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Author Topic: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?  (Read 4116 times)

HamPster

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A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« on: September 20, 2003, 04:53:01 AM »
This is my last year bowling righthanded.  I'm going to finish out the entire season this year (until May), but I'll be only practicing lefthanded.  And I'm going to ONLY bowl lefthanded.  I know there are several people who bowl ambidextrously, but have any switched completely from one hand to the other?  I was practicing today, and everything just keeps getting worse and worse.  My game has deteriorated so much that I can't stand to see shot after shot off target.  I used to be good, I used to be able to hit marks, I KNEW what move to make and when to make it, I could read lane changes and adapt.  Now I have only the mental side left, my physical performance is trash.  My arm and hand are so weak and screwed up that I can't even get the ball in the general area that I want to anymore.  I tried practicing today, and I could NOT get a clean shot off my hand to go outside 3rd arrow.  The ball would roll over that damn arrow every single time.  If I got it outside of 3rd arrow, it was only because I dumped it.  So as I've done just for fun a lot, I started bowling lefthanded.  My fingers and thumb are so much stronger on my left hand, I can keep my thumb straight and hold onto the ball, and I have an incredible release.  Just the way it's supposed to be, my thumb slides right out, and I can really catch the ball with my fingers.  I'm also incredibly versatile, I can play 4th arrow, and with a snap of my fingers switch to 1st arrow.  The clean release makes it all possible.  I trust the ball better, I'm in a better frame of mind, everything.  The only thing I don't totally have down is the coordination to repeat shot after shot.  My fingers and hand also get tired after four or five games.  I have to use plastic, but I can pick up the 7 nearly every time I shoot at it.  For as little as I've used my left hand, everytime I bowl with it, I make gigantic jumps in skill everytime.  I'm not abandoning all hope in my right arm, but I'd rather start making the transition now and see what my situation is in May.  And hey, I've got the entire side to myself too . .
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HAH!  I don't know ANYBODY now!

Being in adult leagues teaches you many things.  

1.  You're not on top anymore, but there are a lot more people that suck worse than you do now.  

2.  The myth about the youths having an easier shot is NOT TRUE.  I'd have an entire ring collection if it was.  

3.  Drunk adults are a lot funnier than drunk youths.

 

Strider

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2003, 08:19:45 PM »
I think my form is at least as good lefthanded, but I have no desire to redrill everything, buy new shoes, and practice a ton to get my strength up.  I'd probably have to drop to 13# at first to get any decent ball speed.  7 pins?  Ha!  I'd have to get Peachy to press the reset button for me.

Anyway...  Without knowing you personally, I would guess that your two biggest problems are trying to many changes (pitches, spans...) too fast and you're a perfectionist.  You also seem to be very hard on yourself.  Wouldn't you do the same things when you switched to lefty and your scores counted?

Since you still work in a proshop, at least you can get the ball work done cheaply.  Maybe you can do a summer league lefty with just 2-3 balls and see how you score.  If you like it, you can change for the following winter.  If you still struggle with being over critical of your preformance, at least you'll know where you stand.
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Penn State Proud ......THB with loft

The bowler (term used very lightly) formerly known as Strider

HamPster

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2003, 08:47:28 PM »
Lol, I wouldn't have to redrill anything.  I think my Power Groove reacts better lefthanded than it does righthanded.  I started changing things because of the way it felt.  I've always been mostly elbow, very little wrist and very little fingers.  I had Brian Voss and Lonnie Waliczek-like form, and now that my fingers are totally gone, I can't even revert back to that.  I don't have to worry about speed or rotation, the lanes are dry enough that I can fluff and have no problem getting strong reaction for carry.  I do see your point in that when I become more comfortable lefthanded, I'll probably change some things, but the difference is that my hand really overpowers the fitting.  As long as everything is close, I don't really notice it.  But when it comes to my right hand, every little thing is painfully noticeable.  I can handle a 15 alright, and probably throw it about 15 or 16 mph with average revs so far.  I will have to buy new shoes, which will suck, like you said.  Thanks, and again, my game has deteriorated so far that nothing short of turning back time will help, and changing hands will give me a whole new outlook too.  I have everything in front of me again, and as a perfectionist, it's always a lot easier to make progress than to regress.
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HAH!  I don't know ANYBODY now!

Being in adult leagues teaches you many things.  

1.  You're not on top anymore, but there are a lot more people that suck worse than you do now.  

2.  The myth about the youths having an easier shot is NOT TRUE.  I'd have an entire ring collection if it was.  

3.  Drunk adults are a lot funnier than drunk youths.

Rev_O

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2003, 10:43:47 PM »
i bowl both ways, and have 300 games both ways.

i only bowl righty now though.
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Rev-O

HamPster

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2003, 11:15:30 PM »
Hmm, what I plan to gain is sanity.  Cause my lack of performance is driving me crazy right now.  It's like getting something important taken away from you, it sucks.  Lefthanded, I get to start all over again.  And I'd like to be a guy like Revolutions that has 300's with both hands, that's really rare.  There's a guy that lives here that has 2 lefthanded and 10 righthanded.  Talk about inspiration.
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HAH!  I don't know ANYBODY now!

Being in adult leagues teaches you many things.  

1.  You're not on top anymore, but there are a lot more people that suck worse than you do now.  

2.  The myth about the youths having an easier shot is NOT TRUE.  I'd have an entire ring collection if it was.  

3.  Drunk adults are a lot funnier than drunk youths.

CoachJim

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2003, 11:31:31 PM »
I have a couple of questions for Hamster and Rev o lutions.

1. Are you ambidexterous?

2. Can you do anything else just as good with your left hand, as your right? (keep it clean)

HamPster

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2003, 11:57:51 PM »
Yeah, it's just not as strong.  I can shoot a basketball from fairly medium distance, throw things, but especially in b-ball, I'm almost more comfortable making layups from the left side.  Lol, I'm more coordinated with my left hand than most people are with their strong hand.  Not bragging, cause you sound like you're leading up to something, Jim . .
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HAH!  I don't know ANYBODY now!

Being in adult leagues teaches you many things.  

1.  You're not on top anymore, but there are a lot more people that suck worse than you do now.  

2.  The myth about the youths having an easier shot is NOT TRUE.  I'd have an entire ring collection if it was.  

3.  Drunk adults are a lot funnier than drunk youths.

agroves

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2003, 11:58:34 PM »
Hamster, as I read your post I look over at your name to make sure that I am not typing it.  I, too, feel your pain.  You poured my thoughts out onto paper or computer screen that is.

As for lefty, I practice occasionally.  I just throw whatever is handy.  I don't have a special ball drilled lefty for myself.  I always said that if I shot 900 I would quit bowling righty and go to the Darkside.  I believe I could average 160ish right now lefthanded.  However, like many others I would have to drop weight for awhile to gain the proper speed and consistency.  


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FUFU

HamPster

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2003, 12:05:13 AM »
Ahh, glad to know somebody understands.  Sucks to be going through it, but I guess what happens happens.
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HAH!  I don't know ANYBODY now!

Being in adult leagues teaches you many things.  

1.  You're not on top anymore, but there are a lot more people that suck worse than you do now.  

2.  The myth about the youths having an easier shot is NOT TRUE.  I'd have an entire ring collection if it was.  

3.  Drunk adults are a lot funnier than drunk youths.

C-G ProShop-Carl

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2003, 01:20:09 AM »
One of, if not the primary reason people miss inside and cannot get the ball out is because the elbow is kicking out in your follow through. Try that, see if it helps. Make sure you keep your elbow straight.


goodluck
Carl Hurd

Austintown Ohio (Wedgewood Lanes)

900 Global, AMF Staff Bowler

Tag Team Member #1

<b><i>TAG TEAM COACHING!!!!!!</i></b>/

HamPster

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2003, 01:23:14 AM »
Lol, can't do it.  Even when I think it's straight, it's not.  I did try that though, and actually had some pretty good shots.  It's just hard to keep your elbow in and get side rotation on the ball.  You've gotta turn your wrist.  And my fingers and thumb are so weak that I've really gotta grip the ball to hang onto it, and if I come close to keeping my elbow straight, I can pretty much forget about doing anything but dumping it.  Lol, serious issues.  I know what I need to do, I just can't do it!  It sucks!!!
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HAH!  I don't know ANYBODY now!

Being in adult leagues teaches you many things.  

1.  You're not on top anymore, but there are a lot more people that suck worse than you do now.  

2.  The myth about the youths having an easier shot is NOT TRUE.  I'd have an entire ring collection if it was.  

3.  Drunk adults are a lot funnier than drunk youths.

Game In a BoxLC

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2003, 04:11:54 AM »
few things

1-its not hard to get side rotation on a ball and keep your elbow in, actually its pretty natural.

2-contrary to what people on this board say its not THAT easy to switch hands.

3-It sounds to me like your game as a right hander is way too mechanical. Too many things must go right in order for the shot to be a success. Before you change your entire game, in essense learning how to bowl all over again, you should attempt to fix what you have now. It will not be easy to switch hands and over a long haul or tournaments you simply will not hold up, and the simple matter is you most likely do not have as much control of your left arm as you do your right.

4-My suggestion. Before you go changing things. Stop worrying about doing this right or that right. Go practice, instead of working on doing this or correcting this or having this happen. Work on this, simplify your game

in Stance, arm to the side of you, small controlled, repeatable pushaway, free loose armswing, open up your hips to push the ball out, get into a knee bend, long and low at the release, and accerate thru. Work on each step progressively, get to each point after mastering one. First start in your stance, do pushaway drills, repeat doing pushaways only, maybe 30-40 times. After this feels natural, go to the next step. All this you don't need to use a ball or even be on a lane to do. This is called muscle memory, it is used by pitchers at the collegiate and proffessional level (trust me i know, i lived them for 2 yrs in college) and they work wonders. Your muscles will learn these movements and repeat them.

This game isn't that hard, it sounds to me like your trying to do too many things or worry about too many things. Your always nitpicking the tiniest detail like sticking, or seeing something in your line of sight. Pick a target, hit it with a compact, simple, basic approach and delivery. You don't need to turn it up, or worry about how much side rotation you are getting or how much ballspeed, worry about it being natural. Like many say on here, perfect your A game before going to B and C.

I went thru the same thing you did. I used to have a huge pushaway, a long sweeping backswing, and just rip the cover off the ball at the bottom of the swing, i had a whole bunch of stutter steps, stops, drifts, etc. and it was just impossible to repeat shots. I was getting ready to quit competitive bowling until i decided to just simplify what i had. Make this game easier, less to worry about, less to go wrong. My average has went up, but more importantly my consistancy is up. I used to be a 279, 155 type bowler. Now almost every game is 180+ i dont have many terrible games, and unless i lose carry or something happens i am within 10 pins of my 220 average. Now i have lost some of the rotation i had, i was about 500-530 rpm, i've backed it down to 400-450 which is plenty, my ballspeed is in control, i am in control, and i can repeat shots meaning i will score on many more conditions.

Just try it, it will take alot of work, but you say you wanna be good at this game, one of the best. It doesn't happen over night and switching to another hand will only make it a harder and prolonged journey. Instead of pouting around and saying i'm terrible, get out there, fix it.
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am i still considered a lefty, i never get to play the left side of the lane

CoachJim

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2003, 07:01:47 AM »
Hamster, Lefty Crank said most of what I was going to say. I see people try to bowl opposite handed and think they can do it, but unless they are truly ambedexterous, or have a gifted talent for bowling they never get much beyond 150 or 160.

The trap is that your opposite side seems to do everything you natural side will not do. That is because your brain knows what to do and your muscle memory is nonexistant on your left side, so it gets programed with the proper info. Now here is where the trap lies, you are pleased with your preformance now, but how about a year or 2 from now when you plateu out around 150 and every pin after that is like it is now going up one pin at a time for years and years. This is because you do not have that feel that you were mentioning in your posts, this will prevent you from ever being able to repeat shots without massive amounts of practice ie 10-15 games/day for years and years to develope it. That feel is not something that is easily developed. I have been bowling for 25+ years and when I video tape myself I am doing the opposite of what it feels like I am doing (which is one of the reasons I suck but that is another post). I would suggest staying with your right hand and get a good coach, and listen to his/her suggestions. If you don't get a coach then get a video camera and video tape yourself.

Work slowly to get the feel of how you want to release the ball. Even if that means spending the whole day at the foul line and perfecting it without the rest of your approach, then do one shot corectly at the foul line then do your full approach with it, then repeat this for 10 shots, then video tape yourself again and see if you are releasing the ball the way you want.

I have been working with Dr. Jeff Briggs and Ron Clifton, they have gotten me out of turning my whole arm around the ball at the release by pointing my fingers to the inside and keeping my thumb outside of my elbow to the release, then extending my fingers through the follow through. This really works, but it took several months to get it down and I still don't do it right all the time.

You have to be patient with yourself, when you practice stick with one thing and do your best to get that one thing down. Be honest with yourself, make yourself repeat your lesson 10 times in a row without mistake and if you do make a mistake you start all over (can't tell you the number of times I got to the 9th shot and flubbed it). This has a two fold method, one to grind in the change you have made and two to do it under the pressure of having to start all over again. When your thumb is blistered and you can't take it any more, you would be suprised how hard you learn to concentrate on that 10th shot.

I have seen people try to bowl opposite handed and quit bowling all together after they realize they were not as good as they thought and were going to have to work even harder than they did with their "NATURAL" side.

Best of Luck to you either way.

Jim

LuckyLefty

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2003, 08:45:02 AM »
I had to switch to lefty after injury to my right thumb as a young righty bowler.

I throw a nice looking ball lefty.  Always did.

My first season I averaged 142, I AM not ambidextrous!

I threw a lot of gutters and missed spares all the time.

Now with a LOT of work I've gotten quite a bit better and had a lot of success.

I still after 4 years of doing it religiously have these problems/advantages.

In 4 to 5 man league formats I get out of sync--- (too much waiting).
I struggle with spares unless I practice just corner pins over 2 hours a week.

I can't get warmed up for a league in just 4 or 5 throws.

I get tired after 2 games most of the time in competition, not practice.

I can get into coordination funks that last for a week or so.

Why these are advantages for me also are.
1. I can decide to devote 20 30 or 40 hours to spare practice before a big tournament.

Bottom line is that because of formats of league I average almost 20 pins less, due to lack of warm up time, lack of flow, lack of evenness and usually a terrible first game.

Tournaments it's a different story.

Bottomline I'd bowl righty my coordinated side any day if I could.

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS I've seen a lot of guys try to switch who throw a beautiful ball, most struggle for a month or two and don't get above 165 because of the problems listed above.


2.  Most tournaments don't have 5 bowlers on pair.
3.  If I get in synch and flow watch out.



It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

Rev_O

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Re: A change of a gargantuan nature. Has anyone done this before?
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2003, 09:32:46 AM »
quote:
I have a couple of questions for Hamster and Rev o lutions.

1. Are you ambidexterous?

2. Can you do anything else just as good with your left hand, as your right? (keep it clean)



Coach Jim,

I would have to say yes, I am. I averaged 225 that year RH, and 217 LH. Also, I golf both ways, play to a 2 hdcp RH, and a 7 from the Leftside.
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Rev-O