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Author Topic: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***  (Read 32807 times)

BrunsNick

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CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« on: April 18, 2007, 12:10:11 PM »
The CGNOMADDAH video is up and running on www.brunsnick.com

Enjoy.
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Nick Smith ... A.K.A. Les Badderâ„¢
Brunswick -=- PBA 03-07
http://www.BrunsNick.com
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¡Viva la nación de Brunswick!
Nick Smith
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BrunsNick

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #46 on: April 19, 2007, 01:58:34 PM »
Steven,

Tell me how the track flare is different on the two test balls from Brunswick? If they were thrown right after eachother, the amount of oil left on the coverstock will not always be the same. That is the double-edge sword that is called Throwbot.

The track flare separation was IDENTICAL.

The bowtie was IDENTICAL.

With separation being the same, and no variables in the way the balls are thrown, there is no difference in the two. The only thing you cannot control is the oil on the lanes, which is broken down at an accelerated rate with Throwbot.


I'm not quite done with these balls, I think I'll have some more fun with them.
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Nick Smith ... A.K.A. Les Badderâ„¢
Brunswick -=- PBA 03-07
http://www.BrunsNick.com
http://www.BigBapparel.com
¡Viva la nación de Brunswick!
Nick Smith
Digital Media Manager - Brunswick Bowling
http://www.brunswickbowling.com
http://www.youtube.com/c/brunsnick

Joe Jr

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #47 on: April 19, 2007, 02:16:41 PM »
lol too much oil. So now the Cg is going to matter when you have to loft the gutter cap.

Oh and i'm still yet to see a video from you guys that shows the Cg does matter.
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MegaMav

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #48 on: April 19, 2007, 02:37:04 PM »
quote:
lol too much oil. So now the Cg is going to matter when you have to loft the gutter cap.

Oh and i'm still yet to see a video from you guys that shows the Cg does matter.


I'm glad im not the only one to see the holes in that statement.

 
quote:
Using a high-RG polished pearl is probably not the best choice for this kind of test.


Grasping.... Grasping...

What do you think plastic 3 piece balls were up until the 1990's?
High RG (no core) and a polished pearl plastic, very little cover friction.
Statics apparently "mattered" then, with your statement, you devalue your own origins of shifting weight around.
Taking the core and cover out of the equation, it should be all about the statics and their effect right?

Afterall, you're looking for an independent variable to judge if there is a statistically signifincant difference in the 2 cases. So taking as many variables out as possible increases the validity of the test.

Strapper_Squared

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #49 on: April 19, 2007, 02:38:51 PM »
Nick, nice video as always... love the song choice.

I can see them gathering around a table in a smoke-filled room, plotting how they are going to argue this one...  

so before with the Brunswick video, it wasn't any good because the Thro-Bot threw the ball exactly the same.  Now its no good because Nick didn't throw the ball exactly the same?  hmm

Too much oil on the lane to see the differences?  Obviously there was some dry as the ball reacted on the backend...

Well everyone knows that the cover was pearl and the core of high RG.. that's why there were no differences...  so it only matters with low rg and particle covers?  Or is that sanded reactive covers?

Oh.. wait a sec.  Its was the house shot.. and all balls react exactly the same on the house shot...

I have a feeling (request) there will another video on a short oil pattern...

and then a few shots with a sanded surface (although you better ask which which grit surface to use) and you will still see no distinguishable difference between balls.

S^2



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Let It Bleed

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #50 on: April 19, 2007, 02:40:22 PM »
quote:
quote:
quote:
[..] Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!

continue on to your regularly scheduled post...
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"Chicks dig the trip 4" -Randy Pederson


Germany never ever bombed Pearl Habor... that were the Japanese...
... lmao ...

But we did Bomb London if you mean that...


That was from the movie Animal House...
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Back were I belong...with Roto Grip.
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Thanks Joe...I was hoping someone would recognize that before I had to defend myself
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"Chicks dig the trip 4" -Randy Pederson

Steven

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #51 on: April 19, 2007, 03:27:44 PM »
Mav: Always glad to hear from you.

I think we'd agree (at least I hope) that if you flood the lane gutter-to-gutter for 55', it doesn't matter what you throw; the ball is not going to move. Statics won't matter, cover won't matter and drill won't matter because the oil volume will negate anything the ball attempts to do.

Obviously, Nick didn't go to this extreme. But some of this effect was built into his test. High-RG cores with high grit shinny finishes (the Uranium HRG in this case) require a lot of friction, especially in the mid-lane, to expose core/drill characteristics. It was clear from the video that there was too much oil up front for this particular model ball, with any drill, to show it's stuff.

If you go back to the original Brunswick video, some of this effect was exposed. The first 5 shots appeared identical because the oil was heavy and fresh. But apparently Throwbot started to break the line down. That's probably why positive shot #7 went through the nose, and negative shot #8 stayed in the pocket. We were finally able to see the real reaction characteristics shine through.

For Nick's test, it would have been much more convincing if he had selected a lower RG ball with surface. But that's what we appeared to have in the Brunswick video without conclusive evidence, so I'm not sure what the purpose was of any of this.

Regardless, this all seems fairly straight forward. Where are the holes in this logic?

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"Sometimes, the best move is the one we don't make"


Edited on 4/19/2007 3:40 PM

Ragnar

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #52 on: April 19, 2007, 03:29:37 PM »
argument nomaddah, minds made up.
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a_ak57

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #53 on: April 19, 2007, 03:31:11 PM »
Steven, they jumped all over you because you said yourself that on the heavier, fresh pattern you couldn't see a difference because the ball couldn't overcome the pattern.  This in and of itself says that the "CG matters 100% of the time" argument is not true because we have found an exception.  Now, I'm sure you were never implying that, but any victory for them is a victory held high.
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Steven

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #54 on: April 19, 2007, 03:35:19 PM »
Andy: I don't know if anyone has argued that "CG matters 100% of the time". I haven't. As always, you have to use common sense. I think it's always been at least implied that there has to be the right match of cover to surface for any test to be valid.
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a_ak57

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #55 on: April 19, 2007, 03:38:00 PM »
I know that Steven, but I was just explaining to you why Mav and the others were giddy with excitement.  Like I said, any victory is a victory, even if nobody was really fighting for the extreme.
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BrunsNick

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #56 on: April 19, 2007, 03:55:57 PM »
Steven,

I initially chose Solid Uraniums for the test, but after 2 sets of mismarked pins ( www.brunsnick.com/buzz2.jpg ) I had to switch balls. Believe me, it would have been easier to see the track flare and ball roll with a solid ball. It just wasn't in the cards!
--------------------
Nick Smith ... A.K.A. Les Badderâ„¢
Brunswick -=- PBA 03-07
http://www.BrunsNick.com
http://www.BigBapparel.com
¡Viva la nación de Brunswick!
Nick Smith
Digital Media Manager - Brunswick Bowling
http://www.brunswickbowling.com
http://www.youtube.com/c/brunsnick

Keith Frye

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #57 on: April 19, 2007, 04:03:31 PM »
quote:
I initially chose Solid Uraniums for the test, but after 2 sets of mismarked pins ( www.brunsnick.com/buzz2.jpg ) I had to switch balls.  


How does that happen?

BrunsNick

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #58 on: April 19, 2007, 04:25:50 PM »
Not entirely sure, but it may have been a batch of balls where the pins were "moved" by an assembly worker, in order to create a "longer pin". Little did they know the results of their actions.

Now you know another reason why Brunswick is not making balls in Muskegon anymore.
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Nick Smith ... A.K.A. Les Badderâ„¢
Brunswick -=- PBA 03-07
http://www.BrunsNick.com
http://www.BigBapparel.com
¡Viva la nación de Brunswick!
Nick Smith
Digital Media Manager - Brunswick Bowling
http://www.brunswickbowling.com
http://www.youtube.com/c/brunsnick

Grayson

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #59 on: April 19, 2007, 04:31:47 PM »
quote:
Nicholas

Quit being rational. As I told you yesterday, you give them answers and they change the questions and then the answers as well.

This is a pointless discussion, with no winners or losers. Each of you have your beliefs and use them how you may with whatever results you see.

Eric Stratton

Rush President, Damn glad to meet you.
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ok for me it is very interesting!
 Cause I really don't want to believe... I want to know.
.. So you people say Cg doesn't matter as long as no X-hole is drilled. but with an X-hole one can change ball reaction compared to a ball with same Pinposition which also is shown in this Vid:
http://www.brunsnick.com/bowling_ball_x_hole_video.html
(thanks Nick!)

So far so good. (still don't like the Vid with the HRGs....)

quote:
Steven,

I initially chose Solid Uraniums for the test, but after 2 sets of mismarked pins ( www.brunsnick.com/buzz2.jpg ) I had to switch balls. Believe me, it would have been easier to see the track flare and ball roll with a solid ball. It just wasn't in the cards!
--------------------
Nick Smith ... A.K.A. Les Badderâ„¢
Brunswick -=- PBA 03-07
http://www.BrunsNick.com
http://www.BigBapparel.com
¡Viva la nación de Brunswick!



Mismarked Pins? mhh... Solid Us?.... this is BAD!
Isn't the Pin holding the core during the pouring process... so how can it be missmarked? Or am I getting something wrong?
Whatever...

Let me sumup my understanding so far as I understand it:

CG DOES MATTER cause with the USBC rules you want to make it legal and drilling an X-Hole will change the reaction.

So a comparison of two balls...
 a label drilled with 0 static weights and
  a cg-out drilled also with 0 static weights
would be the thing I am really interested in.

It's half past 11pm now... good night and good fight
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and by the way... I am a "Fritz" a "Jerry"... I am from Germany! (And please don't call me Kraut! Cause then I call you Dumbarse)

strikealot

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Re: CG NOMADDAH ***VIDEO***
« Reply #60 on: April 19, 2007, 05:06:13 PM »
thanks there Jim Rome.......im out...
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Edited on 4/19/2007 5:07 PM
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