BallReviews

Equipment Boards => Hammer => Topic started by: Noy on April 07, 2006, 10:00:56 PM

Title: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 07, 2006, 10:00:56 PM
Hello again all, if you didn't already know, I just got/drilled a DOOM, my first ball ever.  This is a GREAT BALL!  Although I have just started working on a shot that didn't involve two finger cranking (thats what i did with a house ball), whenever I got the ball in or even near the pocket, I was bowling spared and strikes.  My average with a house ball using a two finger cranker stroke is about a 130-150, my first game with the DOOM (could only bowl one game due to time issues) I bowled a 114 which isn't high but I am very pleased with.

Im trying to learn how to put spin on the ball using a fingertip grip while using my thumb and I was getting the hang of it.  Because the ally was about the close after our first game, the manager let us bowl for the extra 15 mins that they were open for free.  By then I had already bowled 3 strikes in the game, and I had a Turkey along with a couple other strikes in the 15min extra.

I know that these numbers dont sound all that great, but for a person who has been playing for almost a month, I think they're superb.  This ball hits so hard and breaks very nicely when I am able to give it enough rotation.  Kudos to Hammer for a great ball.  I will continue to update you guys on my progress as a bowler as time progresses.  

Any pointers on how I can give my ball more spin?
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 09, 2006, 01:29:11 AM
Just keep practicing your basics.  

I suggest that you do an internet search for "Ron Clifton bowling tips".  You will learn a ton of info that is very helpful.  This site also shows you how to rev up the ball nice with your thumb in it.

Remember your learning the basics so don't get frustrated with this process.  Keep a positive mental attitude and you will do great.

Now learning how to rev up the ball with your thumb in it will take a little bit of practice compared to not using your thumb.  Go to that web site I talked about above.  There is you will find most of the info you need.

Good luck!
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 09, 2006, 02:16:38 AM
Hehe, hey Chitown...it seems that every thread marked with "DOOM," you are ready to answer =)  Thats great though, I love this ball as well and if i had the money, id probably shell out to buy 2 more of these and make a DOOM arsenal.

But yea, that site you gave me was a tremendous help.  It taught me a lot of things.  I only wish there were more sites like this with more detailed visuals such as animations or videos.  I am a graphic designer myself and if had all of this knowledge about bowling, I'm sure I could make a pretty great site with instructional videos.  Maybe someone can help me?  

Great site, thanks Chitown, keep the tips coming and the DOOM alive!
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

Edited on 4/9/2006 2:49 AM
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 09, 2006, 03:31:44 AM
what is this Machine u speak of?
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 10, 2006, 02:28:29 AM
So yea, today was my second day out with the DOOM and thanks to that great web site that chitown told me about, I am now finding my stroke.  I played 5 games today, each game getting better and better at putting revs on the ball with my thumb in it.  Every game I stayed within my 130 ave. that i was averaging with the house ball, so if I was able to experiment the whole time, find a stroke, and estay within my average, I'd say that things are lookin great so far.  As for the ball, again, very forgiving and guarantees you at least 8-9 pins if you get it anywhere near the head pin/pocket area.

Thanks for the great site chitown!
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 10, 2006, 10:11:00 AM
quote:
So yea, today was my second day out with the DOOM and thanks to that great web site that chitown told me about, I am now finding my stroke.  I played 5 games today, each game getting better and better at putting revs on the ball with my thumb in it.  Every game I stayed within my 130 ave. that i was averaging with the house ball, so if I was able to experiment the whole time, find a stroke, and estay within my average, I'd say that things are lookin great so far.  As for the ball, again, very forgiving and guarantees you at least 8-9 pins if you get it anywhere near the head pin/pocket area.

Thanks for the great site chitown!
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160


I'm glad your doing great with the new ball.  Bowling is an awesaome sport.  As for the site, Ron Clifton should be the one to thank.  This guy put together some great stuff for free.  All bowlers could learn something from this guy.

Keep practicing and your game will get better in a hurry.  Also just remember a solid spare game is a must if you want to be good.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 11, 2006, 12:05:35 PM
So yea, I dont think I'm getting enough reaction/hook on the ball.  I am to the point where I am bowling with medium revs with average ball speed.  I dont know how to explain a layout, but I'll do my best:

Left handed drilled
Big White dot (pin?) About 1" - 1.5" to the left, and .5" above of my ring finger.
Other small circle (engraved dot, cg?) is right in the palm of my hand.
My pro shop guy suggested that since this is my first ball I go with a basic layout, but if there is a name to this sort of layout I would love to hear it.

I bowl up the 2nd arrow, but the amount of hook i get combined with my rev/ball speed isnt enough to carry through the pins which leaves me with a lot of 10 pins for some reason.  Would it be better to plug and redrill for a more reactive layout or should I just sand it down a bit?
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: T Brockette on April 11, 2006, 12:19:54 PM
Noy,

No need to plug and redrill, or resurface in my opinion. Since you are a left hander, are you leaving 10 pins or are you leaving 7 pins. If you are leaving alot of 7 pins, try these couple of things first before doing anything to the equipment. Either move to your left about one board with your feet or move back on the approach just a bit, say around 3" or so, and see if this stops your 7 pin problems. If your leaving 10 pins, you could be coming up light, try moving to your left again about a couple of boards. Hope this helps.
--------------------
Tracy

Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 11, 2006, 11:24:51 PM
T brockette is right.  Don't hurry to get a plug and redrill job.  all you need is to adjust to the lanes.  Don't forget your new to this so there will be many things to learn.

The layout you desribed sounds like what I would call a label leverage type layout.  Of course this all depends on where your pap is located but for generic purposes that's what it sounds like.  It's a good layout for you to start with.

I wouldn't change the cover or layout until you learn to hit your target consistantly and practice more.  Plus the lanes your on may not be a good match for the line your playing.  There are so many factors involved it's very difficult to give you a real accurate answer over the internet.  Just be patient and you will learn and get better.

You have a great ball and a solid layout.  Sometimes you will bowl on some lanes that may have too much oil for the ball but you can always learn to throw it slower.  The key to getting good fast is to really practice on your fundamentals.  Don't even pay attention to your score.  High scores is for league and practice is to get better.

Good luck.  Another good tip is to purchase strike pass on the PBA web site.  This way you can view a lot of PBA events and learn by watching the pros.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 14, 2006, 02:19:03 AM
Okay, update...

Bowled two games tonight, i think the lanes are too slick for this ball, especially during the times that i bowl (at night after league play is done).  I still bowl my average but I swear if this ball gave me a lil more back end reaction Id stop leaving those nasty 5, 6, and 10 pins when hitting the pocket dead on.  Im putting med revs on the ball so it shouldnt be that.

Maybe I'll take the ball out for 2 more sessions before I think about a more reactive drilling or sanding.  Maybe sand the back flares so the ball still holds its skid through the front, but gives me more reaction through the back end.   keep you updated =)
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: ImaRedbird on April 14, 2006, 03:02:59 AM
did u slow down your speed? that works 4 me
--------------------
Stop Crying, Shut Up and BOWL!!! Everybody throws  gutterballs back to back at one point in their life Getting Zero is an accomplishent that you should be proud of!!!
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 14, 2006, 03:10:34 AM
well i have medium ball speed, anything slower wont drive through
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: El Capitán on April 14, 2006, 03:58:38 AM
hey man, good choice on a first hook ball!

Hope you stick with bowling, and progress further and further with your skill.

Just practice man.  Practice is the name of the game!

Coaching isn't a bad idea either.
--------------------
A little boy looked up at me once and said "So you must be The Striking King."  Coolest thing I've been told!
I'm pretty positive I'll shoot 300... just not sure when.

Visit me:: http://www.myspace.com/3_0_0

Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 14, 2006, 09:32:55 AM
If you feel that the ball isn't grabbing enough because of to much oil then go ahead and dull it with some scotchbrite.  Dull it before you redrill it.  Once you dull this ball you wont have to worry about it not hooking enough.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 14, 2006, 12:45:48 PM
any instructions on how to do this myself, or should i pay my pro shop guy and have him do it?  I learned about pros dulling down the back flares of the ball to increase reaction on the back end while having clean skid through the front, thats really what i want to do.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 14, 2006, 05:57:42 PM
quote:
any instructions on how to do this myself, or should i pay my pro shop guy and have him do it?  I learned about pros dulling down the back flares of the ball to increase reaction on the back end while having clean skid through the front, thats really what i want to do.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160


You can do it yourself.  Go to your local walmart and buy some blue and green scotchbrite pads.  If you can get a hold of some grey pads that would be great to.  Walmart does not carry the grey.

Blue- 1000 grit
grey- 800 grit
Green- 600 grit

Take the ball down to 600 grit.  I would take it to the pro shop because he will have a ball spinner which makes it easier to do.  Now a lot of people say not to dull a pearlized ball but don't listen to them.  If your pro shop guy tells you that he does not recomend it then tell him to humor you and do it anyways.  Bring the pads to the pro shop and tell him to use them.  This way you know he is bringing the ball don to the grit you want.  

Once this is done you wont believe the difference in the amount of oil the Doom can handle when dulled.  This should do the trick for you.

Let us know how it worked.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: duvallite on April 18, 2006, 01:36:49 PM
Chitown is right about successfully dulling a pearl-particle.  I dulled my 1500 grit Storm Depth Charge with a green scotchbrite, and it made a BIG difference in the strength of the ball, way better for me than the OOB cover on our oily synthetic lanes, especially with carrydown.  I've since changed it again using the grey scotchbrite, with just a hint of Track Magic Shine afterwards to give me a little more separation from my Phenom Unleashed at 600 grit (green scotchbrite).  Good combo.

Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 18, 2006, 06:40:12 PM
Thanks Chi for the info.  I called my pro shop guy today to see what he can do and I'm takin it in today to get it dulled down to 500grit abralon.  Now, if i use polish on it (ie Ebonite Factory Finish), will it raise the grit or simply add shine to it?  I cant wait to try this ball at 500grit.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 18, 2006, 11:46:32 PM
quote:
Thanks Chi for the info.  I called my pro shop guy today to see what he can do and I'm taking it in today to get it dulled down to 500grit abralon.  Now, if i use polish on it (ie Ebonite Factory Finish), will it raise the grit or simply add shine to it?  I cant wait to try this ball at 500grit.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160


Don't polish it after it's dulled.  Otherwise your defeating the purpose of what your trying to do by dulling it.  If the ball is too strong once dulled to 500 grit then you can decide if you want to bring it back to a polished state.  Or you could dull it up to like 1000 grit and no polish.  Just work with it until you get the desired reaction from the cover change.

I have 3 Dooms.  Well two of them are drilled the same.  There drilled for length and back end.  My other Doom is drilled for overall strength.  Well the 2 I have drilled for length one fo them is box and the other is dulled to 1000 grit.  What a 2 ball combo.  I can start with the dull and when the lanes break down I can go to the box condition one.  

Another thing I have found to work real well.  I have started many games in league using the box condition Doom.  Well when the lanes start to transition and the pocket seems hard to locate I quickly grab my 1000 grit dull Doom.  I up the ball speed a little and it really smoothes the break point but hits like a MISSLE.  Then by the third game the lanes have transitioned and I go back to the Box Doom and wheel it from Deep.  

This is one fantastic ball.  If you ever get a chance to own two of them do it.  I also recommend drilling them the same and dulling one.  Makes a perfect 2 ball combo.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 19, 2006, 12:43:59 AM
So I bowled a full 3 games today after not playing for a week, but, before hand I dulled my ball down to 500 abralon.  I must say, I am very pleased with the results.  I didnt bowl to great today (87,169,98...inconsistent i kno), but i am very happy with the reaction.  One thing I found out though is that I got the ball drilled too weak.  When I initially bought the ball, I asked for a basic layout not knowing that the ball was gonig to be this week in hooking.  So eventually when I start getting better, im gonna have to get this ball redrilled.  Maybe 4x4, but we'll see.

Any tips on how to impart revs?  I think im more of a low-med rever.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on April 19, 2006, 08:10:28 AM
A label leverage drilling is not a problem.  I have most of my equipment drilled this way, and it is not really a "weak" drilling, of course a lot of that depends on your PAP and such.  Take that money you would have used to redrill the ball and get some lessons.  They will help you more than any change in equipment will.  

Edited on 4/19/2006 9:27 AM
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 19, 2006, 09:18:17 AM
Spledorex is totally correct.  Your label drilling is not a weak drilling.  It may not be the strongest but it should work very good for you with this ball.  Remeber cover is about 75 percent of a balls reaction.

I would concentrate on learning how to develop an "A-GAME".  An "A-GAME" is a bowlers most comfortable release.  You need to learn to develop as a bowler.  

Do an internet search for "Ron Cliftons bowling tips"  There is some great info on there that will help your bowling.  He also has an article on there about increasing revs.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 19, 2006, 12:59:06 PM
Hey chitown, I already pmed you but just wanted to say thanks again, as well as everyone else that has contributed to my learning process.  I dont expect to be pro-hooking right off the bat and it was my mistake to make it seem like that was what I wanted.  I know things like this take a while to learn and while I am still pretty young (21yrs old), I have a whole lifetime ahead of me to get better.  Lately I've been working on accuracy, revs, and wrist strength.  As much as i hate to admit it, I think my wrist is more suited for a 12lb ball right now but I'm toughing it out and using a 14lb ball while also lifting weights and doing wrist strengthening exercises.  Hopefully in about a couple of weeks ill gain the strength to have more control of my ball.

Will keep you guys updated!
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on April 19, 2006, 01:00:57 PM
Some people might not suggest this, but you also might try a wrist brace if you have problems with wrist strength.  I can't bowl without my Robby's Revs II.  A lot of people on this board have disdain for such things, though.    You can always get one to use while you work on strengthening your wrist, and ditch it later.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 19, 2006, 04:13:50 PM
Hehe, I do use a wrist brace, but its a basic robby's brace, nothin to help rev.  Kinda regret that I got it on account that I found more and better ones after the guy restocked his inventory.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on April 19, 2006, 05:53:14 PM
Is it just one of those leather type robby's?  Or is it a metal one?  I love the revs II, and they aren't that expensive online.  Oh, and one more thing, don't get too hung up on revs.    I'm sure you've heard the phrase before, but in many, MANY cases, straighter is greater!  You just want to be able to hit your spot consistently and find a comfortable line to the pocket, don't get hung up on trying to make your ball move in a hockey stick type way.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 20, 2006, 12:04:39 PM
its the standard leather with metal reinforcement.

About the "straighter is greater" line.  My friend who is learning along with me bowls straight as an arrow.  Should he eventually learn to at least curve into the pocket.  I've seen numerous times where he's left 4, 5, and 7's and I tell him, "if your ball hooked a lil, it would have drove through that would have been a strike.."
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on April 20, 2006, 12:08:38 PM
First, try a better wrist brace.  IMHO, those leather ones don't do a whole lot if you have a weak wrist.  They work fine for more experienced players with developed games.

Second, when I say straighter is greater, I don't mean straight as an arrow.  You still want at least some turn and drive, unless you go full roller, which is hard to do I understand.  I just mean that you don't need to hook off the deck to be successful at bowling, and that in many cases, it's better if you don't.  Take a look at some of the best PBA players of all time, and see how many of them didn't have a ton of movement.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 20, 2006, 12:36:03 PM
will take your advice splendor on a new wristbrace.  I think my friends dad uses the robby rev II.  The ball looks beautiful coming off his hands. (But of course, I know I shouldnt let the brace do all the work)
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 21, 2006, 03:09:34 AM
Hey all, got back from another practice session.  I think what i need to do is just go out by myself once and work on my game.  I scored a 110 and 134, couldnt play a whole 3 games due to time.  The thing is is that I'm always going out with at least 5-8 friends which messes up the whole flow of things.  At least I'm gettin a lil more consistent.  I swear my score would be higher if I could convert those pesky spares (especially those damn 7 and 10 singles).  I'm gettin better and more consistent, just need a lil bit of practice time so i can try things without feeling the need to be competitive with my friends.

Keepin ya updated!
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 21, 2006, 10:37:12 AM
quote:
Hey all, got back from another practice session.  I think what i need to do is just go out by myself once and work on my game.  I scored a 110 and 134, couldnt play a whole 3 games due to time.  The thing is is that I'm always going out with at least 5-8 friends which messes up the whole flow of things.  At least I'm gettin a lil more consistent.  I swear my score would be higher if I could convert those pesky spares (especially those damn 7 and 10 singles).  I'm gettin better and more consistent, just need a lil bit of practice time so i can try things without feeling the need to be competitive with my friends.

Keepin ya updated!
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808


That's a great idea.  You should practice by yourself.  This way your focused on your game.  

Spares are the most important part of this game.  If you have a solid spare game the strikes will come.  Opens frames kill a game.  Take the time to learn a straight spare system.  I'm talking about throwing the ball straight as an arrow at all spares.  

Good luck and keep us posted.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 21, 2006, 11:16:14 AM
Yea, I was throwing the ball straight, well kinda..Like if I left a 7 pin (im a lefty) then I would try to bowl from right to left (corner to corner)using rotation.  I choose to do this so that I can keep a consistent release.  I didnt leave a lot of 10 pins and when i did I converted all of them, and I think i went like 30% on my 7 pin conversions.  Just tryin to develop a consistent release w/ rotation.  Again, right now score really doesnt matter to me except for when i play with buddies and I think thats whats holding me back...the need to score rather than the need to improve when im out with friends.  

I am going to the lanes by myself in a couple of hours...we'll see what happens

Stay tuned...
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 21, 2006, 04:30:32 PM
I bowled today during my lunch hour, got a 116, 132, 148..not bad, but I think I figured out what I can do.  I noticed that my thumb gets stuck in the ball a lot.  Not really stuck, but sticks, i dunno..it stays in there a split second more than it should and I'm noticing it.  I think I'm going to install a thumb slug for easier evac of my thumb.  Also, I think I could use a lil more forward pitch on my thumb to help me control the ball more.  I dont have large hands and I need all the palm i can get to control my ball.  Waht do u guys think?
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on April 21, 2006, 09:04:38 PM
quote:
I bowled today during my lunch hour, got a 116, 132, 148..not bad, but I think I figured out what I can do.  I noticed that my thumb gets stuck in the ball a lot.  Not really stuck, but sticks, i dunno..it stays in there a split second more than it should and I'm noticing it.  I think I'm going to install a thumb slug for easier evac of my thumb.  Also, I think I could use a lil more forward pitch on my thumb to help me control the ball more.  I dont have large hands and I need all the palm i can get to control my ball.  Waht do u guys think?
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808


Well I would be careful with forward thumb pitch.  If your thumb is sticking you may just need to get the thumb hole worked out to fit better.  Plus you don't want to squeeze a lot with your thumb if you can help it.  I would just talk with your pro shop guy about your thumb situation.

Just keep practicing and it will pay off.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 28, 2006, 03:56:16 AM
Wow, great day of bowling today, well for me at least.  135, 169, 127...good day in my opinion.  Watching my average creep up into the 140-150 range.

While I was bowling, I noticed that i wasnt "answering the phone" when I bowled.  My hand never really followed through the shot.  So every time i bowled, i kept a mental note in my head to follow through and boy did that help my game.  A lot more revs and a lot more accuracy.  Spares were coming a lot more as I started to understand how to adjust myself according to where I wanted to place the ball.  Went like 80% on my 7 pin conversions (lefty).  I would still like to invest in a Pro Release Extended as my wrist is a little weak and I dont wanna drop below 14lbs.

Birthday comin up, lookin to get an Action/UTPP combo for my bday and hopefully a 10lb White Dot for a spare ball.  Yea yea, Im an equipment junky, who isnt on these forums?

Will keep u guys updated!
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on April 28, 2006, 08:30:41 AM
Ok, first of all, don't go all the way down to 10 with your spare ball.  You'll throw it like a rocket and it won't help your game.  You can drop to 14 for the spare ball, but that's as low as I'd go.

Also, I highly recommend AGAINST getting anything other than a spare ball.  I wasted a LOT of time in my early bowling days getting new equipment.  Until you are consistent with what you have, new equipment will make very little difference.  Your best bet right now is to ONLY use that Doom, at least until you're well over a 150 average.  I know it's nice to get new equipment, but believe me when I say it will only delay your development as a bowler at this time.  If you want to get a new ball and only use that one, that's fine, but don't try to build an arsenal at this point, it can only confuse the situation.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on April 28, 2006, 09:15:47 AM
Hmm, will take your words into consideration splendor.  Im already bowling with a 14lb ball which is why I thought 10 would be a good drop for more control over a spare ball.  If im bowling a 14, whats the lowest i should go?
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on April 28, 2006, 10:29:14 AM
If you're already bowling with 14, I'd go to 13 at the most.  My preference is to stay at the same weight with everything.  You might think you'll get more control by dropping a few pounds, but in fact it might make your swing more inconsistent overall.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: ImaRedbird on April 28, 2006, 02:24:55 PM
That i will agree with. I started where you are now Noy jus last yr. Getting a lot of equipment isn't really the key until u get consistent and you know what your Doom will do. Also 13 is cool for spares. If u can grab a coach. I found mine on bowl.com from the usbc site. Free lessons etc. Which is cool. The man helped me get my timin correct, my average is up by 27 something odd pins. Keep it up though.
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Stop Crying, Shut Up and BOWL!!! Everybody throws  gutterballs back to back at one point in their life Getting Zero is an accomplishent that you should be proud of!!!
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on May 04, 2006, 12:34:53 AM
So I got a slug installed into my doom today to fix the sticky thumb problem..shot 106, 169, 179 and again, damn happy.  If you click on the link in my signature, you can see that my average is slowly going up now that I'm getting into the groove of things.  My spare shooting is improving every time i go out, I'm remembering more to follow through, etc.  Hopefully soon I get to where a full follow through is second nature and I dont have to tell myself every 2-3 frames to do it.
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on May 10, 2006, 01:51:20 AM
So i bowled a 167-136-132 series today.  Great thing is that my spare game is really improving and its thanks to the controlable backend that this ball has to offer.  The 7 pins that used to stay standing on the strike attempt are not standing anymore, but rather im leaving the 5 pin a lot for some reason.  In my 136 game, i only had 2 open frames which is the best ive done and the other games i only left opens when i had splits.  My running average has increased to 141, so im gettin better =)

While I am still learning to find my lines to the strike zone, I find this ball great for picking up spares with its label leverage drilling.  I was going to have this redrilled to 4x4 but I think I will end up keeping it label due to its great control and predictability.  Great for picking up multipin spares.

We'll see how it compliments my Agent next monday =) (i know im gonna get a lot of lip for that =)
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: ImaRedbird on May 10, 2006, 05:57:44 AM
Noy instead of grabbing another strike ball i would say for u to invest in a spare ball. Don't matter which one, a white dot, viz-a-ball,maxim, or zone. But to become accurate you should work with a nice piece of plastic.
--------------------
Stop Crying, Shut Up and BOWL!!! Everybody throws  gutterballs back to back at one point in their life Getting Zero is an accomplishent that you should be proud of!!!
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on May 10, 2006, 07:59:23 AM
If you're leaving a lot of five pins, you aren't getting very much drive through the pocket.  A five pin is a sign of a weak or deflecting ball.  Your release is probably very inconsistent right now, which will be a huge factor.  Forget the Agent, get some lessons!  (Why doesn't anyone ever listen to good advice??)  
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: azguy on May 10, 2006, 08:16:35 AM
Testosterone ?
--------------------
AZ Guy aka: R & L Bowlers Pro
rlbowlerspro@cox.net
www.rlbowlerspro.com

Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on May 10, 2006, 08:25:41 AM
Azguy, I think that's a great answer!  
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on May 10, 2006, 09:49:32 AM
Haha, I knew I would get some bad feedback after i mentioned the Agent.  Actually, a lot of folks at my house are very helpful and tend to observe while my friend and I are bowling.  These are the types of folks that are at the alley 24/7.  They've already started to give us tips to better our game...hopefully as we build better relationships with these guys, it'll be a lot easier to ask for advice.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on May 10, 2006, 09:58:20 AM
Splendorex has giving you some great advice.  You will improve a lot faster with some coaching.  A coach can point out flaws in your game that can be corrected quickly before they become bad habits.

Sawbones is a guy that posts on the misc. section a lot.  He has said many times that he would not allow his son to have more than 1 reactive ball.  He said that before he would allow his son to have a multi ball arsenal he needed to learn to adjust and get better with that 1 ball.  

That is very sound advice.

In fact, a good way to practice over the summer is to use only 1 reactive ball.  Use this ball for every lane condition.  A reactive pearl is the best choice for this because it can handle dry lanes for the most part.  If the lanes have a lot of oil the bowler can learn to adjust by using an end over end release, speed changes ect... .

So just keep your Doom and don't redrill it it.  Label leverage is a good layout.  You can get plenty of power form the Doom with that layout.  If that is not happening and your leaving a lot of 5 pins then you need to change something in your game to get a more powerful release.  Also power does not mean more revs all the time.

I prefer to swing the ball.  There are times when I use the end over end release and play a down and in line.  Even though the end over end has a lot less revs than my A game release it still generates a ton of power at the pins.

So to close this reply get some coaching in stead of buying another ball.  Your getting advice from bowlers that have been there and done that.  It is sound advice that you should consider.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on May 10, 2006, 09:59:45 AM
Tips are one thing, Noy, but focused lessons are an entirely different animal.  You are at the perfect point to start getting them before you develop really bad habits.  Take that 200 or whatnot you'd spend on the agent, and get yourself a fleet of lessons.  I flat out GUARANTEE that it will make a MUCH larger impact on your game than another ball.  That's what you really want, isn't it?  Besides all of that, IMO (and Chi's), you have one of the best balls going right now.

Edited on 5/10/2006 9:59 AM
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on May 10, 2006, 12:55:09 PM
Trust me guys, I am taking your advice and have even talked to my friend about splitting the cost to take lessons with Mr. Webb.  My other friend's dad is a 220+ ave bowler and im sure we can take him out as well since he's always bowling.

To clear things up, I myself am not buying the ball.  This is a present from my girlfriend for my bday.  So I say, "free ball? why not?"  I know you guys have a lot more experience than me and i really appreciate your help.  Don't think I'm not taking your advice.

I'll be setting up a bowling blog soon and will start to video tape myself to display my progress online in addition to LESSONS..LOL.

So please, instead of the "lessons" lecture which, i assure you, has been drilled into my head, offer tips on what can be done.

Chi, you mention an "over release," can you provide me with detailed info on what it does?  I'm all about researching and getting every detail right about what I do.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on May 10, 2006, 01:13:53 PM
Noy,

It's not even about the money.  You actually hurt your game more than help it by having more than one ball right away.  You need to learn the game, and having equipment that acts differently, and having to wonder "do I need to change balls?" will only delay your progress.  Think about it this way:  If you were trying to learn to fly a plane, wouldn't you rather practice in the same plane, with the same control layout, and same characteristics all the time?  I mean, you would think taking a lesson in a cessna one week and in a B52 the next would make it significantly more difficult to absorb the basics.  Believe me, it ain't about whether it's free or not.  Do you have a good pair of bowling shoes?  Maybe have her get you those instead.  
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on May 10, 2006, 01:56:08 PM
Haha, touche Splendor, touche.  My shoes are fine and she already bought it.  This is a big thread dont u think?  Splendor, Chi, RedBird, thanks for the tips on bowling lessons and aresenal additions, I think ive had enough of them to last me  the rest of the year.  As I said, lets try to make a change in advice...

When you guys bowl, do u guys drop the ball forward or lay it down close to the wood?  Also, whats better to get lower to the ground, bending my back, or bending my knees?

I've seen bowlers bring the ball above their heads on the back swing, I find this a little hard to do with a free motion swing.  Are these guys using extra muscle to lift the ball back more?
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Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: ImaRedbird on May 10, 2006, 02:00:22 PM
Where the main reason i can say anything as close to you in my opinion is because i was literally where you are last year. I was just learning to bowl, but if you take a look at my profile, hard work, my coach and constant practicing and my determination made me better.

But The MOST IMPORTANT That I Had To Learn Was I Needed To Stop BEING HARD HEADED AND LISTEN TO WHAT A LOT OF THESE FOLKS ON HERE TOLD ME TO DO! Plain and Simple.

As far as muscling the ball, you're not supposed to do that...or at least that's what i was taught. Some people say that it's ok if u have a high backswing, i don't see the point and that also makes you inaccurate but it's kinda hard to tell u anything when no one knows what you bowl like.
--------------------
Stop Crying, Shut Up and BOWL!!! Everybody throws  gutterballs back to back at one point in their life Getting Zero is an accomplishent that you should be proud of!!!

Edited on 5/10/2006 2:11 PM
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: splendorlex on May 10, 2006, 02:05:11 PM
You'll have to forgive me, Noy, but I have no more advice to give.  I sort of have a sore spot, due to circumstances which have nothing to do with you, with people who ask for advice but then "do their own thing" anyhow.  No offense, but I have no more advice that will help you.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: Noy on May 10, 2006, 04:32:52 PM
Well then thats fine.  Again, your advice is much appreciated Splendor.

Redbird...im not the hard headed type, I may do things that you dont agree with like buy a new ball, but I also do things that you guys suggest in addition.  Just coz I buy a new ball which is against your guyses advices doesnt mean im not gonna take lessons which is what you guys are harping on.

I guess this thread is very tired and is due for retirement.  I thank everyone who has contributed and hopefully when I start to post vids and such, the constructive criticism will keep coming.
--------------------
Bowling Since March 2006

Arsenal:
Doom Raw Hammer
House Ball (spares)
Average: 130-160

See my bowling scores online here:
http://www.allbowling.com/journal/public.php?uid=2038&leagueid=808
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: LowRev on May 10, 2006, 05:00:13 PM
I can add to this conversation I have had a 150ish average for a year and a half.

I got a coach because I wanted to be a better bowler and it was obvious that I wasn't going to improve on my own anymore. I was as good as I was going to get without help.

It cost $50.00 for the first lesson and now it is $35.00 a lesson. I go once a month. I have improved in release consistency, spare shooting and a lot of the topics covered in this thread. I had a lot of bad habits that had all become muscle memory and I have had to practice a lot to change them.

I placed 4th in a recent tournament in Daly City it was in the handicap division but I still won money.

I think the lessons were worth it

As to building an arsenal. When you go to this site it is hard not to get caught up in the purchasing of new equipment but in the beginning you really don't need to buy a lot of balls. It is really true. You probably don't have to buy a lot of balls ever...but it is fun to get a new ball. :-)

Having said that I have bought two this year because my coach recommended that I go up in weight (I have a tendency to muscle the ball) a solid particle and a pearl reactive both 16lb. I already had a spare ball 14LBS. I wasn't going to buy any equipment this year but, "hey my coach recommended I buy a new ball."

This is all I am going to buy until I get my average to a sustainable 180. I can bowl a good series (and for me that is 550 and up) but I still can't do it every week.

I am going to take advice from this thread and bowl all summer with just one strike ball and learn to make better adjustments to conditions.
--------------------
Jeff

LowRev and Lovin' it
--Well more like Medium Revs and a lot more axis tilt since I switched to finger tip.
Title: Re: DOOM first impressions
Post by: chitown on May 11, 2006, 03:56:31 PM
LowRev made some great points.  I'm myself am guilty of buying more balls than I should.  In all reality there is not a need for a new bowler to buy more than two balls until they learn to get better.

I am going to take the one ball approach this summer.  Of course unless I do a tournament.  The 1 ball approach will teach a bowler a lot.  I'm talking about the 1 ball strike ball approach.  I'm not talking about not using your plastic spare ball.

So listen to the advice and get some lessons because they will go a long way.  Then once you find yourself getting a lot better go shopping and have some fun with a new arsenal of 3 or 4 balls.  Just don't waste your money yet.

I hope all of the advice from everyone helps you outr.  Good luck!