Post by: wlee107 on November 19, 2006, 09:20:58 AM
Does anybody have some inputs or suggestions?--------------------
Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 05:25:33 PM
Are the pin/CG and HART lined up?
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Scott
Post by: DukeHarding on November 19, 2006, 06:13:32 PM
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Duke Harding
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Bowling Coaches Web Site Link (http://"http://www.bowlingcoach.com/")
Enjoy These Vintage Bowling Photos! (http://"http://homepage.mac.com/dukeharding/")
Post by: wlee107 on November 19, 2006, 06:22:08 PM
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:22:39 PM
But, we need more real info. to help wlee107.
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Scott
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:25:13 PM
quote:
cotts33, i am a power stroker with med-high revs. The proshop laid it out using the #1 layout...i believe it's the agressive layout?. I normally use it on a house shot and freshly oiled lanes in a league. Should i polish it up? Any suggestions would help!
What are the static weights? Are the pin/CG and HART marking lined up or is the CG marking higher up towards the middle finger?
Many will say static weights mean nothing. I say on this ball BS. If it has a lot of negative side it's going to be fine on fresh and like crap later in games and sets.
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Scott
Post by: wlee107 on November 19, 2006, 06:27:03 PM
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:29:37 PM
quote:
If you need any more info or pictures, please tell me! lol i'll do anything to get my no mercy to work!! Your right, on fresh oil it hits pretty good...but when theres carrydown, it hits like a baby!
You've got the same problem as I do. Does it look like this? Or roughly like that?
.......O....O.P
.......CG
.......H.O
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Scott
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:31:46 PM
It will give you ideas of what I am seeing.
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Scott
Post by: wlee107 on November 19, 2006, 06:32:43 PM
http://img390.imageshack.us/img390/377/dsc00777xp4.jpg
Should i still take it down to 1000 or 2000?
What do you mean by negative weight?
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:40:01 PM
That means the ball has a lot of negative weight. Basically looks a lot like mine. You must already have a weight hole or you are very close to being over an ounce on the the ball. Who drilled it? Did he/she weigh it? I really think you need to weigh it up put a weight/X hole somewhere near your NAP rolling it first so you don't clip the extra hole and get your NM back to near 0. Then it will hit with much more continuation at the pins. The amount of neagtive wgiht is effecting it on carry down. Do this first and I bet you'll worry less about surface.
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Scott
Post by: wlee107 on November 19, 2006, 06:42:51 PM
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:44:21 PM
It's very funny that Hammer came out with this ball to make drilling simpler or that was one of their reasons anyway and I see this problem surface quite a bit now.
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Scott
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:45:35 PM
quote:
Thank you so much for your help scotts33, i really appreciate it. I'll go by the pro shop tommorow and question him...
wlee107,
Did the driller/pro weigh up your NM on a DoDo scale?
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Scott
Post by: wlee107 on November 19, 2006, 06:48:08 PM
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:52:10 PM
Here is a couple of explanations of why. One from JeffMop from this site....the first one.
http://www.bowlingfans.com/jeff/ballreactionbasics.html
http://www.bowlingball.com/info/theroleofthecg.html
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Scott
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 06:56:35 PM
It's not always surface that needs tweaking especially on this particular ball. It's a different animal and so many haven't even recognized this yet.
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Scott
Post by: wlee107 on November 19, 2006, 06:57:18 PM
link: http://www.rotogrip.com/staff_proshop.aspx
I think he could be trusted...
I'll take it to his shop to discuss about the ball tommorow
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 07:02:20 PM
Please report back. I'd like to hear what the static weights are right now and see if he has a sheepish look on his face if he'll tell you the truth.
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Scott
Post by: chitown on November 19, 2006, 07:15:21 PM
I do know a couple of bowlers that are having problems with this ball and the #1 layout. Mine layout is the #6 one on the drilling sheet.
The guys I known that have been having problems found that playing with the cover helped out a lot. I wonder if the #1 layout is too strong and causing the ball to burn up a bit?
I know mine at 4000 grit is a beast. It grabs the lane big time. If there's dry boards somwehre on the lane this ball responds.
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GO BEARS! Super Bowl bound!
Post by: scotts33 on November 19, 2006, 07:25:19 PM
I definitely would not disagree with you.....surface is important but for many that are having problems with this ball it's more the layout/drilling and the negative weight.
I read your profile and with an A game of 350-420 revs you are not going to have much of a problem conquering some effects of negative side weight. Those with less of a powerful game are going to be effected by static weights a bit more. This is just a guess but you and I have been around awhile so I bet you might agree.
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Scott
Post by: six pack on November 19, 2006, 08:29:16 PM
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B-dub in the house YE'all..
Post by: Djarum on November 20, 2006, 11:37:44 AM
Dj
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The views and opinions of Djarum expressed on BallReviews.com do not necessarily state or reflect those of the BallReviews.com.
Post by: scotts33 on November 20, 2006, 12:02:55 PM
I'm taking the negative out of mine but would have preffered a better lined up NM. The jury is still out as far as I am concerned. These misaligned NM's should have never left the plant or should have been discounted IMO.
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Scott
Post by: clint191 on November 20, 2006, 12:46:18 PM
wlee has posted. I ordered my ball online and when I took
it to the pro shop, the driller said that he'd been sending
all balls where the pin/cg/heart weren't aligned back to Hammer.
He was a little skeptical about drilling it up at first and did
say that it would be hard to get the heart in the track.
At 4000 box finish, this one didn't do too much at all for me. He
took it to 2000 and it started to show signs of life, but it's
still a couple boards weaker than my Hawgzilla at 4000.
She hits hard, but hasn't really been what I was looking for when I
bought it.
Post by: CBowl on November 20, 2006, 02:12:29 PM
Post by: Atochabsh on November 20, 2006, 06:55:04 PM
Erin
Post by: six pack on November 20, 2006, 07:31:10 PM
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B-dub in the house YE'all..
Post by: clint191 on November 21, 2006, 06:48:57 AM
shot my 2nd lowest of the season. I only had one 3 bagger
all night and left so many 10 pins that I lost count.
Even w/ the misaligned heart/cg/pin, this ball still hooks and
finds the pocket. I just seem to be missing out on the hitting
power/carry that I was looking for when I bought this ball.
Yes I did ask for a 3-4 inch pin placement when I normally stick
2-3 pin so shame on me.
I'm not by any means placing blame on Hammer or the driller, but
there sure is a lot of variables to a ball that's supposed to be
easy to drill????
Post by: scotts33 on November 21, 2006, 11:45:08 AM
Did you get your driller to look at your No Mercy and what was the out come?
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Scott
Post by: CBowl on November 21, 2006, 12:03:22 PM
Post by: wlee107 on November 21, 2006, 01:00:06 PM
. I was pretty busy yesterday..I'll reply as soon as i get back.--------------------
Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 21, 2006, 02:07:44 PM
quote:
The bad drilling is not the fault of the manufacture. The blame should be on the pro shop not not attending the seminar or trying to learn more about the ball before drilling. No Mercy is a easy ball to payout but it does need some sort of thinking.
CBowl,
Fully agree but also Hammer needs to own up and warn their distributors and pro shops that misaligned balls need some care in drilling.
This is copied direct from Hammer's website.........
"Hammer Aggressive Reaction Technology (HART)
Hammer is very pleased to introduce the new Hammer Aggressive Reaction Technology (HART) core concept to the bowling industry. Developed by our team of design engineers, this radical new concept in bowling ball core design provides maximum performance without the need for exotic layouts and weightholes. It is that simple ."
With a direct line Pin/CG and HART sure I'll agree BUT with misaligned balls that Hammer manufactured and sold.......THEY Hammer need to also work with their distributors and pro shops.
But, I do agree any pro driller worth his/her salt better know how to use a DoDo scale and work to get the balls he/she sells so they are legal and usable.
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Scott
Post by: Badger856 on November 21, 2006, 02:29:29 PM
Seems many are having the same problem with the NM as you and I spoke about earlier. I noticed you mentioned a lefty could take it, shoot me an email to explain this better. I did purchase the Special Agent, and it is exactly what I was looking for. Fantastic ball.
Post by: scotts33 on November 21, 2006, 02:37:56 PM
Sent you PM.
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Scott
Post by: wlee107 on November 21, 2006, 03:54:37 PM
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: wlee107 on November 21, 2006, 03:54:41 PM
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Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: wlee107 on November 21, 2006, 03:55:07 PM
--------------------
Hammer No Mercy 14#
Brunswick Power Groove 12#
Brunswick Zone 16#
Post by: scotts33 on November 21, 2006, 09:46:30 PM
quote:
After my discussion with the pro shop operator, he has told me that a ball like the no mercy's negative weight has pretty much no effect on the reaction on the ball.
I disagree but if you are happy with it that's most important.
Used mine last game of a set for 256 using a Track Inertia with more surface on a heavier shot after track area broke down used the NM. Great ball no weak hits one of the strikes left a standing 10 and something came out of the back of the pit and took the 10 pin forward.......very rarely see that.
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Scott
Post by: toomanytenpins on November 21, 2006, 10:43:58 PM
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my style, the art of bowling without bowling
Post by: six pack on November 22, 2006, 05:11:03 AM
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B-dub in the house YE'all..
Post by: toomanytenpins on November 28, 2006, 10:14:35 PM
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my style, the art of bowling without bowling
Post by: njv29 on November 28, 2006, 11:55:07 PM
What I mean is does the ball start to hook, make a change in direction, and then "straighten out" in that direction. If so, then the surface and pin position of the ball is a greater problem then negative side weight (which I apply to the theory that negative side weight has absolutely no noticable effect at all on ball reaction). If the ball is burning too much energy, then the correct step would be to either sand the ball to a finer grit (4000 or so), or preferably polish the ball. By polishing the ball, it will skid much further down the lane and store extremely more energy for the backend, thereby flipping much more violently.
I also notice that your 3 balls are all of significantly different weights (12, 14, and 16 lbs.). Before worrying so much about negative weight and weight holes on your NAP I would look at getting a more consistent weighted arsenal (which by the way, a weight hole on your NAP will most likely increase the tendency of the ball to roll out and tame the backend down farther due to the change in density distribution of the core which has a much larger effect on ball reaction than static weights).
Although having a slightly ligter spare ball may be ok for some people, having a 4 pound difference between two of your balls is a major problem. There is absolutely no way you can make that change consistently and expect to make a quality shot. To throw a lighter or heavier ball, you have to change something about your approach, which is garaunteed to mess with your timing in one way or another.
Just some suggestions,
good luck with the No Mercy.
-njv29
Post by: toomanytenpins on November 30, 2006, 08:48:07 PM
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my style, the art of bowling without bowling
Post by: toomanytenpins on November 30, 2006, 08:49:26 PM
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my style, the art of bowling without bowling
Post by: Raven829 on November 30, 2006, 09:04:32 PM
Don
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"On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage. Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me. The problem we have to address more than anything is the home run problem."
~Dusty Baker being a total fool
Post by: chitown on November 30, 2006, 10:48:58 PM
If you have the NM and can't get it too hook much then there's something wrong. Take a look at the vid on this forum that rolls6 made. Mine reacts very similar to his. Go figure there both drilled with the #6 layout.
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GO BEARS! Super Bowl bound!
Post by: KATHI on December 01, 2006, 12:30:31 AM
Post by: Raven829 on December 01, 2006, 04:03:52 AM
quote:
i believe you have the wrong ball for the way you bowl, No Mercy is basically down and in. I would recommend the Ebonite Angular one or the domination.
Huh? I threw the No Mercy wednesday night standing 33 crossing 15 at the arrows to a breakpoint around 6. That is far from down and in, and it worked wonderfully. I traded a Domination for this ball and the No Mercy puts it to shame. It's more controllable, rolls better, and hits better.
Don
--------------------
"On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage. Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me. The problem we have to address more than anything is the home run problem."
~Dusty Baker being a total fool
Post by: max revs on December 01, 2006, 04:38:36 AM
quote:
i believe you have the wrong ball for the way you bowl, No Mercy is basically down and in. I would recommend the Ebonite Angular one or the domination.
Not to knock you but whatever you are on can I please have some. I bought one for my brother who has really no hand and a lot of ball speed and it is a HOOKING machine for hime
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med-high revs
17 mph ball speed
med axis tilt
Current arsenal:
No Mercy WOW WOW WOW did I say WOW!!
Road Hawg
Pain
Doom
Black Widow
Absolute inferno (for sale 10-15 games)
Big Time (for sale 5-10 games)
Blue Vibe
White Dot
Post by: max revs on December 01, 2006, 04:38:51 AM
quote:
i believe you have the wrong ball for the way you bowl, No Mercy is basically down and in. I would recommend the Ebonite Angular one or the domination.
Not to knock you but whatever you are on can I please have some. I bought one for my brother who has really no hand and a lot of ball speed and it is a HOOKING machine for him
--------------------
med-high revs
17 mph ball speed
med axis tilt
Current arsenal:
No Mercy WOW WOW WOW did I say WOW!!
Road Hawg
Pain
Doom
Black Widow
Absolute inferno (for sale 10-15 games)
Big Time (for sale 5-10 games)
Blue Vibe
White Dot
Post by: chitown on December 01, 2006, 08:07:17 AM
quote:
i believe you have the wrong ball for the way you bowl, No Mercy is basically down and in. I would recommend the Ebonite Angular one or the domination.
I don't understand this above statement. The NO MERCY can be played very deep. This ball is a beast!
This is an incorrect statement about the NO MERCY.
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GO BEARS! Super Bowl bound!