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Author Topic: Armswing and Release Help!!!  (Read 4124 times)

rlt110

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Armswing and Release Help!!!
« on: March 23, 2010, 03:24:48 AM »
I just had a quick question about a release flaw one of my friends was telling me about last night. I have only been bowling about 2 years. First year I averaged 167 throwing the ball all over the place(revving it way too much). This year I have worked a lot on my game and am averaging 190. My friend is a very good bowler (shot his 4th 800 of the year last night) and said that the thing he is seeing the most from me is something at the release.

Here is basically exactly what he said "Your arm swing is getting much better. You are keeping it straight which will help your speed be more consistent. The problem is that at, or just before you completely release the ball, you start to turn your hand to the outside part of the ball. This is going to cause you to sometimes get your thumb "caught" in the ball. This will lead to some shots coming off your hand pure, but others getting hung up and leading to inaccuracy."

I am really struggling with this guys. When I first started bowling, I know that I used to "come over the top" of the ball. I have really worked on keeping my elbow close to my body to try and work the "inside" part of the ball. However, he is saying that I am not coming over the ball anymore, but rather sometimes starting my hand rotation a split second early.

I really could use some more incite, instruction, and understanding on the topic. Is this a mechanics issue, or just timing issue. What can I do?
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milorafferty

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2010, 11:33:31 AM »
Check out the "Ring Finger Lead" technique as promoted by John Jowdy. It  means to keep your ring finger in front of your swing through the target path. I think the idea being that is your hand is in such position that your ring finger is in front of the middle finger and index finger, your elbow cannot fly out(otherwise known as chickenwinging). This will keep you from coming around the ball early.
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rlt110

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2010, 12:05:57 PM »
ttt
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Jay

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2010, 01:34:24 AM »
Another way to think of it, which I like best, is to work on keeping your forearm square to your ball path.
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deep15

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2010, 09:20:20 AM »
There is nothing wrong with having your hand start to rotate around the ball just before release. All you are doing is increasing your axis rotation. Ideally, you should be able to adjust rotation if the lane calls for it. If you are looking for more backend reaction, more rotation is fine. If you are looking to smooth out the backend reaction, then yes, keeping your hand behind the ball more at the bottom is what you should try and do...and the suggestions above are a few ways to accomplish that.
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dizzyfugu

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2010, 09:39:35 AM »
quote:
There is nothing wrong with having your hand start to rotate around the ball just before release. All you are doing is increasing your axis rotation. Ideally, you should be able to adjust rotation if the lane calls for it. If you are looking for more backend reaction, more rotation is fine. If you are looking to smooth out the backend reaction, then yes, keeping your hand behind the ball more at the bottom is what you should try and do...and the suggestions above are a few ways to accomplish that.


What rlt110 suffers from is topping the ball - coming around it and robbing himself of the chance to get the thumb out cleanly. Creating revs this way results in spin, not real powerful roll. This can be effective on dry shots and THS, but is IMHO not a "good" release.

My advice: check your timing. And follow the Jowdy lead with the ring finger trick, it should help a lot. Make sure you release the ball just a moment before it passes your sliding foot's ankle, and literally push the ball out onto the lane (not upwards, and also with no extra turn of your wrist). If it goes right, you should feel the ball roll over your fingertips, and from personal experience this is easiyl achieved with a firm wrist throughout the delivery, with no extra turn whatsoever. The latter is normally a sign of a weak wrist, resulting in topping the ball (see above).

Good luck, though, that's a tough and fundamental challenge!
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Monster Pike

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2010, 10:07:04 AM »
Yeah, what milo said.  Everything I''ve read says start with that.  

And then if you feel you still want/need more revs, & only then, you can do something I saw on a bowling site.  It said some of the more advanced bowlers start with their hands holding the bowl cupped with the thumb pointed out, away from the body toward the next approach (like a back-up ball position).  It forces you to have to bring the ball back around a bit at release at the same time leading w/the ring finger to prevent chicken winging.  This takes practice, practice & more practice, something you can work on in the summer, not right now.  I made the mistake of being to anxious & trying it out this fall/winter league & still don''t have it perfected.  Thus I''ve been pretty inconsistent & have seen my average dip 10 or so pins this yr.  Been kind of frustrating, but I''ve gone too far to turn back now.....

Good bowling!
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Edited on 3/24/2010 10:08 AM
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rlt110

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2010, 10:13:34 AM »
Well I tried something different last night. Just after my push away, I "locked" my wrist into a strong position and kept it loaded with no movement throughout the armswing. I was pleasantly surprised with the result. My ball seemed to roll a lot "heavier", my thumb seemed to exit just before my ankle, and my fingers actually began to burn. I asked someone and they said this means the ball is rolling off your fingers really well.
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Monster Pike

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2010, 10:16:58 AM »
quote:
Well I tried something different last night. Just after my push away, I "locked" my wrist into a strong position and kept it loaded with no movement throughout the armswing. I was pleasantly surprised with the result. My ball seemed to roll a lot "heavier", my thumb seemed to exit just before my ankle, and my fingers actually began to burn. I asked someone and they said this means the ball is rolling off your fingers really well.


Good job.  The main thing to remember is whatever works for you.  Some times we all try to change our game too much & get really discombuberated.
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deep15

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2010, 01:36:19 PM »
dizzy,
       My comments were referring to his statement saying that he wasn't "topping the ball", but rather coming around the side of it, just before release. Side roll does not create spin, fyi. If rotating your hand around the ball just before release is a bad thing, then Pete Weber needs to give back his 30 some odd titles.
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TamerBowling

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2010, 09:22:43 PM »
Just keep in mind that to get hook, it literally only requires a quarter turn in the wrist.  The tendency for bowlers, especially when they first start bowling is to "curve" it.  They assume curving it requires a big turn of the wrist.  Many times, that causes the "topping" effect someone mentions which gives that very small and low track.  It's simply not very effective.
You need to stay behind the ball.  Try what some others mentioned.  Locking the wrist is a good idea.

Regarding the comment on Pete Weber, his time has come and gone.  The amount of side roll he generates was very effective in the pre-reactive ball days.  He was able to do things to a ball that no others could.  Today, that amount of side roll is really too much.  His ball is always driving so hard and finishes to the left of the 9 pin frequently.  I love watching PDW, he's a legend.  But the reality is the guys getting less side rotation, e.g., WRWJ, Norm Duke, etc. are the ones still winning tournaments now.
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rlt110

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2010, 11:05:20 PM »
I was mostly confused by the fact that I definitely don't "top" the ball. I actually have a high track. I think it is just more of a timing and hand positioning issue.
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dizzyfugu

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2010, 05:57:08 AM »
quote:
Well I tried something different last night. Just after my push away, I "locked" my wrist into a strong position and kept it loaded with no movement throughout the armswing. I was pleasantly surprised with the result. My ball seemed to roll a lot "heavier", my thumb seemed to exit just before my ankle, and my fingers actually began to burn. I asked someone and they said this means the ball is rolling off your fingers really well.


This sounds very good - feels strange when you try it the first time, but you will notice the different and much "cleaner" ball recation due to the rolling release onto the lane instead of forcing revs "from the side" onto the ball.
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dizzyfugu

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Re: Armswing and Release Help!!!
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2010, 06:00:54 AM »
quote:
dizzy,
       My comments were referring to his statement saying that he wasn't "topping the ball", but rather coming around the side of it, just before release. Side roll does not create spin, fyi. If rotating your hand around the ball just before release is a bad thing, then Pete Weber needs to give back his 30 some odd titles.


Ah, yes, O.K., I am sorry if I sounded too single-minded Side rotation is not an issue if you have a release with a firm wrist - you are absolutly correct about this. But IMHO it is a huge problem with a weak wrist, because the motion the player makes is coming around the ball, "screwing" it, while the thumb tends to stay in the ball too long, resulting rather in spin and a lowered track than a  higher track with more side rotation. I just had the latter case in mind
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