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Author Topic: Expensive Pro Shop Operator  (Read 9157 times)

SHEET

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Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« on: February 02, 2004, 10:05:24 PM »
I don't want to down play my driller. I just wanted to know if any one out there goes through the same thing that I do and my local bowling buddies goes through when it comes to dealing with a certain operator in our area. I don't want to mention his name, but this guy is really ridiculous when it comes to his prices. I know I personally spend alot on this hobby, especially with him, I'm not looking for a hand out and I know he has to eat and provide, but last saturday was the last draw. I had purchased a brand new ball from someone who wasn't using it, I brought the ball to my driller and with drilling and everything (inserts and slugs) he wanted $75 bucks. I know if I would've bought the ball from him that it would've been slightly cheaper. I didn't get upset, because everyone knows that this guy is very expensive. I took my new ball somewhere else that day and saved over $25.00 What are your thoughts on this? I already know of a few bowlers who won't even go in his shop to buy cleaner from him cause of his prices.

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"I'll BOWL ANYBODY!!!!!!"
Make sure the $$$ is enough and all there...
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SHEET

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2004, 02:30:54 PM »
WHEN AND WHERE WTBD???? And pick a price that will light on yourself!!!
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"I'll BOWL ANYBODY!!!!!!"
Make sure the $$$ is enough and all there...
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shotmaker

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2004, 04:24:59 PM »
quote:
This is what does not make sense. I take a ball to be plugged and drilled. I pay no more than $30.00. Now I take a new ball and they want $50.00. There is more work in one of them and they charge less. In the other is just the drilling and they charge more. Where is the logic? I always take my own grips and slugs to be installed.


The Pro Shop Operator may charge more in this case because if he ruins your new ball and has to replace it, it costs a lot of money. If he screws up on a plug/redrill, he can just plug it over and it will be fine. He may not even screw up the drilling, I've seen balls jump out of the fixture while drilling and get wrecked that way.

Bottom line seems to be if you don't like it, go somewhere else. There have been many good reasons posted in this thread for paying a little more. If it's still too much, find someone who fits into your budget better. If your in the Chicago area I recommend Chicago's Bowling Store. He does a great job and keeps himself very competitively priced.
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TwoFourEightNineNine

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2004, 10:46:10 PM »
The above discussion is the reason why I have to learn about my own equipment, fit, beveling, etc. The driller I work with here is very good in terms of hitting lines and fitting, and also with price, but he seems to have problems with setting up reactions for his customers as his shop is in a strip mall near San Francisco and not in a bowling center.

I lay out and draw out how I want my ball drilled on my own, he drills the holes, and I finish off the beveling, etc. I guess I am lucky, as I can get an Inferno $185 out the door with him.

Although some of those guys who are quite expensive in terms of drilling you a bowling ball, I have to admit that they are very thorough in their services. I guess some pro shops sell their knowledge about the game when setting up a reaction, etc, too.
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golfnutFL

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2004, 11:09:12 PM »
My friend who owned the shop before me sold the stuff a little above cost and charged extra for drilling. If you are not charging full retail then you should charge extra for drilling, this is known as a la carte. It has pro's and con's. I decided to just add up the total and have just one price, i.e. a raging inferno used to be sold for $175 + $25 for drilling. I sell it for $199+tax and inserts, etc. At $199 I am only making about $50, which is not alot in terms of the amount of work that is involved, i.e. layout, adding balance holes, determining PAP, wathcing the bowler, etc.
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WTBD-
At $199 you make only $50????  You can buy the ball for $130 at Buddies Pro Shop and I'm sure that he's not losing money. It is not uncommon to find this ball selling for $110 or less via e-bay. Do you think bowlingball.com is just giving them away? I know that my local proshop pays about $100 wholesale for them. So either Brunswick is ripping you off or you're making a little more than you claim.
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Mike Austin

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2004, 11:20:45 PM »
That local pro shop is probably not paying $100 for them.  If he is, he's getting them for well below wholesale, probably distributor price.  My best distributor price is about $129.00 for the Raging Inferno.  The internet sellers get a better price because they are dealing in volume, distributors will give the online guys a break for this reason.  The web site that I drill for gets a better price on most everything than I can get, they do more volume.

I have ala carte pricing on balls, Raging Inferno $155.95+tax, $50.00 for drilling, $5.95 for slug, $2.95 each for grips.  I throw in grips and slugs for regulars.  His $199.95 drilled is pretty good, Raging Inferno should retail around $219.95.  Gonna be about $220 out the door from me, and that ball is doing pretty well.

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Mike Austin
Mike Austin's Precision Pro Shop
Houston, TX
strikes4days@sbcglobal.net
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HamPster

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #21 on: February 04, 2004, 04:22:29 AM »
Gee, if it's such a problem, go drop $12,000 on a drill press, another thousand or two on drill bits (if you can get a deal, that is), a bevel sander, a weight scale, and everything else needed to drill a ball.  To make up our costs, and that's without profit PERIOD, we'd have to drill 600+ balls just to break even.  There's a difference between being ripped off and paying someone their due.  We pay a ton to have that stupid shop there so people can come in and whine and complain about how much they're paying.  

I bet the majority of you have a job where you get paid more than you're worth.  Do you complain about it?  Not a chance.  Would you scream if the boss suggested you take a pay cut.  HELL YES.  You'd pay the same whether you bought a ball online and brought it in to have it drilled or bought it at our shop.  We get SO many people that come in and say, "So and so screwed this up, can you fix it?"  Well frickin DUH, they probably gave you a discount, right?  So instead of paying us to do a GOOD job, you'd rather have trailer park Bob punch holes in a couple hundred dollar ball for a couple bucks off.  Then when he screws it up, you end up paying MORE between the drilling and having us fix it than you would have if you just brought it here to begin with.  If you want GOOD service and GOOD workmanship, you bring the ball to us, PERIOD.
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Pinbuster

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #22 on: February 04, 2004, 10:02:41 AM »
Everyone looks at the happy path.

There is a steady stream of bowlers coming in with balls to drill. Everyone already knows there measurements. Everyone already knows how they want the ball drilled and they know their PAP. They will finish all the balls themselves. Balls never crack, no warranty complaints, etc, etc.

Assuming all that you can layout and drill a ball in 15 minutes. WOW that’s 80 bucks an hour with $20 for drilling fees. And if that was the scenario then I would do it.

But the reality is. You only get a couple each day. Most don’t have a clue of their measurements. Most don’t have a clue of how the ball should be drilled. Most don’t know their PAP. They don’t have any idea on how to finish a ball. You have to explain warranty issues (drilling to close to pins, bridge width, drilling finger holes together at the bottom, beveling holes). You end up spending an average of 45 minutes to an hour on a ball.

You have to average things out and generate enough revenue to stay in business. When someone calls and wants to know the price to drill a blank ball you can’t go $20 to $100 depending on how big a pain the butt you are.

Unless the proshop is being run the proprietor as a service to their league customers you will loose your shirt charging $20 (particularly if you throw in inserts). We have had a lot of operators around here try and it and after a year or two they give up to get real jobs. I haven’t seen a proshop owner yet that was living the high life.

If you are willing to not have a proshop in every bowling establishment so that you only had 1 proshop for 5,000 league bowlers then maybe you could lower prices some. But would you be willing to wait a while because they were always busy.

PS. Our wholesale price on an Inferno is $129 and that is best price you can get from our distributor. We would sell the ball including drilling for $199.
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thegame

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2004, 10:17:20 AM »
There's a guy around here that everybody laughs at because of how ridiculous his prices are.  Most of the time a high end ball (Throttle, X-Factor, etc.) will run you $300 out the door, and he itimizes his charges, he charges 10 dollars extra if he has to drill a weight hole in the side.  I was subbing in a scratch league at this house, and had just gotten a new ball (not there of course), and the glue wasn't holding one of the finger grips in very well, so I went in to him, and said I just needed a couple drops of glue in the finger insert......5 dollar minimum charge on any hole he works on, I said screw it.  Fortunately one of the people on the team I was subbing for had some glue she said I could use......and would only charge me 3 dollars for it, LOL.  I can't imagine he gets any repeat business.  If anyone wants to know who it is in the SoCal area, just ask, I don't mind outing people who rip off customers who may not know any better.  There are other stories about him too, I just don't want to get into everything I know about him here.
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Rick Wunder

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #24 on: February 04, 2004, 11:06:00 AM »
Bravo Angstfilled, Hamster, Pinbuster, and of course, WTBD!  Your posts are right on the money!
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RW (THB)

Edited on 2/4/2004 12:04 PM

Edited on 2/4/2004 3:28 PM
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jkiser01

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #25 on: February 04, 2004, 12:06:39 PM »
Hamster Resurgence,

If yours was the only shop in my town, I would drive somewhere else.. People do not come into a pro shop to get lectured on prices or why they went somewhere else.. Your attitude in my opinion is horrible..
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If they only made a ball that would carry that d*mn 10 pin..

jkiser01
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SHEET

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #26 on: February 04, 2004, 12:09:20 PM »
Yea! Right on the money on how some of you punchers are rip off artist. At least my driller smiles at his customers while his digging in their pockets!
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"I'll BOWL ANYBODY!!!!!!"
Make sure the $$$ is enough and all there...
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SHEET

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #27 on: February 04, 2004, 01:19:16 PM »
You have a better chance going to the bank with a little note ANG.  Profiles don't matter! Pick any place any time, and keep in mind I don't unzip my bag for chump change!  I'm not down playing drillers especially if theyre good, but you guys should just listen a little bit.  I did'nt start this topic for nothingless but peoples opinions on what price I was quoted.  But the money is here... COME GET IT!!!
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"I'll BOWL ANYBODY!!!!!!"
Make sure the $$$ is enough and all there...
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Mike Austin

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #28 on: February 04, 2004, 04:20:39 PM »
jkiser,  you gotta relax a little bit man.  Hamster and Pinbuster mashed the nail on the head.  Jim, you are not the run of the mill customer, you have been part of the way around the block.  MOST customers are not your 190-200+ bowlers.  Most people don't have a clue about bowling balls, services, etc...  These are the people that get taken to the cleaners and/or they think they know something, want all your advice, time, expertise, experience, etc, and then want it at a discount.  You know what you want and can relate those things to your driller.  You also don't act like you are the best bowler on the planet.  You know what questions to ask and when to ask them.  85% of people are not like that.

If most of my customers came in and said I want a Barbed Wire, drill it like you did my Power Charge, 15lbs and I'll be back tomorrow to pick it up, that would awesome.  That's pretty much how you are, Jim.

Hamster doesn't have a bad attitude, he sees what busy operators see.  This business is brutal to make a living at.  MOST everybody wants a discount or free.  We don't get to mark up stuff like jewelry, if I bought an Inferno for $129.00 and could sell it for $774, I would be glad to knock off $100 or more for you, my good customer.  You would feel like you got a good deal, and I made a very nice mark up.  But, the reality is I buy it at $129.00, sell it for $155.95 undrilled.  Most people can get it on line for $140.00.  Drilling Fee is $50.00 whether you buy the ball from me or not.

I have a pro shop 15 minutes from me that sells that Inferno for $189.00 drilled.  He has raised his prices.  He used to charge $25 for blank drills.  I have been where I am for 5 years now.  There have been 15 other guys in my same location, and never could make it, the other guy was so cheap, they couldn't survive.  But I'm a whole other animal, I don't like to brag, but I'm as good as anybody in the country, I can get references.  I haven't went away.  The other guy raised his blank drill price to $40.  I MADE HIM MORE MONEY.  He is still cheaper than me, but he can't do what I can.  HE HAS NEVER THROWN A BOWLING BALL, EVER!  That is God's honest truth, see my profile.

Ultimately, this is a business.  If you want the best, you have to pay more than not the best.  Yes, I agree that there is gouging, and that is wrong.  The consumer has the right and should choose who drills his/her equipment.  But if you come to me you are choosing me and everything that goes with it, don't ask me to do it at the other guy's price, that's not fair to me, my employee, or my wife.  I do this because in the end I love it.  I love bowling.  I could/did make more money outside of bowling.  I'm not gonna give my life away, my experiences, skills etc are not gonna be free.  I'm not gonna take your last dollar either, word of mouth is the best advertising, and thank the Lord, I get lots of that.  I treat people right, I'm counting on the same from them.

sorry so long...
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Mike Austin
Mike Austin's Precision Pro Shop
Houston, TX
strikes4days@sbcglobal.net
Storm Pro Shop Staff Member
Vise Grips Staff Member


Onward through the Storm!!!!

Check out my web site - www.BirdDogBowling.com
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jkiser01

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #29 on: February 04, 2004, 04:30:06 PM »
Mike Austin,

Sorry, just stating my opinion.. The deal I did with you was great and I have nothing but good things to say about the way you do business.

I just hate the pro shop operator that has the attitude that "he is doing me a favor" by drilling my ball. I am paying for this service, its not free.. Some of the comments from certain users here sound like that to me, but maybe I am wrong..

Its obvious that this is a 2 sided conversation with the pro shop operators here on one side of the table and us run of the mill bowlers on the other..

I realize the pro shop business is just that a business and the bottom line is the money.. I just believe there is a fine line between charging a "fair" amount for your service and charging to much..

I am not going to comment on this anymore.. The bottom line is this.. If someone wants to pay $100 to have a blank drill drilled and they are happy about that, so be it.. Everyone will be happy and thats great..

I will just stick with my guy and be happy with the job he does for me..
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If they only made a ball that would carry that d*mn 10 pin..

jkiser01

Edited on 2/4/2004 5:32 PM
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AllStar23

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Re: Expensive Pro Shop Operator
« Reply #30 on: February 04, 2004, 04:37:01 PM »
I go to 2 drillers..1 is very cheap and cuts me great deals since i am a junior and one is just normal and doesnt cut anyone deals..I got an x factor and leftside got a silver streak pearl all for about 300 bucks..That is drilling slugs inserts and everything..This guy is very good at drilling and is very smart about it..the only thing is is he cant plug a ball very well so i go to my other driller and she charges aruond 35..The only problem with her is she seems to wanna drill everything stacked..I hate that. But 75$ is just rediculous..I dont care if hes the best in the world..I dont think id pay that.

Just my 2 cents.
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If for every shot my cherry bomb carried a 7 pin id be rich..But im not..Whats that say?
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