BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: 12XSECH on September 13, 2013, 07:16:38 AM
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AMF has been sold out...we all know this, but they are also putting out less volume of oil. our shot for league was a modified stone street...modified means hardly any oil i guess. My storm manic was way to much ball for this shot. All my other stuff is stronger, nightmare terror, reax, nightmare. What is a good ball for this light of volume? I like to stay within storm, dv8...My avg 216, 15 to 16 mph tweener...Thanks.
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Tropical breeze hybrid or Strike King drilled weak.
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I was given a breeze that I have yet to try on the short/dry patterns. I also tried a Maurader Mutiny from (DV8) that appears to be REALLY clean through the front and with proper drilling maybe a step down from the stuff you have. DV8 also has the reckless and misfit lines if you need lessthan the maurader line.
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It depends on how you want to play the lanes. If you want to play in try a tame pearl with a pin out drilling, and keep getting deeper to see if you pick up any oil in the middle . If you want to try to stay outside 10 I would look at a urethane ball
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I saw the same thing in my area. I bet its the weather...atleast in my area.
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It depends on how you want to play the lanes. If you want to play in try a tame pearl with a pin out drilling, and keep getting deeper to see if you pick up any oil in the middle . If you want to try to stay outside 10 I would look at a urethane ball
Good advice Bob!
What I see mostly is players that need to play in their comfort zone and need to find a ball, layout/surface that allows them to play in their area of comfort with their "A" game.
What one thinks of as dry another may not see it that way at all.
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I still uses an two piece Black-U-Dot.
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Yep - That is what I saw my first week as well..
Really isnt a need to purchase a heavy oil ball now and I believe we shall see allot of bowling companies fold once again just when they started gaining some ground on the big boys....
Just using my Cuda C and Misfit - Nothing else needed..
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I had this as well. Almost every ball I had brought with me was too strong for the lanes, and checked up early. My Hammer Cube was even starting to hook.
The only ball I could use to stay right of the head pin was my Ebonite Optyx, because it still had all the oil soaked up in it. I haven't given it any sort of cleaning or resurfacing since I bought it in 2001. And even with that, I was still at 15 at the arrows swinging out to to around 8. Everything else had me at least an arrow left.
I'm thinking that either they weren't oiled that day, or that when the season starts to settle in, conditions will get better.. depends on the alley, though.
BL.
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Did you noticed the distance the oil started from the foul line as welll
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As it gets cooler in the season, even the lightly oiled lanes will start to hold up a little longer, and not appear so dry. Right now it's hot.....and the dry is dry!
I use a highly polished Riot, and my old faithfuls, Sonic- X's with two different drillings.
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Don't rule out a dull solid with a weak motor. I have had luck with a pin out IQ Tour. I have to move in but the ball allows me to play straighter angles and is smoother on the backed then my pearl balls. I have the cover at 500/1000 with no polish and it works surprisingly well even though it is drilled really strong. 40x4x20.
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Lanes seemed fine to me. I used my Diva then switched to my misfit pearl. First game tried to use my Brutal Nightmare and went 187 second game with the Diva was 258 and the third with the Misfit Pearl 270.
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Are most of you guys at an AMF house? The private owned house I bowl at has plenty of oil, the AMF house has next to nothing. I bowled on the end lanes last week and was able to walk up the side of the lane and see the oil. There was NONE outside of 5 and it ended at about 45 feet. Bone dry backend. When I used the Manic and swung it out, it looks like it ran into a brick wall then made a left turn. I was told before the season started that this new AMF / bowlmore is pinching pennies on everything including oil. So far this all seems to be true.
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12,
It's all about business sense. Independent alleys have that one alley to worry about cost. They can make quick business decisions based on there need for change. AMF/Bowlmor is a global business that has to keep their decisions uniform for the business as a whole. What they are also trying to do is drive out leagues (which is a horrible decision). The shot is based on what they are willing to put out to keep people somewhat happy. You may not like the shot, but the more units you put out, the more accurate the Avg Joe has to be. The Avg Joe is what drives leagues, keep them happy and you have a league. Piss them off and they disappear.
As far as the shot, it's supposed to be bone dry after the oil ends. If not the balls would go 60 ft. The oil, for THS is never outside of 5 in heavy concentration. You have to know what you are looking at and adjust accordingly. With my rev rate and lack of speed, My RotoGrip Shatter covers the lane on most of what I bowl on. Rarely am I getting to use surface. Oil will not be put on most lanes unless there is either a sport pattern, or some tourney that justifies the amount of units.
My suggestion, get a low end pearl or solid.
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What they are also trying to do is drive out leagues (which is a horrible decision). The shot is based on what they are willing to put out to keep people somewhat happy.
Though the general consensus is AMF/Bowlmor is "driving leagues out," that isn't necessarily true in all cases. And if you believe the CEO, it definitely isn't the case.
I am willing to bet the shot at any AMF/Bowlmor house isn't much different than what that center has typically put out in the past. Weather conditions, bad machine maintenance, traffic on that pair are what usually affects the lane condition.
All that said, I do feel there are policy changes that will eventually affect the shot. At our 40-lane house, the center only oils the lanes the league is bowling on. The shot they put out is just fine. Bowlers can throw a multitude of equipment. This leads me to believe it isn't AMF/Bowlmor telling centers to put zero oil out as a cost savings. But since every league doesn't use all 40 lanes, there will be lanes that will not be oiled as often as others.
Our house starts at lane 1. Some nights leagues get to 34 or 36 (I don't think they get to 40) and some nights the leagues only get to 24 or so. This means the lanes on the big end are not getting oiled enough to even protect the lanes from open play. This is where I feel the big difference will be felt. Maybe not now, but in the near future it will be apparent.
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2nd week Update...
I am seeing a dry shot ...
They arent putting the normal volume of oil
You will see bowling ball sales drop very bad this year..
Also learned my Center is closed on Monday....
Proshop was closed during league....
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My center is also closed on Monday
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2nd week Update...
I am seeing a dry shot ...
They arent putting the normal volume of oil
You will see bowling ball sales drop very bad this year..
Also learned my Center is closed on Monday....
Proshop was closed during league....
Just what I thought!
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I was told by an ex AMF mechanic that they were told to use less oil. My very 1st practice shot and it was noticeable. I went right to the pro shop had him shine up the ball and it was still to strong. This will be my last year of a league in an AMF house.
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Righty,
after the oil ends isnt it supposed to be "buffed"? Or a "top hat" shape? This pattern ended straight across...oil to no oil. as soon as the ball hit that, it was gone left. Even throwing the ball across the lane for a 10 pin the ball came back dry. Last year didnt have a lot of volume either but it was way more then this.
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There are arrows left of 10 & dots left of the "Big Dot".
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There are arrows left of 10 & dots left of the "Big Dot".
That would require many bowlers to *gasp* MOVE THEIR FEET....
It is amazing how many bowlers cannot, and more importantly, will not.
You are absolutley correct.
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Righty,
after the oil ends isnt it supposed to be "buffed"? Or a "top hat" shape? This pattern ended straight across...oil to no oil. as soon as the ball hit that, it was gone left. Even throwing the ball across the lane for a 10 pin the ball came back dry. Last year didnt have a lot of volume either but it was way more then this.
no, not normally. On THS, the shot starts being buffed earlier. A pattern like the US open isnt buffed just a flat cut off. The backend's in you house sound extremely clean and with a low volume of oil can get the ball going sideways off the end of the pattern. I would go with an entry level symmetrical ball, using big angles and a short pin to get the ball to bleed off some energy before hitting the back. This will tame the reaction on the back.
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There are arrows left of 10 & dots left of the "Big Dot".
That would require many bowlers to *gasp* MOVE THEIR FEET....
It is amazing how many bowlers cannot, and more importantly, will not.
You are absolutley correct.
+1 to both of you.
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You won't be able to see where the lane machine transitions from oil application to just buff. You will only see where the buff stops. The buff creates the front to back taper to the oil pattern.
The term top hat comes from the look of an easy pattern on the graph. This is the crosswise look, not front to back.
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this isnt about making adjustments but what we have noticed on the first night, and 2nd night across the board since they got bought out... We are comparing what we see and the future of bowling isnt looking that great especially now...
Why purchase a ball that you cant use anywhere...
At least in Dallas - We have more AMF houses than anything else. If everywhere you bowling they arent putting that much oil out why purchase these expensive balls..
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northface, dont come off as an idiot. Like someone else mentioned..this isnt about making an adjustment, its about the lane condition. I moved left, so far left it was like shooting 10 pins. Unless you got the ball to 18 mph or higher you were not hitting the pocket. I dont have that kind of ball speed. PLUS AMF started this last year...the first 18 inches do not get oiled. This is a "safety" issue so people dont fall if they cross the foul line. Another stupid idea.
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Your ball isn't hooking too much because of the lack of oil in the first 18 inches. It is from the next 40 not having enough.
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northface, dont come off as an idiot. Like someone else mentioned..this isnt about making an adjustment, its about the lane condition. I moved left, so far left it was like shooting 10 pins. Unless you got the ball to 18 mph or higher you were not hitting the pocket. I dont have that kind of ball speed. PLUS AMF started this last year...the first 18 inches do not get oiled. This is a "safety" issue so people dont fall if they cross the foul line. Another stupid idea.
Ok, buddy. Just keep forcing your ball up the dirt and come here and act butthurt about it. But I'm the idiot.
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you are an idiot. Like I said, its not about adjustments OR forcing the ball "up the dirt". learn how to understand what you read. Maybe you should have someone read it for you?
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Does it really matter what AMF is doing? No one can change it. Bitching about it makes no sense. The shot is what it is.....
My league moved to an independent house that installed all new AMF lanes and the shot is very light and even worse...short. I don't like it but for the next 33 weeks that's what I have to shoot on. My choice is bowl or quit. I choose to bowl and will still avg what I always do.
To help answer the original question, what is your tilt and axis rotation? This will help us help you not only choose ball but also layout to deal with this shot..
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Just to throw this out there, there are about 4800 centers in the United States. Of those 4800, about 270 are owned by AMF/Bowlmor, or about 5.6%. Even if each of those centers eliminated leagues, I doubt the overall bowling ball market will be impacted drastically.
Some bowlers will go to independently owned centers and still buy bowling equipment. And those that decide to stay at centers with dry shots will buy cheaper bowling balls instead of hook monsters....... or will they?
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you are an idiot. Like I said, its not about adjustments OR forcing the ball "up the dirt". learn how to understand what you read. Maybe you should have someone read it for you?
Learn how to bowl, you've mastered the art of crying.
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northface,
You proved my point. You are an idiot!
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Here is the bowlmor plan. They are running the leagues out of their centers, closing Mondays and not opening until 4pm. This will reduce expenses but will reduce profit. This is all done on purpose because they will then sell the building / property for millions on each center. In my area a probably 8 million a location or more....no more payroll, no more property taxes, no more expenses.....cash in the bank. Thats what its about.
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You do realize that AMF had declared bankruptsy several times before the BowlMor merger right? So do you expect the people at BowlMor just to continue to lose money over and over again. Their center planning has got to be very demographically dependant. I know in my area the 2 closest Bowlmor/AMF centers have very different plans in place. One center has the same thing as yours, ie: closing certain days and not opening until the afternoon on other days. The other center is a lot higher lineage center and hasn't changed all that much other than basic company rules.
Back to the original subject, there's several urethane products out there that can tackle drier lane conditions and or you can use plastic, which would probably make you a better shot maker anyways. If you don't like that, you always have the option of finding another place to spend your money.
Here is the bowlmor plan. They are running the leagues out of their centers, closing Mondays and not opening until 4pm. This will reduce expenses but will reduce profit. This is all done on purpose because they will then sell the building / property for millions on each center. In my area a probably 8 million a location or more....no more payroll, no more property taxes, no more expenses.....cash in the bank. Thats what its about.
Here is the bowlmor plan. They are running the leagues out of their centers, closing Mondays and not opening until 4pm. This will reduce expenses but will reduce profit. This is all done on purpose because they will then sell the building / property for millions on each center. In my area a probably 8 million a location or more....no more payroll, no more property taxes, no more expenses.....cash in the bank. Thats what its about.
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Here is the bowlmor plan. They are running the leagues out of their centers, closing Mondays and not opening until 4pm. This will reduce expenses but will reduce profit. This is all done on purpose because they will then sell the building / property for millions on each center. In my area a probably 8 million a location or more....no more payroll, no more property taxes, no more expenses.....cash in the bank. Thats what its about.
Not only are you a great bowler, but you are also an astute business man. Thanks for laying out the Bowl-Mor business plan. Maybe they're opening at 4 because they've studied data that shows they were not profitable prior to 4 pm? So I guess, according to you, Bowl-Mor isn't in the business of operating bowling centers but instead "Flip this commercial real estate"?
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If the shot is using the same volume of oil they used in the early/mid 90s, why not throw some of the equipment of that time frame?
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northface,
did I mention once in here that I was a great bowler? I am and have been a business owner for 25 years, so yes I do know about business. How many bowling games and hamburgers have to be sold for a center to take in 8 million bucks? Take into account that they dont even make a dollar on a burger after expenses. You own the building...Home depot or another giant comes to you and says..."Here is 8 million dollars, we want the land." You are going to turn that down because you're a dedicated bowler and want to keep your customers? I dont think so. Bowlmor is in the money making business....not the "bowling business." Cutting back staff and closing Mondays isnt going to turn around AMF's chapter 11 cases.
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Most bowling center locations that are worth $8 mil have already been sold.
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northface,
did I mention once in here that I was a great bowler? I am and have been a business owner for 25 years, so yes I do know about business. How many bowling games and hamburgers have to be sold for a center to take in 8 million bucks? Take into account that they dont even make a dollar on a burger after expenses. You own the building...Home depot or another giant comes to you and says..."Here is 8 million dollars, we want the land." You are going to turn that down because you're a dedicated bowler and want to keep your customers? I dont think so. Bowlmor is in the money making business....not the "bowling business." Cutting back staff and closing Mondays isnt going to turn around AMF's chapter 11 cases.
So far you've posted nothing to validate the items in red. Stop bitching, move your feet, change your hand position, and ball down. Really sorry to hear you can't stand in the same place you have for twenty five years and strike. ::)
BTW, thanks to the poster who pointed out that AMF-owned lanes made up a very small percentage of houses in the country. Perhaps Falco can stop his crying about bowling ball sales going to go in the tank now. The sky is falling mentality of some bowlers is just amazing.
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Here is the bowlmor plan. They are running the leagues out of their centers, closing Mondays and not opening until 4pm. This will reduce expenses but will reduce profit. This is all done on purpose because they will then sell the building / property for millions on each center. In my area a probably 8 million a location or more....no more payroll, no more property taxes, no more expenses.....cash in the bank. Thats what its about.
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Listen they sunk 40 million bucks into AMF if not there would be no AMF and they aren't planning on losing money, that is the nature of business. If the location is not making a profit with league bowling then they will go to more open cosmic bowling.
You say you have been in business if so then you know you can't keep losing money and stay in business. Our Friday night league had to leave the center we were in and move up the street to another AMF house which can have league bowling on one side and open cosmic bowling on the other side so both centers come out ahead.
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Long gone,
Like I said earlier.............THIS THREAD WAS NOT ABOUT MAKING ADJUSTMENTS. Its about the LITTLE AMOUNT of oil applied by AMF/BOWLMOR.
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Long gone,
Like I said earlier.............THIS THREAD WAS NOT ABOUT MAKING ADJUSTMENTS. Its about the LITTLE AMOUNT of oil applied by AMF/BOWLMOR.
Lol! What? To me your problem is the amount of oil and the effect it's having on your scores. If you were scoring higher then this post doesn't exist.
Where I bowl is open on Mondays from 10am to 10pm. Maybe Mondays where you are didn't have the numbers to be open who knows but all the AMF houses where I'm at are open on Mondays. I think Thursday is the only day they open at 4.
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Exactly! If this guy was scoring like he usually does when he's bowling on The Great Wall, he wouldn't be bitching. Of course, if you read his other posts, you find out he throws hook monsters from DV8. Not exactly your dry lane ball brand, is it? But that's your MO isn't it, you go out and buy the latest and greatest hook ball as seen by your posts on here. REAX, Endless Nightmare, etc. You're a one-trick pony as evidenced by your low track, you need oil to keep the ball from reacting early as you don't know how to change your hand and release. BTW, is your house average 221 or 217? What about your sport average, you claim its 200 and then you say its 195?
Oh well, it wouldn't be BR without some laughable posts from some "great bowler and equally great businessman". :o
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Exactly! If this guy was scoring like he usually does when he's bowling on The Great Wall, he wouldn't be bitching. Of course, if you read his other posts, you find out he throws hook monsters from DV8. Not exactly your dry lane ball brand, is it? But that's your MO isn't it, you go out and buy the latest and greatest hook ball as seen by your posts on here. REAX, Endless Nightmare, etc. You're a one-trick pony as evidenced by your low track, you need oil to keep the ball from reacting early as you don't know how to change your hand and release. BTW, is your house average 221 or 217? What about your sport average, you claim its 200 and then you say its 195?
Oh well, it wouldn't be BR without some laughable posts from some "great bowler and equally great businessman". :o
Exactly! If this guy was scoring like he usually does when he's bowling on The Great Wall, he wouldn't be bitching. Of course, if you read his other posts, you find out he throws hook monsters from DV8. Not exactly your dry lane ball brand, is it? But that's your MO isn't it, you go out and buy the latest and greatest hook ball as seen by your posts on here. REAX, Endless Nightmare, etc. You're a one-trick pony as evidenced by your low track, you need oil to keep the ball from reacting early as you don't know how to change your hand and release. BTW, is your house average 221 or 217? What about your sport average, you claim its 200 and then you say its 195?
Oh well, it wouldn't be BR without some laughable posts from some "great bowler and equally great businessman". :o
Lol! I roll DV8 as well and in no way can I use my nightmare or brutal nightmare. I have to start with my diva and by the end of game 1 I'm using my misfit pearl. I'm two weeks in and I've gone 715, 722 and yes the oil is lighter than last year.
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Are most of you guys at an AMF house? The private owned house I bowl at has plenty of oil, the AMF house has next to nothing. I bowled on the end lanes last week and was able to walk up the side of the lane and see the oil. There was NONE outside of 5 and it ended at about 45 feet. Bone dry backend. When I used the Manic and swung it out, it looks like it ran into a brick wall then made a left turn. I was told before the season started that this new AMF / bowlmore is pinching pennies on everything including oil. So far this all seems to be true.
Darn, 45' is long oil and most THS doesn't have much if any oil outside of 5! Most THS are 38' to 42' and that's with Kegel machines and we have our machine to not oil the first 4" of the lane at the foul line so when the lane man wipes the approach, he doesn't drag oil onto the lane by accident. It also is for safety if somebody slides to much and goes over the foul line, they don't slip or drag oil back. Just my $.02, Bruce
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Well guys, my scores have gone up with the less oil, um, way up. It's an easier shot for sure. League isn't a problem. It's practice time that's the problem. They're not just putting down less oil during league, but no oil at all at any other time. Come in on a Sunday morning to practice and there's been no oil applied since Friday. That would be fine and dandy if I needed to practice for such a rare condition, but I don't. That's not a league or tournament condition anywhere, hence I get nothing particularly useful out of practicing on it. I don't enjoy poking myself in the eye with a sharp stick either.
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long gone,
avg'e change. Last year it dropped to 216, the year before it was 221. My sport ave went from 195 to 200. In 2001 it was around 200 etc... thanks for searching my posts! Is the Manic a hook monster? I like "hook monsters" because with polish you can tame them down. You cant take a weak ball and make them that strong. Plus....did you ever hear of drilling a strong ball weak? You probably didnt, but your the know it all. Sorry I dont have the high track like you....I bet you would beat me 10 out out of 10 times because your so great longgone! Everyone, Long gone daddy knows it all, just ask him! what a jackass you are.
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Blah, blah, blah. Yes, you've come on here and told everybody how great you are and how you would beat everybody. Blah, blah, blah. What kind of shot would you beat everybody on, THS? We know it wouldnt be on dry lanes, don't we? Probably wouldn't be on a flood either. If somebody pulled a C-note out of his wallet and said "match it and let's bowl", your sphincter would tighten up so much you couldn't pull a needle thru it with a John Deere (that is if you could even scrounge up a hundred).
Have fun in your fantasy world.
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12XSECH,
You should look through this post and get the information you need, especially after 4 pages.
The Manic may not be a Vivid, but R2S isn't necessarily a weak cover (no one is calling the IQ Tour weak). And yes, you can drill a strong ball weak; but you never stated how your equipment was drilled. You can also drill weak stuff strong, so maybe your Manic is drilled too strong.
It is hard to gauge what an optimum solution would be. Your strong stuff (of which a lot of your equipment is) is too strong for the shot. You say your Manic is too strong also. Depending on the shot length, you may need a weak pearl or perhaps a urethane. But that might be too drastic of a drop based on your current arsenal.
And as others have stated, you may need to move out of your comfort zone on the lane to optimize your scoring. Doing so may allow you to use your current equipment long enough to see if the pattern you are seeing will continue into the cooler months.
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Daddy.....buck up jackass. But you are a loser and would probably cheat for a 100 bucks. I would bet you don't even have 100 dollars. So shut your mouth loser because that's all you are and that's all you will ever be. You can't even comprehend what you read. Get your mommy to read for you. We all know you are the best bowler....you have the high track right...lol. you bowl on the scorpion... viper etc and avg 230 because you are great! Get over yourself moron. You are nothing more then a loser.
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I like "hook monsters" because with polish you can tame them down
Wow........is that what polish does? Does it "tame it down"?
I'm suprised...I mean after all you've polished ("tamed down") your strong equipment (with weak layouts) and SOMEHOW / SOMEWAY you're having issues with the ball being too much. It HAS to be the lane condition that is the problem! ! ! ;D
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Good times....that's what this post is about....the lane condition....and polish doesn't make it stronger....makes it go longer....so yes. It tames it down.
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It makes it go longer if there is oil, not on dry conditions.
Good times....that's what this post is about....the lane condition....and polish doesn't make it stronger....makes it go longer....so yes. It tames it down.
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Good times....that's what this post is about....the lane condition....and polish doesn't make it stronger....makes it go longer....so yes. It tames it down.
1) I never said it makes it "stronger"
2) Again......wow. "makes it go longer" DOES NOT equal "tamed down". Those are entirely seperate concepts.
3) Go out and purchase a Breeze or a Strike King and have your driller recommend a good layout (based upon your specific specs) with a good cover prep.....then go out (with moving feet in mind as an option) and compare that to your polished, weak layout strong piece, on this specific light-oil condition.
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I agree with Good Times I said earlier to get an Breeze or Strike KING I have both drilled with pin over the middle finger and they have been an life saver on the light oil lanes.
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Good times,
Making it go longer does tame it down, Its not going to be hooking at the arrows. I like strong equipment, some I have drilled strong, others I have drilled weak. I bowl on house shots and I bowl in sport shot tournaments. The start of this thread was the lack of oil that AMF is putting out. Not about what adjustments I should make with my feet etc... Last year at this particular house my equipment worked fine except for the nightmare. This year, nothing worked due to the lack of oil. Last night I bought a Wrecker, had it drilled pin up and it worked great on this lanes right after they were oiled. Tonight is league night and I'll see how it works. The Wrecker is a strong ball considering its in Roto Grips H2 line up but it gave the length that the Manic and my other stuff didnt.
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Good times, Making it go longer does tame it down, Its not going to be hooking at the arrows
You aren't fundamentally understanding the concept. Energy RETENTION is not "tamed down". "Tamed down" refers to overall strength.....the ball isn't necessarily losing energy, it is storing it for a different part of the lane.
Easier length thru the heads doesn't equal LESS STRENGTH as much as EARLIER read doesn't always equal MORE STRENGTH.
A wrecker is a step in the correct direction, but you still need to fill out your arsenal for more extreme conditions (in this situation the dry side). This is still a low volume THS you are describing.
What is your plan on true toast, with your arsenal, where the heads are REALLY smoked? (Think even LESS oil than what you are currently seeing)
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Good times,
Making it go longer does tame it down, Its not going to be hooking at the arrows. I like strong equipment, some I have drilled strong, others I have drilled weak. I bowl on house shots and I bowl in sport shot tournaments. The start of this thread was the lack of oil that AMF is putting out. Not about what adjustments I should make with my feet etc... Last year at this particular house my equipment worked fine except for the nightmare. This year, nothing worked due to the lack of oil. Last night I bought a Wrecker, had it drilled pin up and it worked great on this lanes right after they were oiled. Tonight is league night and I'll see how it works. The Wrecker is a strong ball considering its in Roto Grips H2 line up but it gave the length that the Manic and my other stuff didnt.
Depends on the polish. Some polishes don't have a slip agent so the ball saves energy instead of taming the reaction. Most polishes dont have enough of a slip agent to "tame" the reaction and it also creates an inconsistent surface. This is why I recommend lower grit pads or a pad process(500,1000,2000,4000). This will get the ball to bleed energy without giving up too much up front.
While the Wrecker is in the H2 line, the entire line is incredibly strong compared to most mid-level balls. The Wrecker for me on the dry was extremely angular and overly aggressive off the spot on the dry so I ended up with a RotoGrip Shout. I would invest in something like a 300C solid or a motiv venom strike that will get through the heads and not be so angular on the back.
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Are most of you guys at an AMF house? The private owned house I bowl at has plenty of oil, the AMF house has next to nothing. I bowled on the end lanes last week and was able to walk up the side of the lane and see the oil. There was NONE outside of 5 and it ended at about 45 feet. Bone dry backend. When I used the Manic and swung it out, it looks like it ran into a brick wall then made a left turn. I was told before the season started that this new AMF / bowlmore is pinching pennies on everything including oil. So far this all seems to be true.
Darn, 45' is long oil and most THS doesn't have much if any oil outside of 5! Most THS are 38' to 42' and that's with Kegel machines and we have our machine to not oil the first 4" of the lane at the foul line so when the lane man wipes the approach, he doesn't drag oil onto the lane by accident. It also is for safety if somebody slides to much and goes over the foul line, they don't slip or drag oil back. Just my $.02, Bruce
Yes I bowl at a AMF house.
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12,
Storm has a "Super Natural" which something they are calling a "Super Urethane".
http://www.stormbowling.com/products/balls/supernatural
Also they have a pearl urethane:
http://www.stormbowling.com/products/balls/naturalpearl
Interesting coment on their page in reference the the Natural Pearl:
But not all lane conditions are conducive to Premier Line equipment with all the coverstock technology needed for maximum traction. Some competitive oil patterns are short with very clean backends and some lane surfaces, especially wood, have an extreme amount of wear and built in friction.
Most centers in my area put very low volume. I am lucky if I can use any reactive ball for one game. When I see any reactive ball gripping early; I immediately move to my Urethane stuff (Scout and U2). Sometimes this happens during practice.
A lot my issues with this, has to do with my lack of speed. I have tried to increase it, but usually my game suffers, with increase speed also comes other problems (balance, not as accurate, poor timing). So my solution is to stay in my comfort zone, throw the ball the way I want to and just use less agressive equipment. Yeah I might sacrafice carry, but I have shot some really high scores and series with Urethane. Also with Urethane I am usually making less adjustments and not moving around as much trying to find oil.
You got to find what works for you.
It would interesting to know when you find a successful solution to your issue. Whether its a new ball, changing an existing one, moving your line, or whatever.
Let us know.
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This person nailed it....
Well guys, my scores have gone up with the less oil, um, way up. It's an easier shot for sure. League isn't a problem. It's practice time that's the problem. They're not just putting down less oil during league, but no oil at all at any other time. Come in on a Sunday morning to practice and there's been no oil applied since Friday. That would be fine and dandy if I needed to practice for such a rare condition, but I don't. That's not a league or tournament condition anywhere, hence I get nothing particularly useful out of practicing on it. I don't enjoy poking myself in the eye with a sharp stick either.
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i am lucky bowl at a brunswick house can throw brunswick nexxus all 3 games 5 men teams and not even move.plenty of oil.sometimes i throw my nuts solid.
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Week 3....
This week same volume of oil and short oil pattern....
YOU WANT BELEIVE THIS - They resurfaced the approaches. >:( and I had to make them announce it before someone killed themselves..
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I bowl in a couple of later night leagues in the same house. God forbid, the house should re-oil the lanes during the evening, but I have never seen that happen. You start with a fairly light volume which goes downhill as the earlier leagues bowl. So going in, you generally know what to expect. I start with my Freeze and move left as needed. I have used my White Dot as a strike ball several times. You do what you must to knock down the pins.
As Trash Heap accurately noted, trying to increase speed has drawbacks (speaking for myself)---timing, balance, and accuracy issues. Many of the guys can tweak the speed. I have done it, too, but with uneven results.
No complaints here. I enjoy the sport, the social aspects, and the evenings out.
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Bowling balls have no energy. They only have varying degrees of surface friction. Energy comes from the arm swing and fingers putting rotational energy on the ball.
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There is a minimum required amount of lane oil for usbc sanctioned leagues...it is 3 units...which is actually nothing. The amount of oil for "glow bowling" is 12 units and for a "training pattern" it is 7 units. The kegal recreation patterns which are basically house shots....wall street, easy street, high street etc... all have about 18 units of oil. So if the AMF house that I am bowling at is putting out 7 units....That is less than 1/2 of a THS pattern. 2 questions, why would the USBC have a minimum of 3 units which is nothing and why would AMF not even put out a basic house shot for its league? Are they skimping that much to save 16 units of oil per lane? 1 unit is 7 millionths of an inch think. I found that info on google.
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I think you need to remember as long as they are in compliance which is probably less oil then you are seeing, there is nothing you can bitch about. My Friday night league is light and even worse, short. The scoring pace for a majority of the league has gone up. The 160 bowlers are now 180 and the 180 bowlers are now 200. I'm 210 and still at 210. It helps the average low rev need a ton if miss room bowlers. It is what it is. I hate it but I have no choice. I'm carrying a Platinum,SOS and taboo spare. Weakest lineup I've carried in 20 yrs
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I think you need to remember as long as they are in compliance which is probably less oil then you are seeing, there is nothing you can bitch about. My Friday night league is light and even worse, short. The scoring pace for a majority of the league has gone up. The 160 bowlers are now 180 and the 180 bowlers are now 200. I'm 210 and still at 210. It helps the average low rev need a ton if miss room bowlers. It is what it is. I hate it but I have no choice.
This (in bold) is, without question, exactly correct.
I too am seeing a league with increased scoring, due to lighter and shorter oil.
I'm carrying a DV8 Diva with a 4 1/2 pin-to-pap, and ready to ball down to a shiny MoJave or shiny Karma Pink/Purple. My stronger stuff (Pursuit-S, IQTP at 2000 with a strong layout) doesn't even enter the building. I think 12XSECH needs to fill his arsenal out with a Misfit Pearl or a Strike King and find the correct layout and surface prep (UFO?) to meet what this (alleged) pattern is apparently DEMANDING.
Oh, and tape the lanes.
It's been real, I cannot add anything further than what I've previously stated.
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Just curious,
If a center puts less oil, and you have a ton of low rev bowlers using aggressive equipment, would this affect the lane surface more? I always thought the oil was placed to protect the lanes, if you take that protection away, it seems the lanes are going to be destroyed faster?
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Trash,
On top of what I said earlier....not only are they using minimal oil, they are using an oil called "fire". Its a high friction oil. This does not make any sense. Why put out high friction oil (and a minimum of it) on a worn high friction surface? From my understanding they should be using an oil called "ice" oil. Its more slippery.
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Ice oil is new and isn't used everywhere. It doesn't matter what oil they use as long as it meets requirements. It doesn't have to make sense to you at all. Or anyone else for that matter. It is what it is.
Ball down or look for another league.
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As long as it meets the USBC requirements, they may used any type of oil they wish. Fire has a higher Viscosity(FIRE): 45.1 cps. compared to Ice Viscosity(ICE): 40.9 cps. Which means that the Fire oil will hold up even longer than Ice. Which is actually a good thing to have on patterns. Less moving throughout the night. Now your frictions numbers are actually very similar, Surface Tension (FIRE): 23.6 dynes/cm
Surface Tension (ICE): 23.2 dynes/cm. I would would simply choose Fire just due to the durability of the oil throughout the night. Plus oiling lanes is not the cheapest thing in the bowling center and when you are cutting cost, that is the first thing that gets altered or change to help with cost at a bowling center.
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reducing cost is one thing...if that leads bowlers to leave, then they are losing money.
PLUS with the low oil volume they are wearing out the lane surface even faster. These lanes are 15 years old. There are other ways to cut costs....In this area they are not even turning the lights on on Sundays. If you want to bowl...it will be in the dark.
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reducing cost is one thing...if that leads bowlers to leave, then they are losing money.
PLUS with the low oil volume they are wearing out the lane surface even faster. These lanes are 15 years old. There are other ways to cut costs....In this area they are not even turning the lights on on Sundays. If you want to bowl...it will be in the dark.
LoL where is this place!?! I feel like I have to bowl in this Circus House! Flash light and I'm game hahaha
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Reducing costs by not oiling lanes or reducing the amount? It costs about $0.60-$0.70 to oil and clean a single lane. If you have a 40 lane center, then it costs maybe $28 to oil the entire center. This is based on a normal house shot with about 20.0ml per lane. That is less than $200 a week to oil the lanes every day, yet we know too often lanes are not oiled every day.
If a center wants to cut costs, there are numerous other ways than not oiling. Even if you reduced the oil amount in half you put on the lane, you only saved about $100 per week. If we are pinching pennies that much, you are in the wrong business.
Just my opinion......
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Week 4....
We had alittle more volume on the lanes....
They are running short pattern but more volume is better than no volume... Learned also recently from a dude who does the lanes the shot was not legal when inspected.. Now we have more oil....
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Learned also recently from a dude who does the lanes the shot was not legal when inspected
THAT is a legitimate gripe, given evidence to suggest so.
Volume and length are not.
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The place I bowl at fixed the problem by putting out the High Street pattern.
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The place I bowl at fixed the problem by putting out the High Street pattern.
The REAL problem was identified as "too dry", correct?
;D ;D ;D ;D
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to dry is putting it nicely. Sand paper is more like it with the balls coming back with check marks....on synthetic lanes. Last time I had check marks in the track is when I bowled on wood.