Post by: Juggernaut on June 04, 2008, 07:06:53 AM
Last week, played on the cheetah. Supposed to be a "high risk/high reward" type of shot, usually having breakpoint out close to the gutter. I tried to play it that way with little or no results. The high average for the night was standing 18, throwing up 12 with a lot of speed, shooting a 630.
Last night, we has the scorpion. Supposed to be a shot played in around the tenth board without a lot of swing, holding the ball in the pocket with speed control. I tried this with again little or no success. The high average for the night was standing 12, whistling rockets up the 5 board, shooting a 659 while the only shot I could find was to move left with my feet on 38 playing the fourth arrow. Didn't even try that until 1/2 the last game was over because NOBODY has ever said that was the way to play this shot.
Now, two weeks in, shots not reacting like ANYONE ( that knows ) says they should, and I am averaging a whopping 160 something trying to play them like the professionals say they should be played, and watching a couple of guys throw whistling rockets down the lane the first two weeks and being the only ones to score anything.
I am really beginning to wonder if the shots are being put out correctly or not, and not just because my scores are low, but because the ones having any success are NOT playing the shots the way the professionals shooting the videos say the shots should be played. And, if the shots aren't correct, what was the purpose of a PBA experience league if its not really the PBA shots?
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Post by: shelley on June 04, 2008, 03:12:25 PM
What kind of oil, what kind of lane machine, what kind of lane bed, what and what condition is the lane surface in? All those affect how the patterns play. On real slick, new, synthetic surfaces, the Shark pattern may start out deep and end up deeper, while on broken-in wood with lots of friction, it may play more towards the track area.
Post by: Brian Green on June 04, 2008, 03:12:39 PM
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Post by: Dan Belcher on June 04, 2008, 03:27:30 PM
quote:http://www.bowl.com/sportbowling/pbaLaneConditions.aspx
curious, where do i find the videos on bowl.com? i don't particularly have any expectation of being able to play the patterns the way they're "supposed" to play, just want a general idea going in.
Post by: Juggernaut on June 04, 2008, 03:42:32 PM
I highly doubt the double stripping. I have watched them run the shots for pre league practice and the machine only makes a single pass down and back and I was watching the led light indicators. The stripper was only running on the way down.
Brian Green,
We are playing on full synthetic lanes, although I don't know the brand.
Usedtolikebowling,
Hadn't really thought much about your second point, but it is one that is well taken. I, too, have finally decided to just move in deep and get the ball just right of the pocket and let it roll up, hoping I can get it to roll enough to carry the corners.
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Post by: THEICEMAN on June 05, 2008, 08:17:10 AM
theiceman
Post by: on June 05, 2008, 12:32:36 PM
Post by: renoatpikeville on June 05, 2008, 12:48:53 PM
You state that you tried to play the lanes where you are "supposed" to but that is the problem. You may have great intentions on making a certian line work but if you are the only person playing there while others are playing their typical house line you could be in trouble.
Getting my drift..?
If everyone in league or at least majority of them played where they are "supposed" to play the pattern then yes you will see the pattern like the pro's on t.v.
Hope this can clarify it a bit.
Post by: backswing_aplenty on June 05, 2008, 01:23:03 PM
Second, this is a good lesson on playing the lanes and not the lane graph. Every type of surface will cause the patterns to play different. The normal wear and tear of the lanes will affect them, the house shot characteristics will affect them, where the majority of bowlers play the lanes during the rest of the leagues will affect them.
The answer to all the PBA Experience league pattern questions is play the lanes as they are that night. The named patterns will not play the same as the videos.
It's very unfortunate that that is the case because the PBAX program is a good one I feel. I just wish they would give more caveats as to how the lanes will play on your home surface and how they will most likely play slightly different. I think just us that will allow some bowlers to have a looser idea of how to play the patterns.
In all kudos to everyone bowling the PBA Experience leagues! The more that bowl, the more leagues there will be, and maybe we can get some more bowlers to search out tougher conditions.
*bakcswing
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Post by: BrianCRX90 on June 05, 2008, 10:53:25 PM
Post by: directdrill on June 05, 2008, 11:03:28 PM
I hear your frustration. Don't give up and keep plugging away. I am bowling a PBA Experience league this summer. Surface is old wood with Guardian overlay to the arrows. Tonight we were on the Cheetah. I threw my Awesome Revs (pin down, 4-1/2 x 5, 2000 Abralon) straight up 5 and hit the 3 pin. Moved inside and played straight up 8, resulting in a light hit on the 1-3 pocket. I also used my Rico drilled Quest at 1000 Abralon straight up the boards. We move to a random pair, but a straight shot up 8-10 was the place for me to play for all 4 games.
I would recommend taking a medium oil ball with some surface (say 1000 Abralon) and trying to determine a line. I bowled in this same league last summer and almost always found a shot playing straight up the boards, at least the first game or so. Let your benchmark ball guide you on the lanes, not the videos. Keep us posted on your progress.
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Post by: charlest on June 06, 2008, 07:34:40 AM
Doncha just love it when they f*ck with your mind and then take your money for the pleasure of doing that TO you? I think you're being screwed over by incompetence, yet again, as so many uncaring proprietors and managers love to do.
I mean, PBA patterns are difficult enough to play as they are defined to be. Oh, and they are designed for good condiiton synthetics. But when you need to try every board betwene the first arrow and the 5th arrow, with every ball you've brought, using every release in your arsenal, by the time you're ready to play THIS UNKNOWN CONDITION/PATTERN, your 3 or 4 game league night is gone.
And all you've got to show for it are more wrinkles and more stress lines.
Been there sick of that. When proprietors prove all they care about is their almighty dollar, I take myself, my balls and my dollars and I go elsewhere. Sometimes, it's a hard lesson sometimes you want to think it's all a mistake somewhere that they will correct if a customer points it out to them, but when the managers tells you "good bowlers adjust" (If I were that good, I'd be making what WRW makes!) and he puts out a shot particular to his style of bowling and he does not have to adjust, you know you've been screwed.
Even PBA players are told what pattern they're facing. And, while not every time it is played the way the book says it is, I'd bet for the most part, on decent synthetic lanes, it is.
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Post by: BigBaller on June 06, 2008, 04:38:49 PM
I bowl at Dave Husteds new house in Vancouver Washington. He says they play close to what you will see on tour, they will never be exact.
So what i do is follow what the recomendation is, if it says start deep i start deep, if i should start out i start out. I want to learn, not average 200 because i crossed over and carried brooklin 2-4 times a game.
Who cares about your ego, leave it at the door when you walk in a learn something for a change.
I am a 210-215 average house hack that has a 192 average in the PBAX league, do you think i care... Not one bit. Because it will help me become a better bowler.
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Obviously you were not listening to your ball...
Post by: T-GOD on June 07, 2008, 12:15:21 AM
Post by: J_L_B on June 07, 2008, 05:17:34 PM
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2003 PBA West Region Rookie of the Year
"You don't score, until you score......"
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Post by: Spider Ball Bowler on June 07, 2008, 05:35:14 PM
The fact of the matter is though, that the shot is going to be tougher than your standard house shot...so go with it
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Post by: Juggernaut on June 07, 2008, 05:56:46 PM
Yeah, I am going to re-think my approach to these shots and, instead of going in with a preconceived notion of what they SHOULD do, just keep my head up, my eyes open, and see what they really do, then play them accordingly.
It has been frustrating to watch the tips, then not even find anything remotely the same. I knew they would be tougher, and in spite of what some may think, I really am a decent bowler, not as good as I was when I bowled all the time, but still decent. That is what was killing me I think, trying to blindly accept what others were saying should happen, and confused by what was actually happening.
Well, heres to hoping I have better luck this week on the viper.......
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"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein
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Post by: River700 on June 07, 2008, 05:57:08 PM
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If your going to bowl...bowl for fun or go home
Edited on 6/7/2008 6:01 PM
Post by: River700 on June 07, 2008, 06:01:08 PM
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If your going to bowl...bowl for fun or go home
Post by: Spider Ball Bowler on June 07, 2008, 06:02:19 PM
I don't think anyone is saying you're a bad bowler, in fact, I doubt anyone on here cares, as most of us are just house hacks with over inlfated averages anyways.
I, for one, am sympathizing with you because the USBC is pushing these PBAX leagues so hard, yet it seems that most of the houses putting the shots out are not doing them correctly anyways.
It just goes to show...bowling is lame. They don't want these easy score shots, but when they try to put out tougher shots, but also want to keep them the same for everyone, they can't. That is lame.
A lot of us at one time or another have preached for standardized tougher lane conditions, and when people buy into the PBAX league, no one can even get that right.....
I guess the only true way to get the PBA conditions right is to go bowl in the PBA, but with the huge prices they charge for their tournaments, who wants to do that?
The PBAX leagues will fail....the end.
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Ahhh Disco Biscuits!