Author Topic: Pin up VS Pin down (Read 21576 times)

Bill Thomas · « **on:** March 17, 2011, 04:14:31 AM »

Can someone give a simple explaination as to what is meant by pin up and pin down and what effect each has on a ball?

storm22 · « **Reply #1 on:** March 17, 2011, 12:30:28 PM »

Pin up = Longer/farther downlane before traction is made

Pin down = Earlier in the ball motion that the ball begins to make its move to the pocket/ earlier grab on the pattern

Balls in the bag and order they come out:
#1/2 Nano and Anarchy #3- Virtual Energy #4- Gravity Shift #5- Big Hit (spare and really dry)
#6- Teal Rhino Pro (oldie but a goodie) Balls in the bag and order they come out:

Dan Belcher · « **Reply #2 on:** March 17, 2011, 01:02:04 PM »

Assuming the pin to PAP distance stays the same, you are actually considering the angle to the VAL more than you're talking about how far up or down the pin is from the fingers or center of grip or any visual thing like that.

Layouts that place the pin higher up visually and closer to the VAL will cause the ball to naturally want to skid more and hook later, and the ball's response to friction will be faster with a more angular breakpoint shape.

Layouts that place the pin lower visually and further away from the VAL will cause the ball to want to roll sooner, and the ball's response to friction will be slower with a more gradual hook motion and a more arching reaction.

BowlingChat · « **Reply #3 on:** March 17, 2011, 01:45:28 PM »

Skid distance is determined by coverstock attributes and/or drill angles on asymmetrics.

Pin up, or small VAL angles speed up transitions from hook to roll.

Pin down, or large VAL angles slow down transitions from hook to roll.

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Xcessive_Evil · « **Reply #4 on:** March 17, 2011, 02:36:24 PM »

+1

Dan Belcher wrote on 3/17/2011 1:02 PM:
Assuming the pin to PAP distance stays the same, you are actually considering the angle to the VAL more than you're talking about how far up or down the pin is from the fingers or center of grip or any visual thing like that.

Layouts that place the pin higher up visually and closer to the VAL will cause the ball to naturally want to skid more and hook later, and the ball's response to friction will be faster with a more angular breakpoint shape.

Layouts that place the pin lower visually and further away from the VAL will cause the ball to want to roll sooner, and the ball's response to friction will be slower with a more gradual hook motion and a more arching reaction.

I stone 8s and 9s like its cool...

Bill Thomas · « **Reply #5 on:** March 18, 2011, 02:37:47 PM »

WOW! If these responses are simple then I'm dumber than I thought. To repeat, what I would like to know is pin up is up above what? Pin down is down from what?

Edited by Bill Thomas on 3/18/2011 at 2:39 PM

JustRico · « **Reply #6 on:** March 18, 2011, 02:44:00 PM »

They are referencing the finger holes...pin above the finger holes or pin below the finger holes

The views and opinions expressed by myself are solely those of mine and NO one else, nor are they affiliated with anyone else.

Steven · « **Reply #7 on:** March 18, 2011, 02:44:24 PM »

The finger holes.....

Bill Thomas wrote on 3/18/2011 2:37 PM:
WOW! If these responses are simple then I'm dumber than I thought. To repeat, what I would like to know is pin up is up above what? Pin down is down from what?

Edited by Bill Thomas on 3/18/2011 at 2:39 PM

Juggernaut · « **Reply #8 on:** March 18, 2011, 03:13:34 PM »

OK Bill Thomas. You want simple, You got simple.

Pin up = Ball drilled with the pin above the level of the bridge/finger holes.

Pin down= Ball drilled with pin at or below the level of the bridge/finger holes.

The difference it makes, and I won't go into details as to why, pin up balls tend to go further before they read the pattern and they read the pattern harder. (I.E. their change of direction is delayed and more sudden)

Pin down balls tend to start reading a bit sooner, and they tend to be more of an arcier reaction when compared to their pin up counterparts. (I.E. their change of direction is sooner and smoother)

It really is about what moving the pin around does to the drilling and val angles, but that wouldn't be simple.

Edited by Juggernaut on 3/18/2011 at 3:14 PM

Zack Pelton300 · « **Reply #9 on:** March 19, 2011, 01:22:59 AM »

Pin up

will go longer down the lane and be much harder off the dry

Is better to use when getting in deeper. It will retain the energy and pop off the spot.

Pin down will start up sooner and be much smoother off the dry

Will be better to play straighter on shorter patterns, or if u move in to play a tighter line.

Bill Thomas · « **Reply #10 on:** March 19, 2011, 04:24:24 AM »

Thanks! These later posts I understand.

Dan Belcher · « **Reply #11 on:** March 19, 2011, 01:46:21 PM »

I hated to give you a simple answer of "the higher the pin, the longer it goes" that most people say because it's not always true.

For the vasty majority of layouts that league bowlers use, that's a pretty good standard to go by, but once you start considering some more unusual layouts, it may no longer be that obvious.

Author Topic: Pin up VS Pin down (Read 21576 times)

Bill Thomas

Pin up VS Pin down

storm22

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Dan Belcher

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

BowlingChat

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Xcessive_Evil

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Bill Thomas

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

JustRico

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Steven

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Juggernaut

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Zack Pelton300

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Bill Thomas

Re: Pin up VS Pin down

Dan Belcher

Re: Pin up VS Pin down