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Author Topic: Gas mask core  (Read 15965 times)

qstick777

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Gas mask core
« on: October 04, 2007, 07:15:00 AM »
Okay, we know Hammer has used the core in a couple of balls (as listed below).  I'm just wondering why it seems that only the Black Widow line has really been a success.

I remember hearing that the Big Blue (and Pearl) was either love or hate.  I don't remember hearing anything about the Big Deal.  Same core as the BW.  What makes the BW line that much better than the rest?  Is it just a great combo of core and coverstock?


Big Blue:  http://123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2144

Big Blue Pearl:  http://123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2273

Added flip block:

Big Deal:  http://123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2577

BW:  http://123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2871

BWP:  http://123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2966
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Djarum

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2007, 04:13:46 PM »
The big deal and big blue pearl were really popular and impressive around here.

Dj
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The views and opinions of Djarum expressed on BallReviews.com do not necessarily state or reflect those of the BallReviews.com.
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JMORRIS

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2007, 04:15:52 PM »
According to my driller, 80% of the ball reaction is due to the coverstock, not the core.
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pjr300

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2007, 05:11:38 PM »

Tried a used big deal and it was not near the ball as the Black Widow.


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pjr300
Specs and Transaction history in my profile...

BuddiesProShopcom - Bill

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2007, 07:17:44 PM »
After the original Deal was released, Ebonite/Hammer when through a big coverstock change.  They spent months on developing the new coverstock, and the Black Widow features the new version of this coverstock.  The older balls didn't absorb much oil.

I had a Big Blue Pearl and a Big Deal, and they were both great balls.  I drilled 3 of the Big Deal, and would have drilled more if I could have gotten my hands on them.
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Bill
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bluerrpilot

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2007, 07:51:55 PM »
quote:
According to my driller, 80% of the ball reaction is due to the coverstock, not the core.


Cool...that means I can put the pin pretty much where ever I want and just alter the cover to get the desired shot shape
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RealBowler

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2007, 10:51:03 PM »
quote:
quote:
According to my driller, 80% of the ball reaction is due to the coverstock, not the core.


Cool...that means I can put the pin pretty much where ever I want and just alter the cover to get the desired shot shape
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TEAM HammerHead
2008 USBC Nationals
ABQ, NM


Only if you take all your covers to 4000!

quote:
Current arsenal:

Hammer Black Widow - Pin above bridge, 45 deg MB, 4000 grit Coverstock

Ebonite Total NV - trick layout, Pin 4 1/2" from PAP, 1 1/2" from VAL, MB 80 deg, x-hole to remove excess finger weight, 4000 with polish

Raw Hammer Toxic - Drilled pin above bridge, CG strong, 4000 grit polished Coverstock

Hammer Vibe Blue - light oil ball, 4000 grit with polish

Ebonite Maxim Captain Midnight - Spare ball


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JMORRIS

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2007, 07:56:02 AM »
quote:
Only if you take all your covers to 4000!


In case you didn't know, those are all the factory finishes.

Edited on 10/5/2007 7:56 AM
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Djarum

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2007, 08:11:24 AM »
I'm not sure. The CT particle on the razor blade is awesome. No, it doesn't have the oil absorbtion that new ebo/hammer covers have, but I guarantee they last longer. I was able to use this ball on heavier patterns like shark and scorpion. No, I couldn't swing the ball, but I was able to get them to the pocket and carry.

Dj
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bluerrpilot

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2007, 08:53:16 AM »
quote:

Only if you take all your covers to 4000!



So I can put the pin on all my stuff 4" from pap, change all the covers to 4000 and pretty much get a different reaction on each one just because the coverstocks are different.


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2008 USBC Nationals
ABQ, NM
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JMORRIS

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2007, 09:26:18 AM »
You can have 4 balls with the same layout, at different surfaces and have 4 different reaction shapes.

That was not my plan with my arsenal, as I have different layouts, with similar surfaces, that provide different reactions.

Bottom line, the coverstock on the Widow is what makes it supperior to previous balls with the same core.
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RealBowler

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2007, 10:18:38 AM »
quote:
quote:
Only if you take all your covers to 4000!


In case you didn't know, those are all the factory finishes.

Edited on 10/5/2007 7:56 AM


Indeed they are!

Ball companies just love that 4000 Abralon!  Oh, remember the days when everything was 1500 grit - sanded or polished?
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Matt Fortney

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2007, 03:02:00 PM »
The cover is huge (and probably main) part of the BW and BWP's success in my opinion. In addition, I think that Hammer was tinkering and changing the core ever so slightly. I think they knew this core could be something great once they got it perfect. This is shown based on the fact that in the BW series the RG changed from 2.51 as it had been in all the versions previous this series, to 2.50. The diff. also has a lot to do with core. My guess is they were changing small, even un-seen things about this core. JMO.

Matt
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bluerrpilot

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2007, 12:48:32 AM »
quote:
You can have 4 balls with the same layout, at different surfaces and have 4 different reaction shapes.

......, as I have different layouts, with similar surfaces, that provide different reactions.



Then which is it ??? if different surfaces have different shapes then similar surfaces should have similar shapes. But then again, theres that pesky core layout.

Ok, lets say I have 3 Hammer Anger's. All are 3 3/8" pin to pap and same distance from grip center. Each one has a different surface prep. Your saying on the same oil pattern, I'll have one ball that is very long with not much backend, one that rolls very early with a smooth arc and one that rolls later with a more angular move....? I dont think so

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2008 USBC Nationals
ABQ, NM
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JMORRIS

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Re: Gas mask core
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2007, 10:27:52 AM »
My original post in this thread was:

 
quote:
According to my driller, 80% of the ball reaction is due to the coverstock, not the core.  


I don't know where the guy came up with 80%.  I think his key point was, regardless of the layout, the ball I was buying was still going to be strong because of the coverstock.  He was right.  Despite putting the pin 5.5" from my PAP, the ball is still aggressive.

quote:
Ok, lets say I have 3 Hammer Anger's. All are 3 3/8" pin to pap and same distance from grip center. Each one has a different surface prep. Your saying on the same oil pattern, I'll have one ball that is very long with not much backend, one that rolls very early with a smooth arc and one that rolls later with a more angular move....? I dont think so


I don't understand your last post here...Are saying that changing the surface on these three identical balls, won't change the reaction?  If so, your wrong.
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