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Author Topic: Can PAP change??  (Read 1037 times)

BowlingDude300

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Can PAP change??
« on: April 06, 2004, 05:40:21 AM »
I am a stroker. I have a stright wrist in the backswing. If I were to throw more of a cranker shot, and cup my wrist, would my PAP change?? Also, my PAP says that I am more or less a spinner, well my track is very low and thats what i hear. But, I am by no means a spinner. Does anyone know why it shows up like that?? could it be how the ball is drilled?? LMK. All help is greatly appreciated. Kyle
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Thanks!!! Kyle



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BowlingDude300

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2004, 08:51:24 PM »
can anyone answer my second question??? Thanks. Kyle
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Thanks!!! Kyle



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BowlingWolf

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2004, 09:42:13 PM »
Kyle,
In response to your second question (why you may have a low track):
Often times when a bowler spins the ball it is because even though he/she may have a perfectly straight arm throughout the swing and with a nice firm wrist behind the ball, however, at the release point and follow-thru the elbow just goes slightly outside of the body, causing the hand to rotate slightly too early and a bit too much around the ball.  
Not ever having watched you bowl, naturally, I can't say for sure that this is what you do.  I wouldn't worry too much about your ball's track; as long as your concentrate on accuracy (with smart lane-reading), and staying smooth throughout your approach and delivery, you'll be consistent.
I used to spin the ball, now I have a very high track, and I've been able to accomplish this by staying slow with my feet, getting down at the foul line, riveting my eyes on my "spot", and following thru like a maniac, but at the same time staying down with the shot, and watching my ball cross its intended path before allowing my body to get up.  In the beginning my body had a hard time accepting this technique, but it soon became natural, and my game forever improved.  Mechanics, mechanics, mechanics, and lane smarts!
One more thing: relax your arm.
Regards,
BowlingWolf
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BowlingDude300

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2004, 09:45:27 PM »

Thanks bowling wolf, turning it over too soon does sound like a possibility. But, I have been consistent as of late. I am not worried about it, just wanting to know why. You may be right. Someday I will put a tape on here and see what people think. Thanks again. Kyle
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Thanks!!! Kyle



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MI 2 AZ

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2004, 01:44:44 AM »
I have a low track and have been called a spinner.  I have noticed on different balls that my track could be anywhere from 1 inch away from the fingerholes to as much as 5 inches.  It seems like the more aggressive balls have the lower tracks.  Some balls just seem to track higher for me while others will be much lower than normal and that might be due to the layout or the ball's characteristics (cover/weightblock/flipblock/core).

Without bending my elbow, I can start out with my palm up at about 1 o'clock and thumb at about 2 o'clock and rotate my wrist ccw so that the palm will end up about 3 o'clock and the thumb at 4 o'clock.  So it is possible for me to spin the ball more than lifting it (usually when I try to put more 'on' the ball) and you might be doing something similar to end up with the lower track or it could just be the drilling layout and cover/weightblock combination contributing to it.

Do all of your balls track the same?
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Jeffrevs

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2004, 08:36:38 AM »
quote:
Kyle,
In response to your second question (why you may have a low track):
Often times when a bowler spins the ball it is because even though he/she may have a perfectly straight arm throughout the swing and with a nice firm wrist behind the ball, however, at the release point and follow-thru the elbow just goes slightly outside of the body, causing the hand to rotate slightly too early and a bit too much around the ball.  


I doubt that the armswing has anything to do with it....your track is caused by how you release the ball.   And,....what is described above would cause a HIGH track!  Because (not the swing) that's how I 'used' to release the ball, and I had a very very HIGH track........

and yes, pap can AND will change with different releases,..etc.....
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JEFF
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Edited on 4/7/2004 8:30 AM
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Ishmael

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2004, 09:19:45 AM »
quote:
I have noticed on different balls that my track could be anywhere from 1 inch away from the fingerholes to as much as 5 inches. It seems like the more aggressive balls have the lower tracks. Some balls just seem to track higher for me while others will be much lower than normal and that might be due to the layout or the ball's characteristics (cover/weightblock/flipblock/core).


You PAP should be measured with the lowest flaring ball that you have.  The best method is to use 3 piece which has negligible flare potential.  The reason is that high flare cores and layouts actually start to flare as soon as the ball comes off your hand.  Even before it hits the lane.  This is why your track will appear lower with a high flare ball.
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pin-chaser

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2004, 01:59:02 PM »
Developing many consistant releases in actuality causes changes to your pap. That is the benifit of having multipul releases. I agree with jefferys that armswing has nothing to do with it. It is possible that layout can effect tracks, some layout can cause more higher tracking and others can cause more lower tracking all with the same release and the difference can be as much as an inch or two.  However, layout can not cause a high track player to instantly become a low track player, that variance is simply to great. It is in your release. Make video and watch and compare to others.
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BowlingWolf

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2004, 02:14:20 PM »
quote:
I doubt that the armswing has anything to do with it....your track is caused by how you release the ball. And,....what is described above would cause a HIGH track! Because (not the swing) that's how I 'used' to release the ball, and I had a very very HIGH track........


Jeff:
I was referring to a chicken-wing type of armswing, and I can personally tell you that it will not raise your track but lower it instead.  For you to come off as if your word is gospel, before really considering what I said, is beyond comprehension, and indicates a definite lack of consideration for someone else's observances.
Incidentally, Brian Voss, one of the best bowlers of all time, manages to do what i just described (elbow out or chicken-winging) and he has a track about 2" away from his thumb, and about 2.1/2" away from his fingers (his initial, or first ring around the ball, tracking).

Regards,
BowlingWolf
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Jeffrevs

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2004, 02:52:55 PM »
hey guys, thanks...

I was referring moreso to the coming around the side too soon comment lowering your track, and that was only in reference to me, because I used to do that and I had a SUPER high track....
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JEFF
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CoachJim

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2004, 04:12:16 PM »
A low track is caused by the thumb releasing at an angle ahead of the fingers. The thumb releasing at 3:00 with the fingers still at 5:00 or 6:00.

A spinner's thumb comes out of the ball past 3:00, with the hand rotating over the top of the ball.

I helped a student of mine raise his track by having him follow his thumb with his fingers instead of chasing the thumb around the ball.
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hskrntx

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Re: Can PAP change??
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2004, 04:26:44 PM »
msg sent - keep asking those questions, that's how you learn!
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