Author Topic: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line (Read 1156 times)

J_w73 · « **on:** April 28, 2009, 04:34:15 AM »

What is the best way to find the shot on tough conditions?
Focussing on changing speed or ball path/line?
What is more important? This last weekend I bowled on a PBA shark shot and another shot that I don't know what it was. On both of these shots my ball wasn't moving much. I have a hard time deciding whether I should just slow my ball speed down until I get a decent reaction needed to strike or if I should just use by normal speed and move to get to the pocket. I know that both are needed but I see alot of people just throwing their normal league speed which I find way too fast for the ball to even move and create an angle needed to carry and strike.

I kind of get discouraged because I have quite a few balls and 3 for heavier oil.. whenever I find true heavy oil these balls don't seem to hook any better than anything else.

Shark I went 211, 181, 169 , 169..
the house mystery pattern 138, 141, 225..
the house pattern was crazy.. there were 6 decent bowlers(180 and up) and the high score the first two games was 146.. I don't know what I did the 3rd game but got lucky and found a shot that wasn't there the first two games. Again I was discouraged because I felt my skill and knowledge should have allowed me to atleast have a clue the first two games... and I absolutely had no clue on what to do.. other then just moving right and gunning at the pocket with my spare ball(which is probabably what I should have done).. and then don't do anything really different and a 225 falls in my lap..

any thoughts or suggestions welcome..
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16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180

Edited on 4/28/2009 12:34 PM

azus · « **Reply #1 on:** April 29, 2009, 03:51:12 AM »

I would move until i found the pocket. Changing the speed too much may result in loss of accuracy, which is baad on a pba pattern.
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dizzyfugu · « **Reply #2 on:** April 29, 2009, 07:22:57 AM »

Same here. Keep execution simple/stable and use the warm-up shots to find a line from a basic initial line (I prefer straight down 10th board and adjust from there with equipment, feet and target, depending on the feedback from the lane).

After a few shots you should have a line that leads you into the pocket, and since sport patterns tend to change quickly, you should keep your eyes open and always question the line you are currently playing.
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pin-chaser · « **Reply #3 on:** April 29, 2009, 11:02:52 AM »

Absolute makes a great point. THS we worry about left/right as there is an artifical location where you have the most "mistake room". Given tougher conditions there is not the "great location" and we must look for where we find backend movement. Once we find it, it is a matter of staying there (at that breakpoint location) as long as we can. Not only do I use speed, but I use hand postions, loft and arsenal changes. This does not mean that I will stay in the same location at the arrows, I will chase the oil left as the head and mid lanes dry up... but keep the breakpoint the same as long as it continues to react.

Zack Pelton300 · « **Reply #4 on:** April 29, 2009, 11:10:58 AM »

Look at other bowlers that are doing well. Take in what part of the lane they are playing. If u are playing the right part of the lane you will have a couple boards on either side of u on PBA patterns.

You say u have three heavy oil balls? what r they and how are they drilled? maybe u have them to aggressive/weak Or ur surface might be killing the ball.
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Zack Pelton
Olathe, Kansas
Ebonite Amateur Staff
Ebonite Bowl 2 Win
www.ebonite.com

Edited on 4/29/2009 11:11 AM

J_w73 · « **Reply #5 on:** April 29, 2009, 12:46:33 PM »

quote:
Look at other bowlers that are doing well. Take in what part of the lane they are playing. If u are playing the right part of the lane you will have a couple boards on either side of u on PBA patterns.

You say u have three heavy oil balls? what r they and how are they drilled? maybe u have them to aggressive/weak Or ur surface might be killing the ball.
--------------------
Zack Pelton
Olathe, Kansas
Ebonite Amateur Staff
Ebonite Bowl 2 Win
www.ebonite.com

Edited on 4/29/2009 11:11 AM

I have for heavier oil:
Mammoth Rico'd at 200-360 US grit.. Pin is 5 1/2 to PAP-
Anger 4" pin to PAP.. cg toward PAP.. with weight hole on PAP, 1000 ABRALON
Epic Odyssey. 5 " pin to PAP. Weight hole on PAP, 60 deg MB, 2000 ABRALON
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16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180

Edited on 4/29/2009 1:01 PM

Scott_in_PA · « **Reply #6 on:** May 21, 2009, 01:48:52 PM »

Hi J_w73:

I bowled on the Shark pattern for the first time last night, so I'm now an expert (kidding). My specs are very similar to yours, maybe a little less revs, so maybe my experience will help you.

During practice, I tried my most current "oiler" (Storm Dimension @ 4.5 x 3, 2000 Abralon) straight up 8, 10, 12, 5 - nothing. Skidded about 58 feet. This house has fairly new synthetic lanes which I find always play longer and slicker than any other surface I've ever bowled on. But still, I was left wishing I had made a dentist appointment...

What I ended up doing was throwing an old Track Rule GP2 solid particle at about 1000 abralon. Mind you, this ball is the biggest steaming turd I ever dropped $200-plus on. But the one thing it does do well is to make its barely-noticeable move consistently at about 25 feet - even on ice. For the remaining 35 feet, it just rolls straight, but at least it rolls. I lined up left foot on board 18 and targeted straight up 11 right to the pocket. Then it was a matter of concentrating on each shot and really grinding. All I worried about was trying to take every bit of muscle out of my swing and release and just hit my mark. I ended up actually turning the ball much less than normal, which probably sounds counter-intuitive on a slick condition. Bottom line was just get the ball to the pocket and then make your easy spares. Ended up with only 3 open frames over 4 games (2 splits, 1 washout) and shot 872 with a low of 203.

There are several 215+ average bowlers in this league, but most of them continued to try to bend the shot. I saw every ugly split and washout imaginable and a bunch of 150 and 160 games. I want no part of that.

I think most decent bowlers get so used to seeing the long and angular trajectory of today's aggressive equipment, which is undeniably awesome when you have area. But on a truly difficult condition, that look can be your worst enemy. In my opinion, the best approach on these conditions is to play as straight up the lane as possible with the smoothest, rollingest (I made that up) shot you can muster. When you play very direct, you can get away with minor variations in your speed and release, as long as you are accurate.

As far as equipment, for tough conditions I will always keep in my arsenal at least one particle, one urethane, and maybe even a solid reactive drilled pin-axis...

-Scott in PA

dogman666 · « **Reply #7 on:** May 21, 2009, 02:33:51 PM »

quote:
But still, I was left wishing I had made a dentist appointment...

Great analogy

chipmunkbowler · « **Reply #8 on:** May 25, 2009, 06:09:21 AM »

well when you get onto the shot and have no idea what it is throw a ball extremely slow and see when it hooks on the lane to get an idea of the length of the pattern if it hooks later on the lane you want to be throwing it slow if it hooks early fast. first of all if it's a medium or long pattern try throwing it down 5 see what happens if it makes the head pin you are in a rather good spot (on a medium condition it will usually make the headpin) if it doesn't (usually happens on a long shot) move into the 7 or 8th board still throwing it the same and if you then make the headpin you are in a good spot however if that doesn't happen you can move into the 10th or 11th board then it should get back. on short shots try throwing it out to about 3 or 4 at the breakpoint and if it doesn't make the headpoint try 5 and it should make the headpin.

btw when i say that you are in a good shot i mean you are good to make an adjustment off it) and when i say like move into the 7th or 8th board i mean breakpoint wize

icewall · « **Reply #9 on:** May 25, 2009, 07:49:00 AM »

im far from experienced in sport conditions but ive learned what not to do.

after bowling on 50ft of flat oil 5 times: (this was a nightmare lol!)

when a pattern is flatter stop thinking like you would on a THS. just stop searching for the friction its just not there! pick a ball that rolls heavy and close your angles THEN move till your ball is making it into the pocket. its also wise to play with lots of forward roll... too much side rotation and there just isnt enough friction early for it to make a big turn.

as for the pba stuff:

you need to really play odd areas of the lane such as VERY deep or up the boards on the outside. it really depends on the lane surface and oil machine. the lanes i used to go to really made the pba patterns play weird. I had to play the viper by crossing the 4th arrow!

take it for what it is... as back then I didnt have the release I have now (much higher revs and cleaner)

J_w73 · « **Reply #10 on:** May 25, 2009, 10:50:49 AM »

quote:
im far from experienced in sport conditions but ive learned what not to do.

after bowling on 50ft of flat oil 5 times: (this was a nightmare lol!)

when a pattern is flatter stop thinking like you would on a THS. just stop searching for the friction its just not there! pick a ball that rolls heavy and close your angles THEN move till your ball is making it into the pocket. its also wise to play with lots of forward roll... too much side rotation and there just isnt enough friction early for it to make a big turn.

as for the pba stuff:

you need to really play odd areas of the lane such as VERY deep or up the boards on the outside. it really depends on the lane surface and oil machine. the lanes i used to go to really made the pba patterns play weird. I had to play the viper by crossing the 4th arrow!

take it for what it is... as back then I didnt have the release I have now (much higher revs and cleaner)

what you said was my biggest problem... I just bought the biggest oiler and had it drilled leverage and it still wasn't hooking.. It was hard getting through my head that nothing was going to hook at all. I figured I have had decent revs and something should hook. What helped me realized that nothing will move is when I bowled a pro-am shot that was heavily oiled.. my ball wasn't moving.. but all the pro's balls weren't moving a lick either.....if these guys can't make it hook then there is no chance for me to make it hook..
--------------------
16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180

Author Topic: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line (Read 1156 times)

J_w73

finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

azus

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

dizzyfugu

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

pin-chaser

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

Zack Pelton300

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

J_w73

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

Scott_in_PA

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

dogman666

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

chipmunkbowler

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

icewall

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line

J_w73

Re: finding the shot on tough conditions. speed vs line