win a ball from Bowling.com

Author Topic: Am I Off Base?  (Read 6481 times)

TWOHAND834

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4357
Am I Off Base?
« on: April 12, 2022, 07:24:29 AM »
Bear in mind I have been out of league bowling for the past 5 years and getting back into it.  Last night it is position round and we find out in frame 3 of the first game that a bowler on the other team did not have the required number of games to be eligible to bowl.  Instead of this bowler stopping and putting in the absent bowler that had the minimum required games and taking the absent score; he was still allowed to bowl as a "pacer".  I am well aware of what a pacer is.  My discussion with a league official is that it is position round and you are allowing a bowler whose scores do not count the opportunity to affect the oil pattern in one way or another.  He said, "Well does it really matter"?  I said it doesnt 28 frames in at this point (night was almost over).  But yes it does matter.  He just happened to be one of these bowlers that crow bars at the release point trying to generate Robert Smith rev rate and spraying it all over the middle of the lane.  So it mattered a lot.  I was coming off a run over the last month where I had shot 816, 809, and 792.  So with it being position round, you can understand how I was a little amped up going into last night.  Lo and behold my ball reaction was very inconsistent and fought to shoot 640.

I understand allowing a pacer bowl if the opposing team had nobody show up.  But it is a trio league and 2 qualifying members of that team showed up.  So there was really no reason for a pacer.  While this league official is telling me his side; I am trying to emphasize it is a position round and all points are more crucial than normal in the standings.  He said we could bring it up in the league meeting next week and my response was that I did not want to look like that one bowler in every league that everyone hates and I would just take the lumps but I guess I just come from a different place and mindset and not used to the more relaxed ways to run a league. I get this is not the big money league in that center.  But there is some competition where they run 10-15 brackets every night as well as the strike jackpot the center has.  I just thought it was a bad decision to allow an ineligible bowler the opportunity to bowl for free during a crucial week when points mattered more than normal.   
Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

 

itsallaboutme

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2017
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2022, 08:21:46 AM »
Rule 110d.  2.  Pacers are allowed unless otherwise provided by league rule.

TWOHAND834

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4357
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2022, 08:47:38 AM »
Rule 110d.  2.  Pacers are allowed unless otherwise provided by league rule.

Yeah.  I get it.  But this one has that feel like a batter trying to lay down a bunt in the 8th inning when the opposing pitcher has a no hitter going.  I just dont understand why that is allowed to take place.
Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

ignitebowling

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1003
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2022, 09:50:06 AM »
It was allowed because everyone else was okay with it but you apparently?

If you shot 750 plus would you be making this post?

If the person had the correct number of games and you still shot 640 then would you complain about something else?

If you had the chance to go back and do it over again what would you have done differently?

Ignite your game, and set the lanes on fire. www.facebook.com/ignitebowling  or @ignite_bowling

Jesse James

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3617
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2022, 09:59:03 AM »
Hmmm. I have to agree with Twohands on this one.

Its the principle of the event. This guy or gal didn't show up to be a pacer, so why in the heck are you going to allow him to continue as such, just because the league allows pacers?

Its pretty disingenuous to me! If I'm the secretary, I tell him thanks for coming but you should've checked your eligibility first! You place zero responsibility on the bowlers themselves. So what's to prevent this from happening again in the future since you've allowed the bending of the rules this time?
Some days you're the bug....some days you're the windshield...that's bowling!

psycaz

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 333
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2022, 10:25:08 AM »
Going to agree with Twohand834.

Position rounds typically have restrictions already. Pacers should be excluded.

Twohand834, you definitely should bring it up at the next meeting. Get a clear answer one way or the other for the next time it occurs.

Sounds like it was preplanned, to either sneak him in, when that failed, then to screw with the other team because they called it out his ineligibility to bowl for score.

3835

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 745
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2022, 10:41:35 AM »
Well a few things....

Did the bowler/team know the person did not have enough games in? Did they know the league rules? The bowler may have known they only had X games in, but did not know they needed Y games in to bowl in the rolloffs.

However, it is up to the captain to know the rules, so no excuse there.

Further, if the league allows for pacers, not much you can do. Although it may seem disingenuous, remember that and make a point to bring this up during the meeting prior to league starting next season to change the rule moving forward. Or, if the league votes to keep the rule as is and allows pacers, you now know what can happen in the future.

kiefenstien

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 177
  • Past Exalted Ruler Baraboo Elks Lodge #688
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2022, 11:04:50 AM »
We don't allow pacers in our league. It was voted on in the league, you must have so many games in to bowl in the position round.
The principles of the B.P.O.E. are:
CHARITY, JUSTICE, BROTHERLY LOVE, AND FIDELITY.

The Elks are committed to their mission,
“So long as there are veterans, the Benevolent and Protective Order of Elks will never forget them.”

300 GAME 10/6/2021

TWOHAND834

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4357
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2022, 12:59:51 PM »
It was allowed because everyone else was okay with it but you apparently?

If you shot 750 plus would you be making this post?

If the person had the correct number of games and you still shot 640 then would you complain about something else?

If you had the chance to go back and do it over again what would you have done differently?



Ignite,

This is all hypothetical.  He was told in the second frame of the first frame he didnt have enough games.  I was pretty clear in my original post.  As someone new to the area bowling wise; I was not going to make a huge stink about it and I did not throw any type of tantrum while I was bowling.  I dealt with it and walked out.  I want to be respected by my peers and want to respect them as well.  That has always been my approach as I want those around me to feel like they can approach me about anything bowling related.  When I went to the league official, even though I was upset on the inside I did not let it dictate the conversation.  I more or less went to him with an open mind because I didnt know how they do their leagues here compared to where I bowled for more than 35 years.  He said he gave the guy permission to keep bowling as a pacer and therefore that is where it lies whether I agree or not.  As far as what I would have done differently I really dont know since the league official ultimately allowed him to continue.  I am not a vindictive person.  At the end of the day I chalk this up to not giving up and grinding out a decent series even though the conditions were not favorable for higher scoring.
Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

acread

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 42
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2022, 01:51:46 PM »
There are definitely times when a situation can be uncool verging on wrong, but also legal.  Unfortunately, this appears to be one of those times.  I agree that this needs to be brought up in the league meeting so it never happens again, but there's really nothing anybody could have done under the rules to prevent it happening at the time.  Therefore, it was probably handled correctly by the league official.  Hopefully, it leads to a better future for the league, though.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2022, 01:53:39 PM by acread »
Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.

milorafferty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11184
  • I have a name, therefore no preferred pronouns.
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2022, 02:02:03 PM »
Is it possible you let this get into your head instead of another bowler "spraying it all over the middle of the lane" and causing an issue?

According to your OP, it's a trios league and I assume on a house shot. How much difference can one bowler make in a three game set?
"If guns kill people, do pencils misspell words?"

"If you don't stand for our flag, then don't expect me to give a damn about your feelings."

TWOHAND834

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4357
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2022, 02:48:46 PM »
Is it possible you let this get into your head instead of another bowler "spraying it all over the middle of the lane" and causing an issue?

According to your OP, it's a trios league and I assume on a house shot. How much difference can one bowler make in a three game set?

You would be shocked Milo.  There is so much volume in the heads that even though we are not using urethane or plastic we get carrydown after only the first 5 frames of the first game and that is also with my teammate slow hooking a Zen off third arrow.  This guy that bowled, as the joke goes, hit the same two boards all night.  However, both boards have arrows on them.  LOL!!!!  He is standing on 35 and one shot only gets to 12-14 at the breakpoint and the next is out to 3-4-5 at the breakpoint because he is one of those guys that just wants to see how much he can hook it grabbing the hell out of the ball as opposed to softening his release and trying to be more accurate. 

Obviously from night to night we may or may not encounter a bowler like this but it was just the combination of being a position round and an ineligible bowler due to not meeting the required games.  At the end of the day, it is what it is and life goes on.  I just wanted to see what everyone thoughts were if they went through the same thing and I do appreciate the responses guys.
Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

Remmah

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 110
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2022, 03:07:53 PM »
Yes you are off base you sound like a 5 year old

TWOHAND834

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4357
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2022, 03:20:05 PM »
Yes you are off base you sound like a 5 year old

There is always one.  Judging by your screen name is seems you have it backwards sir.  LOL!
Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

Juggernaut

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6498
  • Former good bowler, now 3 games a week house hack.
Re: Am I Off Base?
« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2022, 08:04:40 PM »
Our league voted for no pacers and no subs in position rounds. If you’re not a full team member, with enough games in to have an average, you cannot bowl in position round.
Learn to laugh, and love, and smile, cause we’re only here for a little while.