Thanks guys.
I found out what I wanted to know.
I am trying to track down when and where drillers were told to drill reverse pitch into thumb holes. After looking at balls all accross the country it seems that 90 % of drillers start at 1/4 reverse and go more from there.

I don't think I coach a single person that has any reverse pitch in their thumb hole now and most are 1/4 forward or more. Even a guy with a 5 inch span.

Thanks for going into action guys.
If you know of any other bowling "bibles" about drilling printed back in the 50s,60s or so let me know.

Ron Clifton
Bowl great!

The 63 degree rule is the starting point of Bill's method.

63 degrees is measured by straight lines that cut thru the ball.

The line from front of finger holes to the front of thumb hole drawn directly thru the ball from the side intersecting with the front pitch of the thumb hole is approx 63 degrees as a great starting point for all bowlers hands and grip styles, ie conventional fingertip and semi!

In other words a 4 1/4 inch span cut to 0 is about a 63 degree angle.

A conventional 3 3/4 inch span with a thumb cut to 1/4 inch forward is also a 63 degree angle.

A 5 inch span with a 3/8 inch reverse is also a 63 degree angle.

Adjustments are made off of this standard are usually to add 1/8 MORE reverse for people who have trouble getting out of the ball(stiff thumbs, wet thumbs and long thumbs) and subtracting 1/8 inch reverse for people who have trouble staying in the ball(short thumbs, flexible thumbs and dry thumbs).

These are all paraphrases from Bill's book!

However, I recently had a driller have me try the following, basically taking my current thumb at 0 (tables say I should be 3/16 reverse).

Moved me thumbs and me fingers about 1/4 different from where they were(0) on both.  Thumb forward and fingers 0.

Not really having any trouble.  Ball on hard synthetics like your house Magic
Brunswick Anvilane just seemed to have less hard move at the break.

Have only tried it once and never really got the thumb Magiced Up(snugged up), during a quick practice session.  Wouldn't say I had less pop but I did, but I didn't.  Still had lots of pop at release but less harsh reaction!

May be good though with this particular ball surface I was not striking as much.

Interesting as I had seen this theory before but rejected trying it!

REgards,

Lcukylefty

I've tried Bill Taylors method over and over again and I have yet to get it  to work for me even one time. The method that has worked for me from day one and still works for me today as well as other local bowlers I have shown it to is one published on this site by JohnP a pro shop driller. (In Indiana I think it is) Bill Taylor has written a lot of wonderful things and published some great things, but bear in mind, just like his book, that was years and years ago and many of those things don't apply today.

Here is what John published back around the early part of August this year. Try it for yourself and see if it works. It has for a lot of other people.
 

quote:

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I very seldom measure anyone that needs right thumb pitch. Occasionally 0, more frequently 1/8 to 1/4 L. Make a fist in the same manner you would grip the proverbial Coke can. Now try to move your thumb in the R pitch direction (for righties, reverse for lefties). Feel a lot of resistance? Now move it in the L pitch direction. Moves easily, doesn't it. Now put your hand roughly in a bowling grip and try moving the thumb similarly. Same thing? If you miss the lateral pitch on the R side, you can very easily lock the bowler into the ball unless he turns the ball early. I know this, because my grip was that way for over 30 years. When you make the fist, if your thumb falls between the RF and MF, I figure that's 0 pitch. On the MF is 1/8" L, and between the MF and IF is 1/4" L. I very seldom find anyone that needs more than 1/4" L. -- JohnP

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Retired and bowling on Fixed Income