Author Topic: Frustration (Read 3435 times)

card79 · « **on:** July 30, 2003, 11:19:45 PM »

This is going to be long winded and I am sorry for that. I NEED HELP BAD. I have become very frustrated with my game. I have been working this summer on staying down at the line better and being more accurate. The staying down at the line has not worked as well as I had hoped. I have had my knees worked on quite a bit and honestly I am not sure it will get better.

With the accuracy part I have just really been trying to free up my armswing and not muscle the ball. It has made me a lot more accurate a good thing right. NO NOT AT ALL. Every ball in my bag is uncontrolable. I realize that my ball speed has contributed a lot to this, but I seem to be getting a TON more revs on the ball as well. My plastic spare ball is even hooking constantly.

I have tried coming up the back of the ball and things of this nature. I have to be honest I think I have changed so many things at this point that I have changed my game right into a train wreck. I video taped a practice session a couple weeks ago and man when I watched it I thought I looked a lot better especially compared to some of the older tapes I had of myself, but the results have been terrible.

I feel sort of desperate right now because honestly I have been a lot less interested here lately. Haven't even been on here nearly as much as I used too. Didn't even practice this week just went and played golf an extra day. I love the game very much and I hate that I am going the other way. Only light I see right now is I just got a hextreme drilled label with the pin in between the fingers and absolutely no side weight. It has been controlable. Our center just recently resurfed, but I was struggling before that. I could keep going on and on but I will stop and hope for help. Anything anybody else thinks might be important to know though just ask.
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

TWOHAND834 · « **Reply #1 on:** July 31, 2003, 02:42:38 PM »

What equipment are you using? Have you taken your plastic ball and polished it to hell and back? Another thing, is that centers like to conserve oil in the summertime just because there is more open play than anything. So, alot of times, the conditions you see in the summer are not anywhere near what you may see in the fall. We have that problem every summer in Atlanta. Centers like to lessen the amounts of oil, because they have centered there business around open play. If the amount of leagues have diminished, they purposely put down less oil during the day, because it is more cost effective for them. What I would do, is go to balls with a smooth reaction. Anything drilled aggressive is going to be uncontrollable. I hope this answers your questions. I would not worry too much, because accuracy is the name of this game. Just try and hold out until fall starts. If you are still struggling, chances are it is a problem with the center, whether they put down a tougher condition, or there is a malfunction with the oil machine.
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If anyone out there is worried about the scores being too high, try duckpin!!

HamPster · « **Reply #2 on:** July 31, 2003, 02:43:35 PM »

Seriously, something that I've found recently that's helped me a lot is to try fluffing it. I mean, you don't have to go to like 5 revs at 16 mph, just cut back significantly. I backed off to abou 250 revs, increased my speed a little and moved right. Just practice and practice and practice like that. Then when you go back to increase the revs and speed, it'll feel so much smoother, and you'll feel that control. If you get comfortable with both extremes, it'll make your natural shot just that much more controllable. How about your measurements for your fingers? Does everything feel comfortable? You might have yourself refitted just out of curiousity. I don't know how you feel about slumps, I work through them. Some people would rather take a break for a while.
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Forget Kung Fu, I know Ron Bahr!!!

The only difference between youth and adult leagues are that the big boys are allowed to whine. They're more entertaining anyway.

charlest · « **Reply #3 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:06:54 PM »

Andy,

Many people have and will offer bowling recommendations. I'm going to come at you from another direction, one you won't like, but one that I've found to make a big difference. While I'm not as big as your profile states you are, I've found that losing weight when you're over a certain ratio makes a HUGE difference in what you are able to do with a bowling ball. I can almost guarantee it will help your knee more than anything except a cortisone shot. And that's only temporary.

No matter how muscular you are, you need to get that weight off your knee. Even Schwarzenegger lost weight when he stopped competing and he was solid muscle.
I'm sorry if this is not what you may have wanted to hear, but it is very true.
Your knee will feel better, your thigh, your feet will all feel better. You'll find it's easier to be much more coordinated, even if you don't feel un coordinated now.

AT 6'5", well, ... you know what you should weigh. Even if you were still solid packed with muscles, 250 lbs would be more than you should carry. Your heart and your blood will probably also thank you. (No doubt your wife may also ...

)

From experience, I know losing weight will make a huge difference in your bowling abilities.
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"Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it."

card79 · « **Reply #4 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:21:29 PM »

Charlest,

I don't take that badly at all. Along that line, but slightly off subject. I am currently in the process of dropping weight. I have lost about 20 pounds so far. I am doing it mainly because with the lack of cartiledge left in my right knee they tell me someday it will need to be replaced and the only way to prolong it is take stress from it. So, who knows maybe that is throwing my game off some. I know I have had to add some tape to the thumb of all my balls.

Andy
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

livespive · « **Reply #5 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:24:11 PM »

At 6'-5" 250 is fine.

I go 6'-2" 325, and coodination is not a problem. I think it would only be a problem if you used to bowl at 180 then puffed up to 250.
But if you are concerned about your knee, you need to work out.
Coordination should not be an issue, unless you are thinking about your knee. I will tell you though what
might be your major problem..."mental block" IF you have been blowing bad
from the time of your knee injury, more than likely you are thinking about
the injury. After sticking on the approach I tore my groin and hamstring.
The road to recovery was long, but even once I made it bad, subconsciously,
I would think about the injury and my accuracy suffered. You have to totally forget about the injury.

Also if you are muscling the ball you typically short arm the ball. Try reaching farther out on the lane
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Eric T. Spivey, P.E.
Visionary Test Staff Member

card79 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:44:34 PM »

Actually Eric I haven't "injured" my knees since College. While they are quite often sore I haven't hurt them per se. I have been not muscling the ball and seemingly that was when the problems started. I don't know. I am with you though I don't think cordination is the problem, but who knows. Maybe I am expecting too much too soon. I just finished second season so I haven't been doing it forever maybe it is just inconsistency mixed with trying to change my game and having growing pains.
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

charlest · « **Reply #7 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:48:44 PM »

quote:
livespive: At 6'-5" 250 is fine.

Let's be cautious because it's his knee, not ours. 250 can be fine, if all your other physicalities are up to supporting it.

quote:
I go 6'-2" 325, and coordination is not a problem. I think it would only be a problem if you used to bowl at 180 then puffed up to 250.

I think you're the exception rather than the rule, to be able to bowl well at that weight. It's takes a lot of musculature to support all the things needed to bowl well at that weight. Don't take your abilities for granted .

Andy has already said his right knee has torn or very little cartilage. I'd worry about that.

quote:

But if you are concerned about your knee, you need to work out.

How do you strengthen the leg muscles without stressing your knee at the same time? Very difficult, I'd imagine. No? I am not a physical therapist; so, I do not know.

quote:
Coordination should not be an issue, unless you are thinking about your knee. I will tell you though what
might be your major problem..."mental block" IF you have been blowing bad
from the time of your knee injury, more than likely you are thinking about
the injury. After sticking on the approach I tore my groin and hamstring.
The road to recovery was long, but even once I made it bad, subconsciously,
I would think about the injury and my accuracy suffered. You have to totally forget about the injury.

Isn't he likely to badly injure a bad knee if he ignores it?

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"Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it."

Gravy · « **Reply #8 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:53:35 PM »

Card,
Making changes to ones game can be tough and your score and confidence. The tendency is to try harder, which causes increased tension to the armswing.When your bowling well everything is easy you feel tension free, both physically and mentally. Sounds like you have a large mental check list and you might be squeezing the ball a little tighter. This will causes a tight armswing and in turn causes you to force the shot. Once you start forcing the shot, at that point its very difficult to repeat the shot. What I try is do all my thinking before I pick up the ball. On the approach I focus on my target never taking my eyes off my target (not so easy to do all the time). I then count to 3 and start my approach always looking at your target. But before I start counting to 3 I release the tension from my hand and then my arm.( if you watch some pros you can see shake their arm before they start the approach. That a tension release method) Maintain that tension free feeling all the way through you follow through. I noticed your concern about staying down, If you look at your target all the way till the ball crosses your target you automatically stay down. Just relax you've bowled well in the past you will bowl well in the future it's not like you started bowling yesterday. Hope this helps.

charlest · « **Reply #9 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:59:56 PM »

quote:
Charlest,

I don't take that badly at all. Along that line, but slightly off subject. I am currently in the process of dropping weight. I have lost about 20 pounds so far. I am doing it mainly because with the lack of cartiledge left in my right knee they tell me someday it will need to be replaced and the only way to prolong it is take stress from it. So, who knows maybe that is throwing my game off some. I know I have had to add some tape to the thumb of all my balls.

Andy
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

Are you right handed or lefty?
Neither is good with that kind of damage.
Losing that weight is a fantastic start. Keep it up; it can only help.

Some other suggestions:
- if you are or have bene changing so many things, it is not unusual for yuor scores to go down as you wok them all into your delivery/approach. Next time, try to reduce the number of changes to 1 or 2 at most to insue they are properly integrated into your bowling.

- Try to bowl at one place during the Summer to keep a sense of consistency. You are making the changes; different oil patterns can confuse you into believing some change is not working when it really is. The main idea to keep every other thing constant, when you changing any one thing.

- if you are getting discouraged and we all do, take a break. Do go golfing. When you feel more relaxed again, then start your bowling.

- chart the changes you are making on pen and paper. Don't take for granted that you will remember. Nothing is better, especially when you start 3 or 4 days later.

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"Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it."

card79 · « **Reply #10 on:** July 31, 2003, 09:37:53 PM »

Charlest I am Right handed.

For everyone here is an update. As I said I did not practice at all this week. I went and bowled league tonight. I didn't focus on anything . I just laughed drank a beer or two had fun and didn't worry about all the changes I have been trying to make. While my spare shooting was not as good as I had hoped it was definitely a better series. Hopefully this will start to turn the corner. Maybe I am over thinking it.
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

livespive · « **Reply #11 on:** July 31, 2003, 10:11:25 PM »

Tell you what card79,

Maybe we can get together sometime seeing as I live in Ohio also.

charlest
I know it is his knee I am just speaking generally. 250 # on a 6'5" fram is not that bad. Like I was saying about the coodination. If he has been bowl at this weight all along and hasn't had a problem I don't see where he would have one, unless he keeps thinking about his knee, because I used to think about my injury too.

There are excersises you can do to strengthen your knee without over stressing it.

I think just the opposite the more you think about an injury the more you favor the injury, the more you move in a way that you don't normally move. It is the abnormal movement that can get you into trouble. One it can cause other injuries, two if for say you loose your balance and you are in the abnormal position, you can cause damage when you try to stablize yourself.

Yeah charlest, I definately know I am the exception except for maybe TBU hehe

Been this way all my life. Luckily I am somewhat solid so I carry it well. Hell SrKegler's seen me bowl he knows I'm light on my feet

hehehe

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Eric T. Spivey, P.E.
Visionary Test Staff Member

charlest · « **Reply #12 on:** July 31, 2003, 10:18:53 PM »

Card,

Glad you had a good time tonight.

Livespive,

Being a little older than the avg guy/gal here, but not as old as Bones, I tend to err slightly on the side of caution. When we're 15, 20, even 30, we tend not to think of the future; we almost believe we're invulnerable. As age creeps up, we realize, Holy crap, I could die or be seriously hurt.

Andy's (Card's name) knee at his now 270 lbs, (he lost 20) could be seriously hurt if he;s careless. As an ex-football, I know he is VERY aware of that. Luckily he doesn't slide on this damaged knee, but he must push off with it. I'm only 235 but I know I should be 200-210; so I am also VERY aware of what knee pain can mean to bowling.

Lucky you, having been so "solid" all your live. May your luck continue! really.

Good Luck, Andy, err, Card79.

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"Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it."

card79 · « **Reply #13 on:** August 01, 2003, 08:14:23 AM »

Thanks everyone for the help you worked me through a lot mentally yesterday. As I said I just went in and did what was natural last night and didn't think about it. I still need to free up my armswing and work on being down at the line, but I am going to go at it a little slower this time and not do both at the same time. I think mentally I was just overwhelming myself. Eric not sure what part of Ohio you are in, but I would love to get together sometime and throw some games just let me know.

Charlest thank you if you know it or not you have continued the push I need to go in the right direction. I am solid, but there is no earthly reason I need to carry this much weight anymore. It is kind of cool though all my friends love saying dang I have put on 20 pounds since college. I can say shoot I am about 30 pounds less than in college and still be huge. I will just go for supersized from now on though and not huge.

TWOHAND834 I did take my plastic ball and just polished the heck out of it with control it before league lastnight. I did hook less. Still 4 or 5 boards movement, but I don't know that it will get better than that.

Hamster I am going to try as you say in practice fluffing it a little. See what it does can't hurt anything. Maybe I am just trying to put too much on it. Who knows I may not even be coming out of it the same way twice even though on the video's it looks like it.

Dizzle maybe I will try that beat up on non-bowlers and make myself feel better.
LOL

Gravy I think you hit it on the nose. I think what you described is basically what I did last night and it worked. I still need to make changes, but for now I am using your techniques.

LT I sent you a private message as I said on there. I don't dislike you and really don't dislike anybody on here. We had a disagreement and in life we will never find somebody that we agree with all the time.

To everyone thank you with friends like you guys how could I not get better.

You thought I forgot you Mojo didn't you. You still owe me a gathering and we will drink and bowl well buddy thanks.
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

livespive · « **Reply #14 on:** August 01, 2003, 08:46:58 AM »

quote:
quote:
You thought I forgot you Mojo didn't you. You still owe me a gathering and we will drink and bowl well buddy thanks.
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

Yeah we need to get that gathering going... I know Jeff and Joe would like to meet you. We have other members in this area that might make it as well. I think Livespive lives near you as well and might want to join up.

We will make sure the alcoholic beverages are ready to go... though I don't drink beer (insert Joe or Jeff girly drink joke here) I'm always up for some rum & coke or something of the sort. The Captain always has my back...

Yeah I stay in Lima ohio kind in between the both of you. So I would be up for it. Keep me informed, and I will check my schedule.

Eric
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Eric T. Spivey, P.E.
Visionary Test Staff Member

Author Topic: Frustration (Read 3435 times)

card79

Frustration

TWOHAND834

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HamPster

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charlest

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card79

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livespive

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card79

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charlest

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Gravy

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charlest

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card79

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livespive

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charlest

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card79

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livespive

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