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Author Topic: having problems playing deep  (Read 3228 times)

pchee2

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having problems playing deep
« on: September 23, 2003, 09:01:03 PM »
Last night I played super DEEP 2nd arrow out to 5/6 board.   I'm not too comfortable playing that deep and swinging the ball that much.  How do you guys learn to trust the ball when playing deep like at 2nd arrow, or thrid arrow?  I can't imaging moving way inside over 12 or 13 at the arrows and swinging it that's just crazy.  How do you line up and where do you look when playing so deep inside?


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pchee2<~~~strokin the ball with cranker revs and spraying the lanes for an average of a buck 62.  This guy is full of STUFF!
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Brickguy221

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2003, 12:37:09 PM »
Bones, I like Pechee, have had a problem in the past playing deep. My question and I think it is also Pechee's question is for example:

If playing the third arrow out 5, where do you line up?
If playing the fourth arrow out to 7 or 8 etc. where do you line up?

I'm sure everyone lines up a little different, but isn't there some type "rule of the thumb" to start working at? Just like in a 4 step approach, there are some "rule of the thumb" rules to begin at and then you adjust from there such as hold the ball higher or lower, hold it in front of your stomach or right leg (for right handers) or in line with shoulder, push the ball out with first step or middle of first step, or end of first step if you are a hesitater or slow stepper, and etc. These are adjustments a person makes after learning the basic 4 step approach, so isn't there sone type basics also for playing deep?
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In the old days, they used axes to chop up wood...Nowadays, they use "BUZZSAWS".
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Nicanor

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2003, 12:56:23 PM »
The question I have is whether or not Pchee2 is talking about the second or third arrow from the left and not the right which would make it the 25 or 30 board at the arrows for a right handed bowler.

V/R,
Nicanor
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Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)

Pinbuster

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2003, 12:58:08 PM »
One of the keys is to get your shoulders squared up to the intended line of your shot. Many use to playing down the boards have their shoulders square with the foul line which is correct on the down and in shot. But to play deeper you shoulders need to be open in relation to the foul line but still square with your desired ball path.

As far a peaches goes…. He needs to improve the size of his manliness to play deeper with his CPL’s (chicks per league).
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Brickguy221

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2003, 01:21:17 PM »
Pinbuster, is it the size of Pechee's manliness or manliless?

Pin, question on shoulders and lining up, and etc. Are you saying for example that if I was to want to throw over the 3rd arrow out to say 7, that I need to line up and go straight to foul line as if I wanted to throw straight down the 3rd arrow, except rather than being square to foul line, turn (open up my shoulders) and walk straight to foul line, only have shoulders open?....Gosh, am I confusing here in trying to ask this question?

Maybe thats what I do wrong in where (I'm right handed)I place the inside edge of my left foot against board 27 to throw over 15 to 7 or so. Am I lining up wrong here? Should I be lined up closer to 15 only just open shoulders?
Could this also be why I pull the ball plus try so hard to help it? Can some one please help here?.....And yes, I've read Ron C's Tips, but they only show what angle to throw. There is no information there on where to stand, end up at foul line or anything of that nature and if there is, I missed it, dumb me.
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In the old days, they used axes to chop up wood...Nowadays, they use "BUZZSAWS".
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Pinbuster

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2003, 01:45:14 PM »
If you are laying the ball down on 30 hitting 20 and swinging to 10 your shoulders should be square to that line (they would be open in relation to the foul line).

You can do this two ways. You can walk down the boards on the approach (or drift to the left) and then in you last step or square up to the line opening your shoulders. Or you can move to the left of the approach and simply walk a parallel line too your target line (this will be at an angle to the boards on the approach giving the appearance you are drifting right).

I do the latter. This causes me problems when playing deep because on the right hand lane the ball return can get in the way of where you need to stand.  

But if your shoulders are square to the foul line and not your target line you will either pull the ball left or you will loose leverage as you swing your arm to the right on the intended line and throw a weak shot.  
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kjl456

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #6 on: September 24, 2003, 01:46:28 PM »
A guide:

First you need to know your laydown point relative to your slide foot. This example will be for a right hander. Generally for a right hander this will be 6-8 boards to the right of the inside of your slide foot. To find it, kneel down with your middle finger pointing down. Touch the lane. Count the number of boards between the inside of your slide foot and where your middle finger touches the approach. For this example, let's assume your laydown point is seven boards from your slide foot.

Next I'll assume you are using medium speed on your ball. I'll also assume you are targeting the third arrow or 15 board. In general(will vary due to absence of head oil, ballspeed, etc.) the ball will travel as many boards right of the 15 board as you lay it down left of the 15 board - for example if you open your shoulders, target 15, and lay it down on 20 it will go out to 10.

So where do you stand to swing it over 15 out to 10? Assuming you walk straight you would line up on 27 (you want to lay it down on 20 and then add 7 for the difference between your laydown point and slide foot).

I grant everyone I've made a lot of assumptions here - but I've found this works for me. You'll find if you open your shoulders more your ball may swing more than the five boards I've described - open shoulders less, ball will swing less.

Good bowling,
Ken

Edited on 9/24/2003 1:56 PM

Edited on 9/24/2003 1:57 PM
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EL

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #7 on: September 24, 2003, 02:06:36 PM »
Pinbuster is correct on the two methods. I use more of the drift to the left and then square off at my target at the last step. The drift is due to the ball return getting in the way. As a righty my shoulders and head is squared or aimed in the direction of the 6 pin. My target now is not at the arrows but some mark on the lanes farther down then the arrows. I would try to hit this mark and have the ball turn at that mark.
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bennett

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #8 on: September 24, 2003, 02:47:21 PM »
Sounds like you need more oil laid down and exactly my point.  Bowlers with hand shouldn't need to cross a ton of boards to have a shot.  I continue to experience problems with this on all of my leagues.  My average continues to drop as I'm forced to play deeper and deeper when my plastic ball doesn't give me the results I'm looking for.  My average has fallen while lower average bowlers with no hand have gone up.  I'm already tired of it.  I've shot some of my worse sets in years back to back weeks (529, 540, 577, 574).  I used to never have sets like this in a row.  

This crap sucks.  This could my last season of bowling other than one mixed league a week.

Edited on 9/24/2003 3:21 PM
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I want to have a 220+ average like everybody else around here, so give me fresh oil.  

card79

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2003, 02:57:04 PM »
Bennett-

I am not sure the exxon valdes could wreck on pchee's set and dump enough oil for him to play down and in.
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atomized

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #10 on: September 24, 2003, 03:39:29 PM »
In playing deep Ron Clifton has some great advice in bowl4fun.com. In addition to his advice and some other good advice from others here, there are a couple of different approaches.

What worked for me was to keep it simple to start.  Lined up on my ten from the 3rd arrow. If you throw flat you make the ten if you put revs on it, the ball comes in at some point. Trust your ball will come back. If you are close then just some minor adjusting. If it is more then a little off find a ball that fit's the lane condition. Especially while learning. As you get more comfortable the more you can adjust on any given ball, and the wall is a great aid.
Hope this helps.
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Brickguy221

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Re: having problems playing deep
« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2003, 10:22:18 PM »
Card, how much oil can Pechee buy for "a buck sixty two"?  






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In the old days, they used axes to chop up wood...Nowadays, they use "BUZZSAWS".
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"Whenever I feel the urge to exercise I lie down until the feeling passes away"
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