Angular is not hitting the pocket at all, but overhooking.  Example, vs. Black Widow & vs. Double Agent.  What is the point?

2) These videos in my opinion make Ebonite look stupid.  So you have a ball that hooks soooooo much it doesn't even hit the correct side of the pocket?  Huh?

3) Why do people want a ball that hooks this much anyways?  I can hook this much with a mid-line to introductory ball and it has a lot more predictable backend.  

I just don't understand the videos and why the guy controlling the video is moving his cursor left and right in a way that actually makes Ebonite look bad (Ebonite - Left of head pin, X-Company - Square in Pocket --->  Any questions???)

LOL!!!

EDIT: I busted out laughing at the Angular One 500 grit video.  Yeah I want a ball that hooks so much that its only use is to hit 7 pins.  LOL!!! This is hilarious.
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Current arsenal:
Storm X-Factor Vertigo
Storm Trauma ER
Storm Recharge
Ebonite Vortex Afterburner
Columbia 300 Messenger Ti
Storm Hit Blue Pearl
Ebonite 14 Fun Ball
Current Average: 196

Edited on 11/16/2006 3:28 PM
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H: Brunswick Fury, Columbia 300 EPX T1
M-H: Storm Shift Gravity, Hammer Black Widow
M: Storm X-Factor Vertigo, Ebonite Predator
M-L: Storm Recharge
S: Viz-A-Ball White
Bench: Brunswick Target Spare Zone, Ebonite 14 Fun Ball
GEMS: Brunswick Quantum Helix, Brunswick Quantum Double Helix

2008-09 Year 215.000 2008-09 Tourney 177.360 Last Tourney 182.667

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TWOHAND834

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2006, 02:41:27 PM »
hooking4fun,

Just out of curiosity, are those 2 balls drilled the exact same way, same specs (pin to cg distance, top weight, pin to PAP, mass to PAP, weight holes, no weight holes) with the same surface, and on the same lane conditions?  You may be right here.

EX:  A Black Widow at 500 grit abralon is going to hook more than the Angular at 4000 grit plus Factory Finish, even with similar layouts.  NOW....take that BW of yours and sand up to 4000 abralon and put a coat of Factory Finish over it and then compare the 2 balls.  OR.....take that Angular One and hit it with 500 abralon and leave the BW the way it is, and see what happens.

One more thing..........usually when they do these ball tests, they just have the pin above the bridge and cg at or near the center of the grip, and no weight holes at out of box finish.  When they do the Demo Days, attend one and see for yourself.  ALL the balls are drilled pin over bridge, cg near center of grip and box finish.

Point here, is that just saying that one ball hooks more than the other tells us absolutely nothing about all the variables that determine ball roll and reaction.
--------------------
Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator

If anyone out there is worried about the scores being too high, try duckpin!!

Edited on 11/16/2006 3:35 PM
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Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

lilgrob

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2006, 03:07:14 PM »
Doesn't Ron design both the Hammer and Ebonite balls?  If he does, why would he he lie that he thinks one ball hooks more than the other?  

The point of the videos aren't to see the ball hit the pocket.  It's to see the relationships between the different balls.  Do you really need to hit the pocket to understand ball motion and breakpoints?  I think his point comes off pretty well.  The Angular has more continuation on the back then the other balls whether it's shiny or dull.

Trust me, if people didn't want balls that hooked off the lane then ball companies wouldn't be making them.
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Gary

Necromancer

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2006, 03:13:08 PM »
quote:
Doesn't Ron design both the Hammer and Ebonite balls?  If he does, why would he he lie that he thinks one ball hooks more than the other?  

The point of the videos aren't to see the ball hit the pocket.  It's to see the relationships between the different balls.  Do you really need to hit the pocket to understand ball motion and breakpoints?  I think his point comes off pretty well.  The Angular has more continuation on the back then the other balls whether it's shiny or dull.

Trust me, if people didn't want balls that hooked off the lane then ball companies wouldn't be making them.


I agree with what you said about people wanting balls that hook but I just feel bowlers are looking the wrong way.  Why not look for a ball that is the most predictable and smoothest into the pocket regardless of hook.  I mean the angle of entry for the balls varies very little.  It's just the path getting there that becomes all "fancy".  I am no straight bowler by a long shot.  But I have found that I can do the same with a low-mid performance ball as I can with a high performance one.
--------------------
Current arsenal:
Storm X-Factor Vertigo
Storm Trauma ER
Storm Recharge
Ebonite Vortex Afterburner
Columbia 300 Messenger Ti
Storm Hit Blue Pearl
Ebonite 14 Fun Ball
Current Average: 196
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Current Arsenal Gallery
H: Brunswick Fury, Columbia 300 EPX T1
M-H: Storm Shift Gravity, Hammer Black Widow
M: Storm X-Factor Vertigo, Ebonite Predator
M-L: Storm Recharge
S: Viz-A-Ball White
Bench: Brunswick Target Spare Zone, Ebonite 14 Fun Ball
GEMS: Brunswick Quantum Helix, Brunswick Quantum Double Helix

2008-09 Year 215.000 2008-09 Tourney 177.360 Last Tourney 182.667

Hall of Fame BR Member Since: April 3, 2001

Currently Retired from Bowling

chitown

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2006, 03:58:51 PM »
quote:
I agree with what you said about people wanting balls that hook but I just feel bowlers are looking the wrong way. Why not look for a ball that is the most predictable and smoothest into the pocket regardless of hook. I mean the angle of entry for the balls varies very little. It's just the path getting there that becomes all "fancy". I am no straight bowler by a long shot. But I have found that I can do the same with a low-mid performance ball as I can with a high performance one.


I agree with the above statement.  Yes we should care more about how the ball rolls than how much it hooks.  I also look at how versatile a ball is.  I want to be able to use it on many conditions.  I also look at how a ball carry's the pins.  I don't want a ball that hit's so hard that I get a bunch of 9 pins.

I also feel that there's no difference in performance between mid-priced balls and high end ones.  

I love the DOOM and PAIN because these two balls are very controllable and carry great.  Both of these balls can be used on many conditions.  These two balls are the best Hammer balls on the market in my opinion.

Sorry about the highjack.


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six pack

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2006, 07:55:38 PM »
plus the widow has a really cool looking spider on it,the other ball dose'nt.LOL.I think the big backend craze has something to do with the change in oil patterns and type of oil being used today,not alot of room on the outsides to generate the big backend move and more carrydown due to the oil not breaking down as fast.around a few years back my synergy ets would snap like how my widow dose now but I bet on today's shot the same ball would be considered a lite oil ball.I've had/have plenty of backend balls but what I like about the widow is that it's not as snappy as most balls in the same category.
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chitown

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #12 on: November 16, 2006, 11:09:45 PM »
ttt
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trogdor

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2006, 08:48:07 AM »
Anyone here own a Domination and a Black Widow?  How do they compare.  The Dominations is supposed to be more "angular" than the angular one (according to some bowling magazine and a few people that own both).
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chitown

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Re: Black Widow vs Angular one
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2006, 09:01:42 AM »
I have the No Mercy, Black Widow, Pain and Doom.  My favortie ball is the PAIN right now.  However my BW has A LOT of back end.  This ball is not short of back end movement.

If the Angular one has a lot more back end than the BW then who would want it?  I mean seriously, why would someone want more back end than that?

I like the look of the angular one.  I think it sounds like a cool ball to try but don't beleive everything that's put out on vid.  

I would just pick which ever one of them you like.  Which one looks better for you.  Both balls will hook a lot on the back end.  Both balls are probably very close in reaction so it's not really going to matter if one hooks 3 boards more.  3 boards is not a lot.

You get my point!
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