Author Topic: Saws. The hitting and carrying myths: Style related attributes. (Read 3127 times)

HamPster · « **on:** October 29, 2003, 01:29:41 AM »

Yes, I said it. When you get a Saw and bowler's style to match up, the Saw will do better than any other ball, I promise. The key is getting an early rolling core to roll later. I've noticed a HUGE difference in my Blueberry since I've begun throwing the ball better. It used to be really smooth and bland on the backend. Since I'm throwing it a little faster and getting it to glide about 10 or 15 feet further before it starts revving, holy hamsters, watch out. If you throw it slower or your rev rate is mismatched with you speed, the ball starts expending energy while still in the oil. However, if you get the ball to start expending energy later in the oil, when it catches dry, it will take off and beat the hell out of the pocket. Same surface, same drilling, same oil pattern, better shotmaking. I hadn't been able to get it to do much on the backends, but now it goes crazy. My other stuff has been doing the same thing. The instant I started throwing the ball better, everything became a lot smoother through the fronts and just absolutely beastly on the backends. And I can tell when I throw a bad shot, the ball will react just like it used to. But wow, the Blueberry is one hell of a ball. This is the saw myth, slower speeds or mismatched speed to revs won't match up well with Saws, but if you've got a style like Haugen Jr, Danny Wiseman (among others), you'll do well. Styles like Walter Ray, or Patrick Healey probably wouldn't match up well. This is my analysis, comments?
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I'm BETTER than you because . .

1) I've met the DNL leprechaun
2) I get paid to watch tv.
3) My dad's friend's brother knows Chris Barnes' stepdad.
4) Kristi's my buuuuuddy
5) I get to witness a man with the speed and revs of Robert Smith combined with the accuracy of the guards in the lobby scene of the Matrix average 240
6) I can throw a better fit over nothing than you can.

Curly · « **Reply #1 on:** October 29, 2003, 05:31:47 PM »

Ham&cheese, comments? What have you been smoking? LOL! I dont agree with your Saw analysis. IMO, I really believe that anyone, regardless of bowling style, can use a Buzzsaw with success. I think the key is as you said, "I started throwing the ball better...". Look, I am a BB fanatic but Lane1 balls are like any others. If ya dont throw it well......... IMO, there is no myth, only people who put to much thought into the matter. I still love ya babe! LOL!

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CURLY-
"Bring back the Blueberry.......!"

charlest · « **Reply #2 on:** October 29, 2003, 06:15:23 PM »

hamster,

Please read the "Saws and Hit" thread; then re-consider your stance.

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"Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it."

HamPster · « **Reply #3 on:** October 29, 2003, 06:49:18 PM »

Yeah, I'm just basically saying that Buzzsaws aren't going to be magical for everyone, but if you find a ball and style matchup, they'll do better for that person than any other ball will. A Blueberry is still gonna hit like a marshmallow on 60 feet of flat heavy oil, there's just no way around that. Get what I'm saying now?
--------------------
I'm BETTER than you because . .

1) I've met the DNL leprechaun
2) I get paid to watch tv.
3) My dad's friend's brother knows Chris Barnes' stepdad.
4) Kristi's my buuuuuddy
5) I get to witness a man with the speed and revs of Robert Smith combined with the accuracy of the guards in the lobby scene of the Matrix average 240
6) I can throw a better fit over nothing than you can.

Wizard3927 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 30, 2003, 06:36:20 AM »

Hamster,

I agree with you sort of. I agree that a bowler needs to match up their style with the correct SAW. What I disagree with is that slower speed bowlers can't use saws. My speed is around 13 to 14 and I use nothing but saws. What I have found is certain ones ie: Blueberry and Emerald do not match up well with my game. However, the Cherry Pearl is the hardest hitting and most controllable ball I own, yet many people don't like it. The separated nuggets with their higher RG work much better for slower speeds than the stacked nuggets in the Blueberry. It is simply a matter of finding the Buzzsaw that matches up with you game.

Wizard

Strider · « **Reply #5 on:** October 30, 2003, 06:52:26 AM »

quote:
Yes, I said it. When you get a Saw and bowler's style to match up, the Saw will do better than any other ball, I promise.

Big deal. When any ball matches a bowlers style, it will be the best ball for that person. More "facts" from the Hamster.

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Penn State Proud

A_P_K · « **Reply #6 on:** October 30, 2003, 07:00:50 AM »

I agree with Strider, I've used as many as 40 different bowling balls since the end of winter, and I'd have to say only three of those didn't match my game. Out of those 40, only three are Buzzsaws and those three that didn't work were Storm Products.

The bowler makes the ball work, the ball doesn't make the bowler work.

...And at this point in time, along with MI_2_AZ I'm conducting research against my AZO and Visionary equipment to see how they stack up in the hit and carry department.

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In the old days people used to cut wood with axes.....................now and days...............they just have Executioners do it for them!

Pin_Krusher IS a serious threat to modern day bowling wood as we know it today.

Brickguy221 · « **Reply #7 on:** October 30, 2003, 07:06:23 AM »

I don't know where in the "H" you people get this "slower speeds don't match up stuff" on the Blueberrys, Emeralds, or any other saws for that matter as well as the stacked nuggets not working either. I have slower speed (14-15 mph) and low revs and the Emerald is the first ball out of my bag, followed by the Blueberry and both balls are the most consistant hooking/hitting balls I have ever owned as well carrying more strikes because they get strikes on the same hits that my other balls get 8-9 pins on. Since they work for me on lower speeds and they don't for you, then it has to be the difference in how we each have our balls drilled.

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In the old days, they used axes to chop up wood...Nowadays, they use "BUZZSAWS".

HamPster · « **Reply #8 on:** October 30, 2003, 10:51:38 AM »

I never said they wouldn't match up, I said won't match up very well. I know a couple women that use saws that have slower speed, they both have a Cherry Bomb and a Blueberry, and love them both. However, they can be better utilized by someone with higher speeds. The hit and carry are more noticeable. Nothing is gonna hit super hard if you throw it slower. And I'm saying that if you get a Buzzsaw to match up with someone's style, it will be a better ball for them than any other ball they match up with.

My basic points are that the hit and carry are more noticeable with higher speeds. Getting the core to rev later is more beneficial. So I'm saying for all those people that don't like them, it's probably your style or oil pattern. And for the people that REALLY like them, it's probably your style or oil pattern. But hey, I'm sure I'll have to explain this again . .
--------------------
I'm BETTER than you because . .

1) I've met the DNL leprechaun
2) I get paid to watch tv.
3) My dad's friend's brother knows Chris Barnes' stepdad.
4) Kristi's my buuuuuddy
5) I get to witness a man with the speed and revs of Robert Smith combined with the accuracy of the guards in the lobby scene of the Matrix average 240
6) I can throw a better fit over nothing than you can.

Curly · « **Reply #9 on:** October 30, 2003, 11:35:02 AM »

Content Removed by Webmaster

A_P_K · « **Reply #10 on:** October 30, 2003, 11:51:10 AM »

quote:
My basic points are that the hit and carry are more noticeable with higher speeds

This is typical of any ball, the amount of energy transferred from the bowler to the ball can also be a major factor in the hit and carry. It's called inertia, velocity, and momentum, the energy from someone throwing the ball is sent directly into the pins. Core power for certain balls will "aid" in the transfer of energy. Why else would a house ball or a white dot "CRUSH" the rack when someone throws it very hard?

Rags started a topic on something relative to this about bowlers size. Most bowlers who utilize their maximum energy potential in the delivery and when releasing the ball usually throw harder strikes (not faster speeds), regardless of size. Even though velocity is a big part of the equation, it's not necessary to throw a rocket.

For bowlers who don't throw the ball that fast, this is where the core dynamics of a Buzzsaw come in to play. Quoting T-GOD since the Diamond retains energy longer, taking very long to reach it's PSA, or never doing so, it will disperse more energy into the pocket.

It also has to with drillings like you mentioned before, generally from what I was told there is a specific pin placement for maximum energy retention when entering the pocket. Once it does, the bowler will generate the best hit and carry.

I release the ball around 15-16MPH, stand a measly 5'4", and weight a wopping 140lbs, but I throw some of the hardest hitting strike balls around.

--------------------
In the old days people used to cut wood with axes.....................now and days...............they just have Executioners do it for them!

Pin_Krusher IS a serious threat to modern day bowling wood as we know it today.

Edited on 10/30/2003 1:15 PM

seadrive · « **Reply #11 on:** October 30, 2003, 12:35:11 PM »

If reading about Saws bores you, kmitch, why are you poking around in the Lane #1 forum? Why not go read some of that fascinating Phenom stuff in the Track forum?

Hammy, I'm glad to hear your BB is working well for you now, but you've got some stuff bass-akward. It's about matching a cover (with prep) and a core to a condition, given the elements of a bowler's style. To say that it's simply a matter of increasing ball speed is not correct.

If increasing your ball speed made the BB work better for you, then I would say that you were previously using it on the wrong condition, or with the wrong coverstock prep and/or the wrong drilling.

The proper speed at which to throw a given ball on a given condition is the one that allows it to lose speed at the rate that leads to the optimal procession of skid-hook-roll, producing the maximum pin carry at the pin deck. A ball (Buzzsaw or not) thrown either slower or faster than that will be less effective.
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seadrive
Cogito ergo bowl

scottie · « **Reply #12 on:** October 30, 2003, 12:48:11 PM »

ball speed deos not always mean more carry-angle of entry,revs,lane condition all play a part....for me,the core of a saw produces good revs and stores energy so when it hits,the ball is still moving thru the pins with constant speed.alot of balls burn up in the midlane and are doa.only the super carbide is guilty of this if there is not enough oil.
the match up depends on the current condition.the oil,wood or synthetic lanes,the oil layout etc.thats why its good to have a selection of balls.
if balls do not match up with bowler,then its more likely a selection issue for the condition rather than ball make.

Author Topic: Saws. The hitting and carrying myths: Style related attributes. (Read 3127 times)

HamPster

Saws. The hitting and carrying myths: Style related attributes.

Curly

Re: Saws. The hitting and carrying myths: Style related attributes.

charlest

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HamPster

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Wizard3927

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Strider

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A_P_K

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Brickguy221

Re: Saws. The hitting and carrying myths: Style related attributes.

HamPster

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Curly

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A_P_K

Re: Saws. The hitting and carrying myths: Style related attributes.

seadrive

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scottie

Re: Saws. The hitting and carrying myths: Style related attributes.