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Author Topic: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?  (Read 7151 times)

Xyun

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Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« on: September 28, 2004, 12:10:39 AM »
Since the early days of bowling, we have been told to push the ball out on the 1st step (for 4 steppers, 2nd step for 5 steppers) so that when we commence the slide, the ball would ride the roller coaster down in tandem with the slide.

But it seems that more and more coaches nowadays seem to advocate the "late" timing (pushaway on 2nd step for 4 steppers, 3rd step for 5 steppers) which is in conjunction with those seen in power players.

My question is how right/wrong is this?

 

scotts33

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2004, 08:29:17 AM »
Whatever works for you is right.  IMO...there is no "right or correct" way.  

Mechanical players it's a 1-1 timing issue.  Righthanded push ball out with first step of right foot.  Most would term this perfect timing.

Feel players probably later timing so they can "feel" the slide and pull the ball thru creating more revs as thumb exits earlier and fingers exit later.  Put me in this group.

Scott
Scott

JPRLane1

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2004, 08:52:47 AM »
My timing is late by accident, because I either push away too late. Sometimes I start my push away shortly after my second step with a 5-step approach or my push away goes up I have a hard time going straight out with it.  Whenever I am late though I have no balance and can get no leverage at the line.  For me to make good shots I can't be late.
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jimensminger

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2004, 08:58:12 AM »
Most players that I know who use "late timing", do it to create more leverage from the swing and release. You'll also notice that most who do this don't have a long smooth slide,..but almost a planted last step. How right or wrong..?
There's nothing wrong with this,..some todays contemporary professionals can change their leverage depending on the conditions and what they want to do to with the ball.
Strokers and some tweeners still use your described approach, But most of the big handers have late timing to create a delay to position the ball for the power release, and leverage.
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scotts33

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2004, 09:11:04 AM »
quote:
Most players that I know who use "late timing", do it to create more leverage from the swing and release. You'll also notice that most who do this don't have a long smooth slide,..but almost a planted last step.


Actually Jim...I still have a longish slide but also have later timing to create as you say earlier thumb release and later finger exit.  I don't think you have to plant to have later timing.

Scott
Scott

jimensminger

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2004, 09:57:57 AM »
Scott,...like I said, "most". I bowl with and watch DJ Archer and Chris Johnson all the time. Both throw powerful strike balls,..DJs a slider, and CJ is a planter...You're right, you don't have to plant, or have delayed timing,..it's much more difficult to slide and do it in my opinion,..hence more that I see like the plant or mini-slide release. Holman created super leverage with the long slide,..where as Roth was a planter...
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LuckyLefty

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2004, 11:17:08 AM »
Interesting about the open hand.

No doubt the condition almost always hooks on tour today the problem is finding the pocket!

In league the problem is not so much finding the pocket as it is carrying.

No wonder league stars struggle so much so often when they try to transition to the tour.  Different balls work, different drillings, accuracy vs area bowling,
Big backends vs carrydown backends.

It must be fun for the pro tourists to embarass the league stars!

That's why they love to post those league average vs tour average blurbs on TV.
Ummmmmm,mmmmmmm!

REgards,

Luckylefty

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James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

pin-chaser

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2004, 11:24:44 AM »
I contend that in the 50's/60's releasing the ball while still in slide was certianly the norm and accuracy was at its premium. (ie. marshall holman did it in the 70's/80's). As we move up to the 70's/80's we see the like of the first power players that release the ball just as the foot stops its slide (Roth/Handley). In the 90's/present we see even more powerfull players that completely stop the slide (plant) with the like of Robert Smith. Yes late timing in most popular today at the sacrifice of accuracy. But then with todays oiling patterns (that guide errant shots to the pocket) and todays bowling balls (that do not require consistancy or release) and pins that topple and fly, accuracy is not at a premium. The more revs and faster ball speeds that can be generated provides more mistake area and artificially increases our averages on a THS.  

One MAJOR expection is Pete Weber that seems to have found a comprise of being able to produce a powefull rev rate while maintaining a timing that is not late ( in that the slide has completed as the ball passes the ankle). Funny that he has been a top star throught the 80's, 90's and today.


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scotts33

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2004, 11:24:53 AM »
quote:
Again, as in so many other aspects of bowling, this comes under the heading---One size does not fit all.


Or my favorite....."your mileage may vary"

Scott
Scott

Magic Carpet

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2004, 11:36:12 AM »
Good topic!
I think I will use this as a basis for my next article.
As a coach, I time the player the way it best fits his game and his physical make up.
You can get some idea of how I do it by reading the article called “Next to Last Step Timing” here is a link. http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/tip13a.htm

The most successful timing routine takes into account the arm to leg length ratio ( not everyone is the same), the rev rate, footwork, type of swing and how steep the backswing is.
. The classic timing of move the ball at the same time as you move your foot in a four step approach is just a general guideline. It’s a good way to get a new bowler started and works really well for a lot of bowlers. Most “by the book” coaches work off of this plan. More advanced coaches know how to adjust timing to best suit the player. If four foot tall Norm Duke who hangs his heels off the back of the approach used “classic” timing he would lay the ball down somewhere around the second row of dots.  

In general terms is it not a good idea for anyone to have early timing or even be “on time”. Everyone should be just a little late compared to the way they used to time bowlers back in the 1970s.
Ron Clifton

Hammer3003

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2004, 12:11:56 PM »
I have just transformed my thinking from you need at least four steps for a good backswing but now I say three if you can be consistant.
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oracle3410

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2004, 11:06:45 PM »
i have a plant last step, but i'm not a power player.

there's one player in my league that has such a plant and crank last step, that you can hear his shoe squeak as he cranks the ball to the line.  it's almost painful to watch.  it makes *my* ACL hurt..

TheBowlingKid25

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2004, 11:12:17 PM »
I have late timing, and its due to the fact that I push away on the 2nd step, and plant my last step instead of slide, where as if I slid my timing would be a little bit more it. Im still working on trying to slide more. I am kind of a power player, not a cranker or anything though.
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nd300

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Re: Is late timing the new "IN" thing?
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2004, 11:14:41 PM »
I've used the MENTAL image----not the actual physical act----of stopping the slide then releasing the ball to create good timing---which for me is a little late,but not a lot compared to some of the threads of people replying to the original post.
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