Author Topic: G-Force/Fury (Read 6865 times)

jhutch769 · « **on:** January 29, 2007, 06:45:44 AM »

I have heard that Lane #1 is thinking about filing a law suit against Brunswick for their use of the Torsion Core in the Fury because it is infringing on something they were working with while at Brunswick? Can anyone clarify this story?

Brickguy221 · « **Reply #16 on:** January 29, 2007, 07:07:00 PM »

quote:
From Brick's Profile:

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Balls with 2" to 3" Pins seem to work best for me.
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"Consider yourself sucked"

Wow, I gained another fan even if it is a troll.

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Brick

MegaMav · « **Reply #17 on:** January 29, 2007, 07:11:45 PM »

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Megamav, how do you know that the Hammer Spike isn't infringing on Lane #1's patent..? Without the flip block, what do you have left..?

because Hammer came out with the "bomb" core first.

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It seems to me that Richie is the smart one..!! =:^D

Marketing smart, yes, bowling smart, no.

Steven · « **Reply #18 on:** January 29, 2007, 07:15:45 PM »

Mav, lets break a few things down:

quote:
How about, I think you're a joke, coming into the Lane #1 forum with house hack credentials, throwing around rumors and giving an overall snotty attitude to the posters that make the most sense.

Yes, I'm an admitted house hack, so what? Do you have a problem with honesty? If our profiles are accurate, we're both house hacks, so I'm not sure where your attitude is coming from. I 'come into' the Lane#1 forum owning and extensively using 10 balls in their line-up, so I'm hardly crashing the party (unlike the trolls). Please indicate the rumors, and I'd be happy to respond, but cut the generalities. In your world, 'posters who make sense' are any that have a bone to pick with Lane#1. That really brings a lot to the table.

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Hey, works only one way with you, this time the Bomb core resembles the Spike core much more than the FURY to the Diamond. Same deal, whether you want to accept it or not.

Sometimes you reply like you're high on drugs. The only thing I said on that subject was that if Hammer had a case they'd probably sue. I try not to pretend to be an Engineer and make sweeping generalized conclusions.

quote:
oh really? you think so huh? Wow, I must have had you all wrong this whole time. You MUST be in every R&D department of EVERY company out there to make that statement, forget me discrediting Lane #1, you just discredited yourself.

I carefully say "in many cases" and "many companies", and you turn my words around to "MUST" and EVERY". Is that the only way you can defend your thoughts? Try to comprehend the following real world example: Track went from Phil Cardinale to Del Warren back and to Phil Cardinale over the past few years, which will represent three totally redesigned lineups in that period. What's difficult for you to understand as far as continuity to the customer?

The bottom line is that you're in no position to talk about who is discredited.
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"Sometimes, the best move is the one we don't make"

MegaMav · « **Reply #19 on:** January 29, 2007, 07:31:28 PM »

quote:
Yes, I'm an admitted house hack, so what? Do you have a problem with honesty? If our profiles are accurate, we're both house hacks, so I'm not sure where your attitude is coming from. I 'come into' the Lane#1 forum owning and extensively using 10 balls in their line-up, so I'm hardly crashing the party (unlike the trolls). Please indicate the rumors, and I'd be happy to respond, but cut the generalities. In your world, 'posters who make sense' are any that have a bone to pick with Lane#1. That really brings a lot to the table.

You're obviously in here fueling the fire, so far you have contributed just as much as everyone else.

and about rumors, and generalities:

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Given that Hammer didn't, there is apparently much more to this than you understand.

If you know so much, and I know so little about it, how about you shed some light on the subject?

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Sometimes you reply like you're high on drugs. The only thing I said on that subject was that if Hammer had a case they'd probably sue. I try not to pretend to be an Engineer and make sweeping generalized conclusions.

We can make the rational induction that if Hammer didnt have a case on Lane #1 for the Bomb/Spike design, then Lane #1 has no grounds for suit with Brunswick.
The similarities between the Spike/Bomb are greater than that of the FURY/Diamond.
I guess Lane #1 should throw up their arms in protest with every vertically tapered core, you can make a diamond with any object of 6 planes or more.

quote:

I carefully say "in many cases" and "many companies", and you turn my words around to "MUST" and EVERY". Is that the only way you can defend your thoughts? Try to comprehend the following real world example: Track went from Phil Cardinale to Del Warren back and to Phil Cardinale over the past few years, which will represent three totally redesigned lineups in that period. What's difficult for you to understand as far as continuity to the customer?

Well, you mentioned one, Track, where are the rest?

You're also making the assumption that a bowler in general is unable to shop for themselves.

quote:

Frankly, I don't care, because regardless of what you think, it works. I look at it as an advantage that Lane#1 uses the base diamond for all their balls. I can look at a picture/specs and based on modifications, have a good idea ahead of time what a new ball will and will not do.

Tell me this steven, with all of these hybrid coverstock blends of lane #1, how can you make a fair assessment of the ball without knowing what the blend ratios are, let alone the base grits that are not mentioned anywhere on lane #1's site?

Edited on 1/29/2007 8:40 PM

gnlover16 · « **Reply #20 on:** January 29, 2007, 07:38:58 PM »

Just reading this I think we cant make a safe assumption, no one really knows waht is going on. No one knows if Lane #1 was really trying to develop another core, we dont know if it was just a publicity stunt. Wait until the facts come out before you attack each other.
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GO STORM!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cant wait to get up to Buffalo

I have a NIB 15 lb Original Inferno for trade/sale, PM me for any questions

qstick777 · « **Reply #21 on:** January 29, 2007, 08:09:02 PM »

Wow, this was predicted in the Brunswick forum over a week ago!

quote:
twoheadedboy
Posted: 1/19/2007 1:31 PM
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That ball has quite the backend movement for a symmetrical dull reactive!

I cringed when I saw the starting point for the core though...that definitely is going to get the Lane #1 folk in an uproar. The end result is vastly different from any shape Lane #1 has used in a production ball, however.

230-n-up-or-bust
Posted: 1/19/2007 1:35 PM
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quote:
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That ball has quite the backend movement for a symmetrical dull reactive!

I cringed when I saw the starting point for the core though...that definitely is going to get the Lane #1 folk in an uproar. The end result is vastly different from any shape Lane #1 has used in a production ball, however.

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If the Fury utilizes a similar core to the Lane #1 products at a fraction of the cost, who cares? Now, all of the Lane #1 folks clammoring about how the core gives them a reaction shape or look on the lane that they're happy with can give another ball a try that's $30-50 less.
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I always thought the Ravage core looked similar to the 3D-offset core.

http://www.123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2296

http://www.123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=662
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FAQ:http://www.ballreviews.com/Forum/Replies.asp?TopicID=74110&ForumID=16&CategoryID=5

Search Ballreviews entire database here: http://www.bowling-info.com/Search.html

J_Mac · « **Reply #22 on:** January 29, 2007, 08:23:25 PM »

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I always thought the Ravage core looked similar to the 3D-offset core.

http://www.123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2296

http://www.123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=662
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I'd hope so... the same individual is responsible for both core designs.
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"A word to the wise ain't necessary -- it's the stupid ones that need the advice." Bill Cosby
"Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience."

Sawuser · « **Reply #23 on:** January 29, 2007, 08:32:29 PM »

This is really funny to read. You guys act like it affects you personally. The only ones that should be concerned about who bit off who are the ball companies themselves! What difference does it make to you? Are you all shareholders?
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Righty
Think about it!

It is impossible to govern rightly without God and the Bible. - George Washington

qstick777 · « **Reply #24 on:** January 29, 2007, 09:14:20 PM »

quote:
quote:

I always thought the Ravage core looked similar to the 3D-offset core.

http://www.123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=2296

http://www.123bowl.com/ball.asp?ballid=662
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I'd hope so... the same individual is responsible for both core designs.
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"A word to the wise ain't necessary -- it's the stupid ones that need the advice." Bill Cosby
"Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience."

I thought so, but I couldn't find anything doing a quick search. I remember one of the guys being the guy that did the JPF Axe, and thought Mo was with Faball but wasn't sure.
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FAQ:http://www.ballreviews.com/Forum/Replies.asp?TopicID=74110&ForumID=16&CategoryID=5

Search Ballreviews entire database here: http://www.bowling-info.com/Search.html

GTX · « **Reply #25 on:** January 30, 2007, 07:36:03 AM »

that bigB video about the Fury made me laugh .. "after 3 years of research" LMAO ... what a BS
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Member of F.O.S.

Charles · « **Reply #26 on:** January 30, 2007, 08:31:54 AM »

Quote

Just reading this I think we cant make a safe assumption, no one really knows waht is going on. No one knows if Lane #1 was really trying to develop another core, we dont know if it was just a publicity stunt. Wait until the facts come out before you attack each other.
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I can say that none of this effects any of us, so you are right. I can attest that I was personally told on more than one occasion by people in the Lane #1 Company, that the newest release was going to be a "brand new, never seen before core." In their same words, they turned around and told me that many companies had tried this but Richie had perfected it. OK, here is my problem with this. That is a contradiction in itself. How can it never been seen before if othr companies had tried it? I asked if it was an assymetrical version of the diamond and I was told, "No. It's something brand new." Low and behold, the release comes and it's a twisted assymetrical diamond. Now, either I was lied to (Possible) or they were working on something else. I don't know. All I know is these are the facts that I have. I will not argue or dispute anybody's views or opinions of this issue as that is not my purpose in posting this inofrmation. I just thought it was interesting and relevant. Having thrown 95% of Lane #1's releases, I keep finding that the next release is something to replace something in the past. I am still waiting for that new technology that sets the next ball apart from the past. Again, just my opinion.

Steven · « **Reply #27 on:** January 30, 2007, 09:15:51 AM »

Mav: We're going around in circles on a few things:

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If you know so much, and I know so little about it, how about you shed some light on the subject?

You started this off by stating Lane#1 stole the bomb core design from the Hammer Spike. At any level, a very presumptuous accusation without some proof to present beyond some ridiculously simple one dimensional picture (goes to the whole trolling thing). Again, I responded that if Lane#1 'stole' anything, Hammer probably would have taken legal action. Stealing only has meaning in the context of legal rights. Unless you have inside information to the contrary, there is nothing there.

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We can make the rational induction that if Hammer didn't have a case on Lane #1 for the Bomb/Spike design, then Lane #1 has no grounds for suit with Brunswick.

Wow. What a reach. There is nothing rational about the above at all. Are you a Ball Design Engineer who has examined both cores, in a lab, with the provisions of the Lane#1 patent in hand?

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The similarities between the Spike/Bomb are greater than that of the FURY/Diamond.

Same as my response above. You're not even close to having the information necessary to start reasonable speculation.

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Well, you mentioned one, Track, where are the rest?

Ebonite went through massive line-up changes with Brian Pursel (notably the creation of the Apex asymmetric line), canned him when he got off on unpopular tangents like the TPC, and went to Ronald Hickland who has created an entirely new asymmetric line-up.

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You're also making the assumption that a bowler in general is unable to shop for themselves.

That's a loaded statement, but in general, true. We have a bowling ball industry built on feeding an army of recreational bowlers equipment they don't really need or know how to effectively use. Talk to most bowlers about covers, cover adjustments, cores, drilling, matchups, and you get back a 'deer in the headlights' stare. To be fair, Lane#1 has fallen into the same mode. They're a business, and they have to try and maximize profit like everyone else.

quote:
Tell me this steven, with all of these hybrid coverstock blends of lane #1, how can you make a fair assessment of the ball without knowing what the blend ratios are, let alone the base grits that are not mentioned anywhere on lane #1's site?

Actually, many of the Brunswick based Lane#1 balls have tried and true covers with long track records. The Cranberry has PK18; Golden Nugget has PK17; the pearl and solid Uraniums have Inferno based covers; the Hybrid DB has a PK18 based resin, etc. At least when Lane#1 used Brunswick covers, it wasn't hard to figure out roughly what you're getting. I do all my own cover modifications, and I really haven't found any surprises in cover reaction, or making modifications by sanding sanding/polishing.

Mav, I really don't want get into contest with you. I give you a lot of credit in the Miscellaneous forum for posting your video and asking for input. It takes a lot to put yourself out like that. So don't undo the good stuff by trolling in the Lane#1 forum. You have more to offer than that.

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"Sometimes, the best move is the one we don't make"

GTX · « **Reply #28 on:** January 30, 2007, 10:06:09 AM »

quote:

OK, here is my problem with this. That is a contradiction in itself. How can it never been seen before if othr companies had tried it?

what is really so hard to understand about this ??
idea itself doesn't count until you provide a prototype .. god knows what all these companies are developing/trying/researching right now .. as long there is no production, it is brand new to whoever perfects it first

quote:

I keep finding that the next release is something to replace something in the past. I am still waiting for that new technology that sets the next ball apart from the past. Again, just my opinion.

you wanna tell me bigB, storm, ebonite .. etc have a unique balls .. that none of ALL the balls they produced did replace another one !!!

not long ago, I was looking at storm CURRENT line up and I can name 3-4 balls that are identical based on the graph that storm provided

and btw, just to say someone told me, I was told ... etc .. any company doesn't have to tell you anything about future production .. and more likely you have interpreted whatever they told you to something you wanted to believe in

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Member of F.O.S.

Charles · « **Reply #29 on:** January 30, 2007, 10:19:16 AM »

I hardly doubt it considering my source. It is not brand new if other companies have tried it. Other companies have done this but then they branch out at some point and there is a major change...ex The One Series, Action line, Inferno series...etc Those were all new releases with new designs. Like I said, I am not here to bash, just comparing my experience with this story!
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Boss of the Texas Syndicate

Floridarevmachine · « **Reply #30 on:** January 30, 2007, 10:37:23 AM »

The problem with patents is that a company can take your design, improve apon it and have a patent of their own. Now if Brunswick had not twisted the core then there would be an obvious issue, but the minute that core is twisted it becomes something different entirely.
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mmmmmmmmmm Beer

Author Topic: G-Force/Fury (Read 6865 times)

jhutch769

G-Force/Fury

Brickguy221

Re: G-Force/Fury

MegaMav

Re: G-Force/Fury

Steven

Re: G-Force/Fury

MegaMav

Re: G-Force/Fury

gnlover16

Re: G-Force/Fury

qstick777

Re: G-Force/Fury

J_Mac

Re: G-Force/Fury

Sawuser

Re: G-Force/Fury

qstick777

Re: G-Force/Fury

GTX

Re: G-Force/Fury

Charles

Re: G-Force/Fury

Steven

Re: G-Force/Fury

GTX

Re: G-Force/Fury

Charles

Re: G-Force/Fury

Floridarevmachine

Re: G-Force/Fury