BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: xiek376 on October 23, 2013, 07:29:26 AM
-
For someone with little experience in maintaining equipment, what is recommended as far as ball maintenance? I have a Storm cleaning product that the pro shop sold me and said to clean the ball at least ever 12 - 15 games. Is that all I need to be doing? Is there a rule of thumb as far as getting a ball resurfaced after X number of games?
I'm getting back into bowling in a big way after a long layoff, and I want to ensure I'm making the most out of my equipment. Thanks!
-
Which Storm cleaning product?
For Cleaning:
You do need only one serious bowling ball cleaner that will remove oil, after each use. There are 3 great, non-abrasive ones for all balls, but if yours is dull, there are several others that you can use, which contain abrasives.
For coverstock maintenance:
You do need more equipment/supplies for maintaining the surface finish, be it polished or dull OR you can use the services of your local pro shop. The surface changes over time due to use; that time can be as little as 12 - 20 games or as long as 40 - 50, but it will need maintenance.
-
The cleaner I have is the Storm Reacta Foam, does this happen to be one of the 3 you refer to? Also, are you saying I should use this after each league night rather than the 12 - 15 games I mention?
I have a Brunswick C System Max. Surface isn't polished, it's as it came out of box. Is it just a feel thing as far as how many games I'd need to adjust the surface?
Thanks!
-
In addition to the above, I recommend cleaning the ball after each use. Most reactive balls absorb oil quite fast. Between the pinsetter and the ball return some has soaked in, so wipe it off between shots and clean it before putting it away.
Depending on your lane conditions, light resurfacing needs to be done anytime you start noticing a decrease in it's ability to read friction. Sometimes that is around 30-40 games, and for me it rarely goes beyond 30 games. Oil extraction will usually need to be done around the 60-80 game point.
Some routine scheduled maintenance will keep your ball performing and your carry percentages higher.
-
The cleaner I have is the Storm Reacta Foam, does this happen to be one of the 3 you refer to? Also, are you saying I should use this after each league night rather than the 12 - 15 games I mention?
No, it is not one that I would recommend to remove oil. The bowling-ball specific cleaners that truly remove oil are LMI cleaner (formerly LaneMasters), Hook-It and Clean and Dull.
If you're only cleaning the ball every 12-5 games, you might as well not do it at all. You should wipe the track during bowling every time you pick up the ball. The ball should be cleaned immediately after bowling at the center, before putting it back in the bag. Oil is absorbed at an incredible rate.
I have a Brunswick C System Max. Surface isn't polished, it's as it came out of box. Is it just a feel thing as far as how many games I'd need to adjust the surface?
Thanks!
Looks/appearance and ball reaction combined should show you when to do refresh the surface.
I don't know from whom you got your Versa-Max, but the stock surface is a high gloss polish. See
http://www.ballreviews.com/brunswick/csystem-versamax-t1263.0.html (http://www.ballreviews.com/brunswick/csystem-versamax-t1263.0.html)
You should ask the person from whom you purchased it what surface they put on the ball. BUT then there's the fact that you've been using it regularly and who knows what surface is on it now. Use generally brings a ball to the area of 20000 grit dull or matte over the course of time. But that is just a generalization that depends on many factors. Where yours is right now, I haven't a clue.
notclay probably added some things I may have forgotten to state.
-
Looks like I need to get a new cleaner and start using it. The pro shop mentioned the Storm stuff as being the best stuff available and mentioned 15 games specifically...
Is there a certain type of towel I should use for applying the cleaner and/or just for wiping it off between shots?
Sorry, I meant I have the C System Maxxed Out. It has been used, but only 3 weeks worth of league bowling. It's working great for me so far, and I want to make sure I maintain it properly.
Glad I checked in here, thanks for the help!
-
Looks like I need to get a new cleaner and start using it. The pro shop mentioned the Storm stuff as being the best stuff available and mentioned 15 games specifically...
Is there a certain type of towel I should use for applying the cleaner and/or just for wiping it off between shots?
Micro-fiber towels have proved extremely effective to remove oil and most other dirt. They're found almost everywhere, from Wal-Mart, K-Mart to Home Depot and department stores and car parts stores. For $10 you should be able to get 10 of them, 14" x 14", 16" x 16" more or less. At Costco, Sam's Club or BJ's, they're even cheaper and useful a over the house, car and work.
Sorry, I meant I have the C System Maxxed Out. It has been used, but only 3 weeks worth of league bowling. It's working great for me so far, and I want to make sure I maintain it properly.
Glad I checked in here, thanks for the help!
OK, Maxxed Out is completely different. Stock surface is 4000 grit which is pretty sensitive to use, in that it changes quite quickly. Get hold of a Siaair or Abralon 4000 grit pad. Every 9 - 12 games, dampen the pad and go over the surface by hand to restore it. I believe it's one of those 500 grit/4000 grit surfaces. After about 25 - 40 games, depending on how it looks or reacts, you probably need to resurface the whole ball. Unless you have access to a spinner, you should probably have the pro shop do this.
-
Also, on the bright side, a lot of Brunswick shells react very well to oil removal and light resurfacing. First ball I ever used hot water method for oil removal was an old Red Fuze. I thought it was dead, but after hot water treatment I won a couple of tourneys with it and shot a couple of 300 games. I just had Nexxus resurfaced and oil extraction with great results. Closest to box condition I have ever seen with a rejuvenated shell.
-
I'm not trying to start an argument or anything, but I'm not a big believer of cleaning equipment immediately after use. It certainly won't hurt, but I'm not sure how much you'll gain.
You throw your ball down the lane over and over 2.5 hours, only removing the oil with a towel, micro fiber or not. Somehow, the ball must be deep cleaned immediately - it can't be done after a 20 minute ride home? I get to not wait until a week later, but I'm not sure there is a huge benefit in doing it right after the last shot is made. Modern balls need lots of maintenance, but they don't need to be treated like new born children.
-
Like Nails I am not trying to start anything, but I only use Rubbing Alcohol to clean my stuff, and I have no problems with ball death or loss of reaction even with equipment that sees a lot of games.
Imo treating the ball like fine china will not gain you much if anything.
I'm not trying to start an argument or anything, but I'm not a big believer of cleaning equipment immediately after use. It certainly won't hurt, but I'm not sure how much you'll gain.
You throw your ball down the lane over and over 2.5 hours, only removing the oil with a towel, micro fiber or not. Somehow, the ball must be deep cleaned immediately - it can't be done after a 20 minute ride home? I get to not wait until a week later, but I'm not sure there is a huge benefit in doing it right after the last shot is made. Modern balls need lots of maintenance, but they don't need to be treated like new born children.
-
I think the issue comes from people who don't take their stuff home (leave in a locker) or just toss the equipment to the side or in the garage when they get home. Or even leave it in their car.
You are right, the 20 minute difference may not make a difference, but you also already have the ball out of the bag when you are done bowling. No better time to clean it.
-
I'm not trying to start an argument or anything, but I'm not a big believer of cleaning equipment immediately after use. It certainly won't hurt, but I'm not sure how much you'll gain.
You throw your ball down the lane over and over 2.5 hours, only removing the oil with a towel, micro fiber or not. Somehow, the ball must be deep cleaned immediately - it can't be done after a 20 minute ride home? I get to not wait until a week later, but I'm not sure there is a huge benefit in doing it right after the last shot is made. Modern balls need lots of maintenance, but they don't need to be treated like new born children.
I'm Steven, and I do like mixing the pot. :)
Seriously, Nails brings up a valid point. I'm not sure I can argue that maintenance before the balls go back into the bag is an absolute make-or-break necessity.
But no matter how you slice it and dice it, the sooner the better. After I take my last shot of the night, there will usually will be fresh oil rings still sitting on the surface. If I hit the track immediately after bowling with a strong cleaner (not Rubbing Alcohol :o ), I catch the oil before it soaks into the cover. Hopefully I've been minimizing absorption by wiping with a micro-fiber towel between shots. Sure, some has already soaked in, but I'm getting my best chance of catching anything still on top or right below the surface.
At a practical level, I'm not in the mood to pull my equipment out once I get home. It's usually between 11-1130pm, and cleaning equipment is the last thing I want to do. If I wait, I'll find a reason not to get it done.
-
Thanks for the advice all! Glad I'm asking this early on in the ball's use. Here's my to do list I've been making:
1) Go to store and buy micro fiber towels
2) Purchase a good cleaner and clean right after (or soon after!) bowling. Looking at the clean n dull here: http://www.bowling.com/products/powerhouse-clean-n--dull-quart.htm
3) Purchase pads to use every 9 - 12 games. Looking at these: http://www.bowling.com/products/abralon-sanding-pad-4000-grit.htm
4) Visit pro shop about further resurfacing when necessary (usually 25 - 40ish games).
5) Kick some @ss on my bowling league!!!
Let me know if I'm missing anything. Thanks agains!!
-
xiek376,
Sounds like a good plan to me.
-
I'm not trying to start an argument or anything, but I'm not a big believer of cleaning equipment immediately after use. It certainly won't hurt, but I'm not sure how much you'll gain.
You throw your ball down the lane over and over 2.5 hours, only removing the oil with a towel, micro fiber or not. Somehow, the ball must be deep cleaned immediately - it can't be done after a 20 minute ride home? I get to not wait until a week later, but I'm not sure there is a huge benefit in doing it right after the last shot is made. Modern balls need lots of maintenance, but they don't need to be treated like new born children.
I'm not trying to convince you, (I am trying to help the original poster) but, I guess I am, in a way.
These new coverstocks absorb oil very, VERY rapidly. If you, like many people, give the ball a quick wipe when you pick it up to bowl the next frame, you are removing oil laying on the surface about to be absorbed. Cleaning the ball after league is over takes maybe 30 seconds. Odds are if you don't do it then, the oil will be absorbed. It's not a lot, at that point in time, but over the course of months or so, the amount does increase. Since you didn't do it then, you're not likely to do it later or after the next league session. Let's be honest. Been there, done that. (Or rather didn't do that.)
This habit has showed positive results recently when testing a friend's new invention, an oil extracting oven. It took me 10 balls of ones that I had used a lot over the past 2 - 3 years, before I found one that gave up its oil. It was a much older ball, 5 - 7 years old. The others, even though they all had 80 -150+ games on them each, gave up no oil and I was wondering about my friend's invention. I need not have worried; it worked fine. I just prevented my bowling balls from absorbing oil by my cleaning regimen.
All balls lose reaction through BOTH oil absorption and changes in the surface finish via use. How much we see and recognize may be reflected in the amount we use these balls regularly. Seeing tiny changes over time is or can be very hard to recognize. Only by comparing to a newly extracted AND resurfaced ball or to a new one, can we really see the changes in a ball's reaction.
I can only suggest it is beneficial to do something similar to regular cleaning to insure we need to buy a few of these expensive items as possible over the course of time. What you choose to do is up to you.
-
This habit has showed positive results recently when testing a friend's new invention, an oil extracting oven. It took me 10 balls of ones that I had used a lot over the past 2 - 3 years, before I found one that gave up its oil. It was a much older ball, 5 - 7 years old. The others, even though they all had 80 -150+ games on them each, gave up no oil and I was wondering about my friend's invention. I need not have worried; it worked fine. I just prevented my bowling balls from absorbing oil by my cleaning regimen.
A big +1. I follow the same regime and had the same experience when initially using your friends invention -- NuBall. It's amazing how much you can do to prevent oil absorption if you stay on top of it.
-
Thanks for the advice all! Glad I'm asking this early on in the ball's use. Here's my to do list I've been making:
1) Go to store and buy micro fiber towels
2) Purchase a good cleaner and clean right after (or soon after!) bowling. Looking at the clean n dull here: http://www.bowling.com/products/powerhouse-clean-n--dull-quart.htm
3) Purchase pads to use every 9 - 12 games. Looking at these: http://www.bowling.com/products/abralon-sanding-pad-4000-grit.htm
4) Visit pro shop about further resurfacing when necessary (usually 25 - 40ish games).
5) Kick some @ss on my bowling league!!!
Let me know if I'm missing anything. Thanks agains!!
Back in the day, there was a great band called Public Enemy. One of their biggest songs was titled "Don't Believe the Hype!" Good advice, especially when it comes to cleaning your bowling ball. There are a couple of users on here who seemingly own stock in bowling ball cleaner companies.
As Nails and Mainzer have said, simple cleaners work just fine. Many people, me included, make our own cleaner using 33% H20, 33% Simple Green, 33% Isoproyl Alcohol (preferrably 90% or stronger). Look up what components make up a good all-purpose cleaner and you'll see why that formula works.
Oil removal? Use a microfiber towel before every shot. Use the above cleaner before bagging the balls after bowling. When you can moisten your thumb, rub it on the ball and not get a good "squeak" and friction between skin and ball, time to de-oil. If you see your ball doesn't react as it did new, time to de-oil. Do the thumb test and you will be alerted that its time to de-oil long before you see less reaction. Safe and easy way to de-oil? Go to the pro shop and have your ball put in the Rejuvenator. Safe and easy way to de-oil and save money? Put ball in dishwasher, no soap, no heated dry, no sanitize. Run one normal cycle (90 minutes). Like new. Wife won't let you do that (she should, won't hurt dishwasher at all), put ball in bucket of hot water with some Dawn dish soap and let soak. Wipe oil off surface of ball, repeat until you don't see an oil sheen on top of water and ball feels clean.
Resurfacing or maintaining factory surface? You can carry some Abralon pads around but that is just a superficial fix. Factories build up to OOB surface in steps. This is best left, ideally, to a pro shop with a Haus machine to simulate how the factory finishes a ball with various grit pads. At the very least, this should be down by somebody who knows their way around a ball spinner.
Unlike some of the advice that you have gotten that is just re-gurgitated from bowling magazine articles and print from advertisements, the methods above are real world tested, real world approved, and real world effective. Choice is and always will be yours.
-
Unlike some of the advice that you have gotten that is just re-gurgitated from bowling magazine articles and print from advertisements, the methods above are real world tested, real world approved, and real world effective. Choice is and always will be yours.
Maybe you'd like to point out specifically anything "regurgitated" that hasn't been extensively practiced by the people who put forth the advice. I can't wait to hear....
BTW, a proshop Rejuvinator session followed by a resurfacing for a single ball will set you back $25-$30, minimum. If you're serious and bowl league and tournaments using a 6-ball arsenal, do the math. You're going to be transferring measurable wealth to your proshop in very short order.
I know you don't do any serious surface adjustments yourself. Which is odd, because you feel surface is at least 80% of reaction. You should want to have total control of your surfaces. To make minor or major adjustments on your own terms.
Fear not. You can be that "somebody who knows their way around a ball spinner". Learning how to maintain your own equipment isn't brain surgery. Personal ball spinners don't bite. The abrasives, compounds, cleaners, and polishes needed are not overwhelming. If you don't have access to someone who can teach you, just ask here. There are several of us who would be more than happy to help you out.
Choice is and always will be yours.
-
If you don't have access to someone who can teach you, just ask here. There are several of us who would be more than happy to help you out.
+100 for this comment for me...im more or less a total newb...just started bowling 4 years ago and just recently started getting into proper cleaning methods and such and this site has been nothing but patient and helping with any and all questions i have had no matter how small or stupid
so glad i found this site
-
Maybe you'd like to point out specifically anything "regurgitated" that hasn't been extensively practiced by the people who put forth the advice. I can't wait to hear....
No, that's your typical trite and boring modus operandi. I'll stand by what I said and about who I said it. Glad to see that you know yourself well enough to recognize when your'e being described.
BTW, a proshop Rejuvinator session followed by a resurfacing for a single ball will set you back $25-$30, minimum. If you're serious and bowl league and tournaments using a 6-ball arsenal, do the math. You're going to be transferring measurable wealth to your proshop in very short order.
Do tell. Perhaps that's why I mentioned a free alternative that can be done at one's house and is just as effective
I know you don't do any serious surface adjustments yourself. Which is odd, because you feel surface is at least 80% of reaction. You should want to have total control of your surfaces. To make minor or major adjustments on your own terms.
You have no idea how I feel about anything. The point I made about maintaining a balls surface being best done with the proper grits and a Haus machine is absolutely correct. Ball spinner? Just like your Easy Bake Oven for Bowling Balls is a poor substitute for factory equipment, a ball spinner enters too many variables to be accurate and repeatable due to variances in pressure applied to pads by different human operators. Its laughable for anybody to even suggest that you can get the Rz and Ra patterns and levels correct using a manual method. Surprised a bowling "scientist" such as yourself would even suggest it.
Fear not. You can be that "somebody who knows their way around a ball spinner". Learning how to maintain your own equipment isn't brain surgery. Personal ball spinners don't bite. The abrasives, compounds, cleaners, and polishes needed are not overwhelming. If you don't have access to someone who can teach you, just ask here. There are several of us who would be more than happy to help you out.
Learn ball spinning technique from reading a post on an internet forum? Uh, sure.
So, in summation, OP, there are very cheap and effective home-made cleaners you can use. There are very cheap and effective techniques you can do to keep your ball free of oil. If you really want to maintain your ball at factory surface condition, that is where you should spend your money at the pro shop that has a Haus machine.
-
Thanks again to everyone. Regardless of the differing opinions in this thread, what I was instructed to do before definitely wasn't cutting it, so I'm moving in the right direction. I'm only bowling in one league currently, but that will probably change to more in the future and hopefully some tournaments as well. I'm also looking to take some lessons soon to see what I need to work on to hopefully elevate my game. Based on the anticipated increase in bowling frequency, I wanted to make sure I had maintenance down and this thread has helped.
-
Long gone has a great points.
the Haus Machine is much more accurate than any person could be, especially someone who is just learning how to use a spinner.
Simple Household products work fine to clean your gear I have been doing it for years with no issues.
Alot of the cleaners list Rubbing Alcohol as a main Ingredient.
Keep your surfaces fresh and you shouldn't have any problems.
-
Ok LGD. You made a claim of regurgitation, but refuse to back it up with anything specific. So be it. Unfortunately, Nothing more was expected.
For anyone with an open mind, spinners are perfectly safe, and once you get the hang of operation, you get a good feel for the grits, time, and the amount of pressure to achieve your objective. They work for 90% of the proshops that use them as their primary resurface tool. At a personal level, I shot a 756 last night with a ball I've resurfaced several times. Amazing. No flat spots, and the ball has remarkably remained round. Who knew??
Again, anyone with an open mind who wants to learn the advantages of maintaining your own surfaces, just ask. There are many qualified folks here willing to help out.
-
Whatever. A thousand people could post what Mainzer just did and you would still want to argue. You go ahead and keep posting until your fingers bleed. Doesn't change the fact that you're in the minority.
-
A haus machine would be great and convenient but not always cost effective for an individual or a proshop.
Will a home spinner get you the desired results you want? Yes very much so. It is not complicated by any means and likely Gizmo has or will post a video demo with the other things he is doing. For serious bowlers it is a great $200-250 investment along with the other ideas LGD as mentioned.
I will be trying LGD 3in1 cleaner here likely next week. If you have ever purchased something very "bowling specific" only to realize it looks and smells just like windex you may see how many of these items are just over priced relabeled materials from the every day world.
Same for many of the tools used in the proshop. You do not have to buy the hype to have it.
-
Whatever. A thousand people could post what Mainzer just did and you would still want to argue. You go ahead and keep posting until your fingers bleed. Doesn't change the fact that you're in the minority.
Argue what? I have no issue with Haas machines or the Storm surface factories you see in more proshops. But as Kid correctly mentioned, those pieces of equipment aren't cheap, and they're not cost effective if you're doing continuous minor refreshes across multiple balls. Ball surfaces breakdown quickly. I'm refreshing 1000, 2000, and 4000 grit surfaces across several balls on a weekly basis. It's not going to work for me to camp out in the proshop.
Again, once you get some experience on a spinner, it's not that hard to achieve consistent results. I've tested my results on the Jayhawk Surface Scanner, and I'm measuring fairly consistent numbers. The spinner is accurate enough.
I'm not going to get started with you on cleaning. Your mixture is not as effective as the 2 or 3 top flight bowling cleaners. Period. If its good enough for you, then great. But since you've never done comparative testing, you're not in a position to make a pronouncement.
All that really matters is what you want to believe. Be content.
-
I'm sure more users besides me would love to see all the documentation that your own comparisons of cleaners produced. I would imagine you have reams and reams of useful information. Please post is ASAP. Inquiring minds are eager to know.
So typical. So quick to dismiss somebody's opinion because there is no documentation of results, yet you offer none. You really should read to yourself what you type at least three times and then delete it. Would save everybody a lot of eyestrain. :o
Read that, kidlost? Don't post your results of trying out my recipe for a cleaner unless you can back it up with a signed affadavit from Underwriters Laboratories. ::)
-
Noted
-
Be prepared to share the recipe, Kid. Everybody in my leagues who have asked about it and tried it use it to this day. They realized the folly of spending ten bucks for a bottle of water, citric acid or some other detergent, and a surfactant when they can mix their own for pennies and have it do the job better.
-
I'm also guilty of using windex (My driller also recommended it once.).
I'm also a fan of the dishwasher (no soap, sanitation or heated dry.). I intend to cycle a ball tomorrow - while my wife's not home.
A haus machine would be great and convenient but not always cost effective for an individual or a proshop.
Will a home spinner get you the desired results you want? Yes very much so. It is not complicated by any means and likely Gizmo has or will post a video demo with the other things he is doing. For serious bowlers it is a great $200-250 investment along with the other ideas LGD as mentioned.
I will be trying LGD 3in1 cleaner here likely next week. If you have ever purchased something very "bowling specific" only to realize it looks and smells just like windex you may see how many of these items are just over priced relabeled materials from the every day world.
Same for many of the tools used in the proshop. You do not have to buy the hype to have it.
-
I'm also guilty of using windex (My driller also recommended it once.).
I'm also a fan of the dishwasher (no soap, sanitation or heated dry.). I intend to cycle a ball tomorrow - while my wife's not home.
A haus machine would be great and convenient but not always cost effective for an individual or a proshop.
Will a home spinner get you the desired results you want? Yes very much so. It is not complicated by any means and likely Gizmo has or will post a video demo with the other things he is doing. For serious bowlers it is a great $200-250 investment along with the other ideas LGD as mentioned.
I will be trying LGD 3in1 cleaner here likely next week. If you have ever purchased something very "bowling specific" only to realize it looks and smells just like windex you may see how many of these items are just over priced relabeled materials from the every day world.
Same for many of the tools used in the proshop. You do not have to buy the hype to have it.
Watch out, Spider! Captain Planet will come on waving his green flag again. Funny, in other forums he has frothed at the mouth railing against the EPA, here he acts like one of their spokesmen. Very odd.
-
I used different mixtures of F409/Simple Green with alcohol and water for years. I have a complete understanding of what they do and don't accomplish. Now, unlike you, I extended myself to see if there was anything more effective. And guess what. There are!!
The combination of Hook-It with a dab of Liquid Sandpaper (unpolished surfaces) completely cleans the cover and completely removes track marks and anything else the ball picks on the lanes. Everything. That's why it's approved for use only before and after competition.
Guess what?? Your's doesn't remove everything as completely because its not as strong. That's why it's approved for use at any time.
Hope this helped.
-
Laughable as usual. Because you didn't use the right strength alcohol or didn't use the proper proportions and didn't get results, all the people who did mix the solution correctly and got outstanding results and quit paying thru the nose for Hook-it and Liquid Sandpaper are wrong? Hardly. The cleaner I use will remove all ball marks and other dirt and oil and leave no residue on the ball. Somehow I'm not surprised that you screwed it up.
-
I just finished a cycle with a ball in the washer. Came out intact. In an earlier thread, I reported a tape issue. But I believe that one piece was already beginning to peel. All tape was fine this time.
-
Doesn't count. Not validated by Underwriters Labs. But then again, I really doubt the term "dab" passes for a quantity of a substance in most reputable laboratories.
-
alot of people really are over thinking how they clean their balls! lol
-
alot of people really are over thinking how they clean their balls! lol
Ain't that the truth.
-
Maybe I'm in the minority, but when I have a ball that's reacting really good, I don't clean it.
Some of you guys treat bowling balls like a damn car with these obsessive cleaning routines. Lets be honest, a "dirty ball" is not the reason why you aren't striking.