First of all, personally I don't care.  If it's legal, I'll bowl with it, if it's not, I won't, don't care.  I think USBC is missing a chance to differentiate recreation from sport though.  The average bowler doesn't get patterns.  Yeah the blue oil looks cool on the PBA shows, but there's no blue oil at league, so they have no basis for comparison.  You can show them lane graphs and pictures, but until they actually see it AND bowl on it, they're not going to get it or understand.  HOWEVER, it's really easy to understand the difference between college baseball players using aluminum bats and the pros using wood, and it's nothing that has to be explained to be understood.  All you have to say is that the pros have equipment restrictions, they can't use the balls that make it "easier" to score like league bowlers can, because when people see pros using the same balls they do bowling on lanes that look the same as theirs, they see no difference. 

Now the issue for the manufacturers becomes that they lose advertisement for balls that aren't legal for use on the PBA, but I really don't think the PBA has much influence on ball purchases anymore.  Literally not once in the last three years have I had anyone come into the shop and say, "I want the ball -insert random pro- won with the other day."  I could be wrong, but 10-15 years ago, that happened all the time.  Somebody would win with a ball on a Sunday, and Monday I'd have people in there wanting one.  Now it seems to be primarily consumer and manufacturer driven. 

This idea makes sense to me, continue with the current specs, but put spec restrictions on equipment for use in higher level competition.  The funny thing is it doesn't even matter, most people I know use equipment that's inside the new rumored specs anyway, not going to hurt my feelings, but it could hurt manufacturers who all the sudden lose maybe a couple ball lines, and more limited specs means more limited reactions which means more limited choices which means less revenue most likely.  There NEEDS to be a bolder line between recreation and sport, and it needs to be achieved without adjusting the recreation side. 

Lets not feel too sorry for the USBC operating budget. I've looked over the numbers as they're public..has anyone else? When you break it down per person, yes its ridiculously cheap, but it could be $5 and some people would still complain. The reason some people would still complain is because the USBC doesn't do anything to show people what they actually do for bowling.

We assume they collect everyone's money, play around with their rule book, and approve bowling balls from manufacturers, and that is it. Please tell me about something else they do that the general bowling community knows about without them having to do doing research into the USBC. I'll wait....

One of the keys to them getting positive feedback about sanctioning fees from the bowling community is transparency. Make examples public like
-"20% of fees taken in this year will be covering Awards. "
- "The USBC has decided to run traveling camps to help youth bowlers develop their skills that will take 3.5% of our budget this year."
-"We at the USBC are looking to improve "insert aspect of bowling" and will be sending out surveys asking for opinions via email to your registered email when you became sanctioned this year. Also guess what, we wont continue utilizing condescending Facebook posts deleting any comments that are more than one word answers"

Chad Murphy has reached a point where he doesn't actually give a sh!t what any of us think. He has an agenda to change bowling the way he thinks is best and we're along for the ride. No one, no matter the cost wants to contribute to such a cause, and honestly would prefer to spend their money in a rebellion to it.  It doesn't take a political genius to see that Chad needs to run repair on himself publicly to the bowling community before he can turn this ship in the right direction. It doesn't matter what kind of person he might actually be and knowledge he might actually have. He allowed a specific image to be created of himself, and many just see Hitler at the helm at this point.

As long as crooks like Frank DeSocio at the BPAA are calling the shots at the USBC Chad is protected. He’s making his 300k a year and he’s gonna ride it all the way down because nobody on the planet is paying a high school educated ball rep that kind of money except the USBC.

I know I am reiterating a few things here, but I digress. I am seventeen years old, just started bowling three years ago, and I don't see this going well at all, because, as you all said, the lower rev bowlers are the ones really being hit by this, however, this could hurt, not the majority, but a somewhat noticeable part of the future of bowling, as, even though hook doesn't equal skill, there are some kids who just want to bowl, have fun and hook the ball, I see in my youth league even today hook envy, and this will only limit what those smaller kids can do, frustrating them, maybe even prompting them to quit.
This may just be my experience at league, but if it isn't, these possible ruling may have some dire consequences.

Quote from: keegan.mier on December 21, 2017, 08:41:59 PM

I know I am reiterating a few things here, but I digress. I am seventeen years old, just started bowling three years ago, and I don't see this going well at all, because, as you all said, the lower rev bowlers are the ones really being hit by this, however, this could hurt, not the majority, but a somewhat noticeable part of the future of bowling, as, even though hook doesn't equal skill, there are some kids who just want to bowl, have fun and hook the ball, I see in my youth league even today hook envy, and this will only limit what those smaller kids can do, frustrating them, maybe even prompting them to quit.
This may just be my experience at league, but if it isn't, these possible ruling may have some dire consequences.

Thanks for giving us a younger perspective which the sport/game badly needs.  Good job Chad even the future thinks yeah that idea is just the worst.

I think it was tou who mentioned it Hack, but don't you think the patterns will be modified to allow the changes in equipment to hook? There are a few places around my area that already don't put out out enough oil for hook monsters to show their actual potential. Balls that are middle of the road tend to hook more where bowlers like seeing the shape. In my case, I have to throw stuff like a Boost, Purple Pearl Urethane, and a Pitch Black.

everything below
+100

Lets not feel too sorry for the USBC operating budget. I've looked over the numbers as they're public..has anyone else? When you break it down per person, yes its ridiculously cheap, but it could be $5 and some people would still complain. The reason some people would still complain is because the USBC doesn't do anything to show people what they actually do for bowling.

We assume they collect everyone's money, play around with their rule book, and approve bowling balls from manufacturers, and that is it. Please tell me about something else they do that the general bowling community knows about without them having to do doing research into the USBC. I'll wait....

One of the keys to them getting positive feedback about sanctioning fees from the bowling community is transparency. Make examples public like
-"20% of fees taken in this year will be covering Awards. "
- "The USBC has decided to run traveling camps to help youth bowlers develop their skills that will take 3.5% of our budget this year."
-"We at the USBC are looking to improve "insert aspect of bowling" and will be sending out surveys asking for opinions via email to your registered email when you became sanctioned this year. Also guess what, we wont continue utilizing condescending Facebook posts deleting any comments that are more than one word answers"

Chad Murphy has reached a point where he doesn't actually give a sh!t what any of us think. He has an agenda to change bowling the way he thinks is best and we're along for the ride. No one, no matter the cost wants to contribute to such a cause, and honestly would prefer to spend their money in a rebellion to it.  It doesn't take a political genius to see that Chad needs to run repair on himself publicly to the bowling community before he can turn this ship in the right direction. It doesn't matter what kind of person he might actually be and knowledge he might actually have. He allowed a specific image to be created of himself, and many just see Hitler at the helm at this point.

You can always compare organizations that establish the rules for the 2 largest participation sports for adults in this country. But I agree they are nothing alike after that, the USGA is respected, the USBC is a joke.

You can't compare the USGA and the USBC.  The USGA has the cash cow that is the US Open that basically funds everything they do.

There are many golfers that are not USGA members directly but pay for the GHIN handicap service through their course, club or league, which is run by the USGA.

Quote from: HackJandy on December 21, 2017, 09:53:32 PM

Quote from: keegan.mier on December 21, 2017, 08:41:59 PM

I know I am reiterating a few things here, but I digress. I am seventeen years old, just started bowling three years ago, and I don't see this going well at all, because, as you all said, the lower rev bowlers are the ones really being hit by this, however, this could hurt, not the majority, but a somewhat noticeable part of the future of bowling, as, even though hook doesn't equal skill, there are some kids who just want to bowl, have fun and hook the ball, I see in my youth league even today hook envy, and this will only limit what those smaller kids can do, frustrating them, maybe even prompting them to quit.
This may just be my experience at league, but if it isn't, these possible ruling may have some dire consequences.

Thanks for giving us a younger perspective which the sport/game badly needs.  Good job Chad even the future thinks yeah that idea is just the worst.

I think it was tou who mentioned it Hack, but don't you think the patterns will be modified to allow the changes in equipment to hook? There are a few places around my area that already don't put out out enough oil for hook monsters to show their actual potential. Balls that are middle of the road tend to hook more where bowlers like seeing the shape. In my case, I have to throw stuff like a Boost, Purple Pearl Urethane, and a Pitch Black.

I would say as long as they don't ban equipment I already bought I would be fine with it but honestly at this point just can't see myself ever bowling in a USBC sanctioned league while that toolbag is still in charge.  Just won't do it.  Luckily you can enjoy bowling quite easily without giving the USBC money which I am sure chaps their hide.  Eventually I will step up in competition level but in no rush.  Love the game and not going to let the sport ruin it.  If they allowed my Hy-Road (what I mostly use anyway) I know I could compete just fine but just the slimey way this is all being done is what bothers me.  If these changes go through not sure I will ever really want to join the USBC because what's next with no accountability?  Will still obviously affect the balls going forward you can buy but at least they will get no money from me.  If I honestly believed this was being done for the good of the game  or would even fix the problems its supposed to, wouldn't have posted to this thread at all.  You are going to see even more absorbent cover stocks to make up for the difference so Chad's double burn is going to be just as FUBAR.