win a ball from Bowling.com
« previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 12 13 [14] 15

Author Topic: 6 More balls stripped of approval  (Read 50838 times)

suhoney24

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 579
6 More balls stripped of approval
« on: March 29, 2022, 07:25:21 PM »
USBC and Storm Products have agreed on a national tournament exclusion rule and ball exchange program for six Storm Products manufactured ball models. The agreement comes after USBC identified the models having a percentage of balls produced below USBC minimum 73D hardness specification. Read more: https://bowl.com/News/NewsDetails.aspx?id=23622337509

USBC's investigation showed a percentage of these ball models measured below the USBC-required hardness level of the approval samples submitted by Storm. Storm collaborated with USBC after being notified of this testing.

The affected models include: Storm Phaze 4, Storm Electrify Solid, Storm Trend 2, 900 Global Altered Reality, 900 Global Wolverine, Roto Grip UFO Alert

Effective March 30, 2022, these balls models are prohibited from use in USBC national tournaments, including but not limited to, the USBC Masters, U.S. Open, USBC Open Championships, USBC Women's Championships, all PWBA Tour events, USBC Junior Gold and Youth Open Championships, USBC Intercollegiate Championships, USBC Team USA Trials, USBC Senior Masters and USBC Senior Queens.

These ball models remain USBC approved. Each USBC competition, whether tournament or league, has the option to adopt USBC's national tournament rule prohibiting use of these balls or to continue to allow their use.

USBC has shared this national tournament rule with Storm and has Storm's support. Storm will offer owners of the affected balls the option to exchange their balls for a new product. Information about the exchange program will be published later this week on StormBowling.com.
Logged

 

ignitebowling

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 998
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #196 on: April 12, 2022, 09:56:04 AM »
I am curious if Sean Rash complaining on the PBA is what started the PBA checking equipment more, especially urethane and eventually resin to find what was going on.

It would seem the PBA is the only one that was checking the equipment and someone with that information about the softness of Storm equipment not meeting USBC spec then notified USBC. Just my guess on the situation. Especially since USBC isn't out looking for this stuff unless someone brings it to them and drops it on their lap.

If in the end a lot of this was started because of Rash and it ends up affecting his company the most that is a hard pill to swallow. 
Logged
Ignite your game, and set the lanes on fire. www.facebook.com/ignitebowling  or @ignite_bowling

3835

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 736
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #197 on: April 12, 2022, 10:38:04 AM »
Interesting thoughts psy....

Here is another. If the PBA was doing hardness checks on everything....wouldn't they have known these balls were soft (meaning the 6 new ones and the Spectre)? If so, I wonder why the PBA never said anything previously.....

My assumption about the entire scenario is someone from a rival company (theres only a few) got a burr in their saddle about the Purples being banned and urethanes older than 2 years old being banned, so they started going over everything and here we are.
Logged

psycaz

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 333
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #198 on: April 12, 2022, 11:34:10 AM »
Quote from: 3835 on April 12, 2022, 10:38:04 AM
Interesting thoughts psy....

Here is another. If the PBA was doing hardness checks on everything....wouldn't they have known these balls were soft (meaning the 6 new ones and the Spectre)? If so, I wonder why the PBA never said anything previously.....

My assumption about the entire scenario is someone from a rival company (theres only a few) got a burr in their saddle about the Purples being banned and urethanes older than 2 years old being banned, so they started going over everything and here we are.

The urethane two year ban item, that only affects the PBA and it’s tournaments correct?

Not sure why that would matter to much to the companies. The balls as a line aren’t banned, just the serial numbers that relate to balls being two years old correct?

I mean, Brunswick can keep producing Purple Hammers for as long as they want, they just can’t be from production ages older than two years to be used in the PBA?

I can see where the complete ban on 16 & 17 Purples might upset Brunswick. They are the ones who have to cover the replacement costs. But they knew about that issue when they bought Ebonite. Maybe they presumed the issue was completely resolved and are pissed it was brought back up?
Logged

3835

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 736
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #199 on: April 12, 2022, 12:17:50 PM »
Who knows psy...

All I know is I remember back to the Jackal situation. If I recall correctly, a case of Jackal's showed up at the USBC doorstep with a note that said "spin me". That led to the Jackals being found with a diff out of spec for exceeding .060.

I don't think a regular joe/pro shop would have done that. Probably not a PBA bowler either.

Logged

bradl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1660
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #200 on: April 12, 2022, 03:51:42 PM »
Quote from: psycaz on April 12, 2022, 11:34:10 AM
The urethane two year ban item, that only affects the PBA and it’s tournaments correct?

That's correct, yes.

Quote
Not sure why that would matter to much to the companies. The balls as a line aren’t banned, just the serial numbers that relate to balls being two years old correct?

I mean, Brunswick can keep producing Purple Hammers for as long as they want, they just can’t be from production ages older than two years to be used in the PBA?

To a degree. Since it is a rolling two years, then in 2023, the 20 and 21 serial number ages can't be used. Wash/rinse/repeat each year that goes by. But, yes, Brunswick can keep producing Purple Hammers as long as they want.

Quote
I can see where the complete ban on 16 & 17 Purples might upset Brunswick. They are the ones who have to cover the replacement costs. But they knew about that issue when they bought Ebonite. Maybe they presumed the issue was completely resolved and are pissed it was brought back up?

I can see them being upset it was brought back up, as they thought it was resolved as well, with the Jakob Buttruff situation 3 years before they bought EBI.

BL.
Logged

JessN16

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3716
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #201 on: April 13, 2022, 01:37:59 AM »
The other issue with the 16-17 Hammers is that one of the rumors that continues to float out there is that someone at the plant at the time knew they were bad and shipped them anyway. If so, it probably wasn't about trying to sneak great performance into the hands of bowlers, but something far more mundane like trying to control inventory waste on a balance sheet. Regardless, **IF TRUE** -- big caveat there -- then that is a case of deception, which fits neither the Motiv nor (at this point, as far as we know) the Storm scenarios and thus would justify a more retributive punishment.
Logged

bradl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1660
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #202 on: April 13, 2022, 02:41:01 AM »
Quote from: JessN16 on April 13, 2022, 01:37:59 AM
The other issue with the 16-17 Hammers is that one of the rumors that continues to float out there is that someone at the plant at the time knew they were bad and shipped them anyway. If so, it probably wasn't about trying to sneak great performance into the hands of bowlers, but something far more mundane like trying to control inventory waste on a balance sheet. Regardless, **IF TRUE** -- big caveat there -- then that is a case of deception, which fits neither the Motiv nor (at this point, as far as we know) the Storm scenarios and thus would justify a more retributive punishment.

That rumor tends to keep going around, but seeing that Ron Hickland himself was interviewed by the USBC for reasons of him working at EBI (but not at the time those were made) he would have more insight into what was known when those were made and what didn't happen. The USBC even put out themselves that no-one intentionally made these under spec and sent them out anyway. At that point with the USBC themselves debunking that rumor, you have to question the people spreading that rumor, let alone the source of that rumor, because this sounds like a simple case of one camp versus another camp because one may or may not like the other.

Ron's video:


This was already talked about and debunked in the Purple Hammer thread in this forum as well.

BL.
Logged

3835

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 736
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #203 on: April 13, 2022, 05:09:52 AM »
brad you are basing your comments on the March 7 2022 ruling.

However, the updated March 21 2022 ruling does specifically state that 4 additional interviews were done by the USBC and in those interviews "former Ebonite employees, including ones with first hand knowledge, provided detailed statements to USBC outlining how processes in 2016 and 2017 led to some Purple Hammers being produced and sent to the field below 72D. Multiple former Ebonite employees confirm that a production change took place in 2017 to raise the hardness of Purple Hammers produced in 2018 and 2019."

If that isn't the USBC saying yes, Ebonite knew they were bad and shipped them anyway, I don't know what is.

Here is the link to the article:

https://bowl.com/News/NewsDetails.aspx?id=23622337464

Logged

psycaz

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 333
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #204 on: April 13, 2022, 08:15:41 AM »
It reads as they’re splitting the difference on it. They weren’t produced intentionally to be soft. But it appears that it was known when they were produced, they came out soft. Shipped them anyways. A very fine distinction.

The issue causing the softness was corrected in subsequent production runs.

Now, had the issue about the Purples from back then not been brought back to the forefront, would the USBC just have let Storm correct the issue going forward like the purples (they weren’t permanent-banned until now)? Who knows, but you need to really wonder about it.
Logged

ignitebowling

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 998
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #205 on: April 15, 2022, 04:38:11 PM »
Keep feeding the beast on the newest notification for distributors to stop selling the 6 going forward or they will be upgraded to banned as well.

Do bowlers now hoard whats in shops or available online before they are gone?
Logged
Ignite your game, and set the lanes on fire. www.facebook.com/ignitebowling  or @ignite_bowling

psycaz

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 333
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #206 on: April 15, 2022, 05:10:09 PM »
Saw this update.

Makes zero sense. Storm is not selling them. They were already present in the distribution chain. Their “agreement” allows for them to be sold.

What’s the line?

I’m altering the deal. Pray I don’t alter it any further.
Logged

bradl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1660
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #207 on: April 15, 2022, 05:47:06 PM »
Quote from: ignitebowling on April 15, 2022, 04:38:11 PM
Keep feeding the beast on the newest notification for distributors to stop selling the 6 going forward or they will be upgraded to banned as well.

Do bowlers now hoard whats in shops or available online before they are gone?

Quote from: psycaz on April 15, 2022, 05:10:09 PM
Saw this update.

Makes zero sense. Storm is not selling them. They were already present in the distribution chain. Their “agreement” allows for them to be sold.

What’s the line?

I’m altering the deal. Pray I don’t alter it any further.

Disclaimer: I have not read this update nor seen it; I am not a distributor or PSO of any kind, so I am only going off of the above quoted posts.

What this tells me that may happen is that the balls are going to be banned. Here is why. If the distributors can't sell the balls to the PSOs, then the Pros will be able to buy them, either from the last stock that Storm directly has, or from those distributors, because the PBA is effectively the only place they can use them now.

In short, those balls already out in the field can not be replaced by any of those same balls, as if so, the USBC will move to outright ban them. So that leaves the only place for them to be sold and used is the PBA. However, if the distributor sells them to Pros in the PBA, then they will also risk having those balls be outright banned, because they technically are still selling the ball.

So what does that leave the distributor to do? The PSO is getting them back to the distributor, so their hands are washed clean, but the distributor is stuck on what to do.

Again, just my thoughts from the outside looking in, without knowing a single thing of what is contained in the update that went to the distributors.

BL.
Logged

3835

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 736
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #208 on: April 16, 2022, 07:39:27 PM »
After reading the release, my point of view is this. USBC threw Storm a bone and said we will let you keep the balls already in circulation approved other than the USBC tourneys etc. However, USBC didn't want any more balls sold.

Here is where it gets murky. I was told by my distributor it was okay to order what they had in stock. So I guess this is a matter of semantics. USBC said no more sales. Storm took that as no more sales to distributors....or wanted to take it that way. However, USBC obviously meant no more sales from distributors to pro shops.

So now Storm is going to have to eat a heck of a lot of balls from distributors too.
Logged

northface28

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3333
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #209 on: April 16, 2022, 09:40:02 PM »
Quote from: 3835 on April 16, 2022, 07:39:27 PM
After reading the release, my point of view is this. USBC threw Storm a bone and said we will let you keep the balls already in circulation approved other than the USBC tourneys etc. However, USBC didn't want any more balls sold.

Here is where it gets murky. I was told by my distributor it was okay to order what they had in stock. So I guess this is a matter of semantics. USBC said no more sales. Storm took that as no more sales to distributors....or wanted to take it that way. However, USBC obviously meant no more sales from distributors to pro shops.

So now Storm is going to have to eat a heck of a lot of balls from distributors too.

I agree. And that’s going to be a LOT of product.
Logged
NLMB 150 Dream Team
#NoTalking
#HellaBandz

bradl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1660
Re: 6 More balls stripped of approval
« Reply #210 on: April 17, 2022, 08:06:28 PM »
Quote from: 3835 on April 16, 2022, 07:39:27 PM
After reading the release, my point of view is this. USBC threw Storm a bone and said we will let you keep the balls already in circulation approved other than the USBC tourneys etc. However, USBC didn't want any more balls sold.

Here is where it gets murky. I was told by my distributor it was okay to order what they had in stock. So I guess this is a matter of semantics. USBC said no more sales. Storm took that as no more sales to distributors....or wanted to take it that way. However, USBC obviously meant no more sales from distributors to pro shops.

So now Storm is going to have to eat a heck of a lot of balls from distributors too.

Oh, this definitely will come down to semantics, and a bit of legalese as well. Case in point: would the PBA be considered a "distributor"? If so, could the sales from the PBA to its members be considered a "sale", according to the USBC? If not, then the PBA is the only place they can be sold, which goes back to my previous post.

If the PBA is considered a distributor by the USBC, then Storm is in trouble and has to eat all of that product; If it is not considered a distributor, then Storm has an out.

BL.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 12 13 [14] 15
« previous next »