Author Topic: Have the Brunswick bowling ball buyers seen (Read 18359 times)

Nicanor · « **on:** March 13, 2009, 12:55:52 AM »

the break or cost savings that Brunswick has seen with its move to Mexico. In mexico you can have labor alone that is one quarter the labor rate herein the US and also all the laws and rules with regards to safety and enviornment is much less restrictive saving a lot of money.

Has any of that savings been passed on to us the consumer?

I don't think so.

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Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)

CoachLefty · « **Reply #16 on:** March 13, 2009, 02:17:07 PM »

I like Bigg B balls, but the whole Mexico thing has me wondering.

Do you guys buy shirt that are made in China? They still make shirt in America you know. The only thing that i have noticed as far as price goes, is the availability of blems and 2nds have increased, making those balls cheaper. I personally like the longer pin balls, they allow me more options for drilling. I have heard that the Muskie factory was a dump anyway.
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Go Balls Deep

Lefty

applegam · « **Reply #17 on:** March 13, 2009, 02:32:08 PM »

I hate to break the news to you all, but Brunswick is a corporation. This is not a non-profit organization. Corporations are in business to make money. Corporations that operate in the negative, don't last. If I'm not mistaken, most of their raw materials are U.S. made. Get over it.

As as far as all of this tax talk. Have you not heard of NAFTA?

« **Reply #18 on:** March 13, 2009, 02:36:58 PM »

If Brunswick had NOT moved manufacturing to Mexico they would likely be out of the bowling ball business. Think about the possible consequences of that.

That would leave one less major manufacturer out of the loop, and one step closer to one (or two) factories having a "monopoly" on the industry. Let's suppose that happened. Do you think that one company would lower their prices? The opposite would happen. They could charge whatever they wanted because they wouldn't have any real competition. And you all would be buying them at the higher price - even off the internet - because those sites would also have to pay the higher prices.

EVERY COMPANY IN THE WORLD EXISTS TO MAKE A PROFIT. If they don't they won't stay open very long. Quit complaining that this company (or that company) tries to stay competitive, by not paying someone between $25-$45 per hour to make a bowling ball.

Brunswick is still headquartered in Michigan. They pay U.S. taxes. Their raw materials come from the U.S.A. There are plenty of other countries out there, in addition to America, that can produce a quality product.

Look in your closet. Read the labels. Look at your spare ball. Many are made in China. Look at your bowling shoes, bowling bag, etc. Unless your bag is a KR (or Brunswick) it was likely made overseas. Get over it, and get used to it. This is a world-wide economy, not just a U.S. economy. Those days are gone, like it or not.

--------------------
Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff

www.brunswickbowling.com

The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer and not of Brunswick Corporation.

chitown · « **Reply #19 on:** March 13, 2009, 05:18:15 PM »

quote:
quote:
The United States should pass laws to increase the tax on imported goods so as to off set the cost of labor. It's impossible for a company that resides in the United States to compete with the labor wages of Mexico or China. For example, let's say union scale for a factory worker in the United States is 20 dollars per hour and non union scale is 12 dollars per hour. In Mexico that same worker is getting 5 dollars and hour if their lucky! In China that same worker is getting 10 dollars per day of work.

How can the United States compete with that? Easy, increase the import tax to an amount that off sets the cost of labor. Make it more profitable to manufacture in the United States rather than out of the country.

In my eyes the unions are PART of the problem with companies going out of the USA to do business. I am not saying they are completely at fault but they share the blame. I work for a company that would rather close its doors instead of dealing with a union.
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Kyle

I'm for unions but will say that not all unions are good.

When a company moves to Mexico to save on labor it's not just because of union wages in the United States. Wether it's union or non union we still can't compete with slave labor wages.

I obviously don't have all the answers but the U.S.A needs to level the playing field. NAFTA needs to be fixed!

If other country's sell 5 million autos in the United States then they should take 5 million of ours. If we don't change the way we think we will lose all of our manufacturing jobs.

The biggest reason companies go overseas is to save on labor costs. Like I said before, the U.S.A can't compete against slave labor wages. Union or non union doesn't really matter because both make a lot more than what other companies pay their workers.

A non union shoe factory worker in the United States makes 10 dollars an hour. A obviously non union shoe factory worker in China makes 10 dollars a day! How can we compete against that? The only solution would be to off set that cost with taxes on imported goods! This is just an example.

Edited on 3/13/2009 5:28 PM

Krakken · « **Reply #20 on:** March 13, 2009, 05:29:32 PM »

quote:
i think the extra savings were for us and them. i think they will use the money for product development and things like that so they earn more money and we get better bowling balls.

Now that is an optimistic view. They do product development for their margin not to give you better products.

Unions in the US are the problem. The auto industry is a prime example. It is falling apart in no small part because you are paying someone $40 an hour to bolt seats into cars. Not saying that isn't a pain in the butt, but consider most police officers are getting less than half of that.

Costs are sky high and that is why the auto industry is moving operations.

Unions were needed back in the day when there was little government oversight. Now the companies couldn't shaft the workers because the government would be asked to step in
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ROTO GRIP, There is NO Substitute
Slow Feet, Soft hand = Lots of strikes

KingofKings696 · « **Reply #21 on:** March 13, 2009, 07:20:00 PM »

What kind of cars do you guys drive? Are they 100% completely made in the USA? Most cars have products that were made outside of the USA.

I drive a 73 Mustang... SO yes my car is 100% American, thank you and have a nice day!

Nicanor · « **Reply #22 on:** March 13, 2009, 08:24:45 PM »

My car is a 1969 Corvette, wife's 2003 Corvette, 2006 Cadilac, work trucks Explorer and a Expedition. I also have three Harley Davidsons.

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Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)

« **Reply #23 on:** March 13, 2009, 08:36:47 PM »

Don't assume that because your vehicle says Ford on it that it was made in the U.S.A. Here is only one example:

http://apps.detnews.com/apps/multimedia/player/index.php?id=1189

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Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff

www.brunswickbowling.com

The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer and not of Brunswick Corporation.

JessN16 · « **Reply #24 on:** March 13, 2009, 08:45:07 PM »

Here's my biggest issue with Brunswick moving out of the country: They're the only ones to do so.

Ebonite? Still here. Storm? Still here. The company that eventually emerged as 900Global? Here and making good stuff. And the smaller companies are all still in business, and we just added one (Motiv).

Don't tell me "We moved out of the USA to be able to compete," when 100 percent of your competition is U.S.-based. The first company to move out of the country doesn't move out to "be able to compete." It moves out to make a buck -- or, in Brunswick's case, I suspect cover for losses in the boating and billiards arms of the business, but that's just a guess.

The quality factor is also a concern, but I have not seen that be a problem in my personal experience. I do, however, know a couple of shops who claim otherwise.

And I'm not against foreign companies. I have four cars in my yard, not one was made here. My problem is with someone pi**ing down my leg and telling me it's raining.

Jess

« **Reply #25 on:** March 13, 2009, 09:20:41 PM »

I respect everyone's opinions here, and try not to let it affect the fact that we probably agree on more things than we disagree on, but with all due respect, you guys are talking out both sides of your mouths.

You claim to not have issues against foreign countries, and that you buy foreign-made products UNTIL it comes to your bowling balls.

What's the difference? Just because Brunswick was the first to move production outside the U.S. it doesn't mean they'll be the last. How can we know such a thing?

On a separate note: Everyone have a good night and a great weekend! I'm gone.
--------------------
Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff

www.brunswickbowling.com

The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer and not of Brunswick Corporation.

Edited on 3/13/2009 9:25 PM

DON DRAPER · « **Reply #26 on:** March 13, 2009, 09:25:48 PM »

the people who read posts on this site had better take a long hard look at themselves before they make a post proclaiming, "i only buy american", or "i won't buy a brunswick ball because it's made in mexico". while it's easy to say you only buy american made products buying them for your daily use is another. look at many of the items we use every day that are usually not made in this country:

clothing
shoes
cameras

tvs
stereos
camcorders
watches
cell phones
phones
cars
beer
computers
ink pens
pencils

i suspect many on this site are hypocritical in this regard-----that is why i recommended the self reflection i stated earlier. for myself, i will continue to buy the best product...period. regardless of where it is made.

Edited on 3/13/2009 9:26 PM

charlest · « **Reply #27 on:** March 13, 2009, 09:28:23 PM »

quote:
I hate to break the news to you all, but Brunswick is a corporation. This is not a non-profit organization. Corporations are in business to make money. Corporations that operate in the negative, don't last. If I'm not mistaken, most of their raw materials are U.S. made. Get over it.

As as far as all of this tax talk. Have you not heard of NAFTA?

BAYER which makes their resins is a German company. I wonder if the resin is made in the United States or Germany?
The same is true for BASF who makes resins for 900Global, AMF, Lane#1 and Ebonite. A German coporation. Are their resins made in the US or in Germany?
I don't know. I am asking.

I do know that Lanemasters imports their resins from Europe.
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"None are so blind as those who will not see."

Edited on 3/13/2009 9:33 PM

charlest · « **Reply #28 on:** March 13, 2009, 09:31:10 PM »

quote:
What kind of cars do you guys drive? Are they 100% completely made in the USA?

No car has all of its parts made in the US. period.

quote:

Most cars have products that were made outside of the USA.

All cars have parts made in almost every country of the world.

quote:

I drive a 73 Mustang... SO yes my car is 100% American, thank you and have a nice day!

I sincerely doubt it. In fact, I can virtually guarantee it. Even back then Ford was a world-wide corporation.
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"None are so blind as those who will not see."

Nicanor · « **Reply #29 on:** March 13, 2009, 09:31:21 PM »

I never said I only buy American. I'm just against a US company leaving the US to go to a country to take advantage of low wages, low priced real estate and little care for the enviornment taking away jobs from US citizens and not even passing back some savings to the US comsumer. Thats way different then saying I only buy American.

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Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)

Buddy Christ · « **Reply #30 on:** March 13, 2009, 09:35:43 PM »

quote:
I never said I only buy American. I'm just against a US company leaving the US to go to a country to take advantage of low wages, low priced real estate and little care for the enviornment taking away jobs from US citizens and not even passing back some savings to the US comsumer. Thats way different then saying I only buy American.

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Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)

Exactly. All you guys really didn't cover the point. (Maybe you did. I don't really care to read before I reply.)

Are they trying to make up the cash from the move, or what? And, I did happen to read on how the products are of lesser (don't think that's a word) quality. So, what's with the price gouging? Are they taking financial advice from Exxon Mobil?
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=Sean=
"Got Christ?" -Catholicism Wow!

Author Topic: Have the Brunswick bowling ball buyers seen (Read 18359 times)

Nicanor

Have the Brunswick bowling ball buyers seen

CoachLefty

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applegam

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chitown

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Krakken

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KingofKings696

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Nicanor

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JessN16

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DON DRAPER

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charlest

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charlest

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Nicanor

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