Post by: xrayjay on September 21, 2011, 05:44:38 AM
I was wondering if any of you here had the experience of going there to bowl, train, or just visit the place.
I am planning to go there some time this year, but mostly likely it'll be next spring. It'll cost me from $700-$1000 depending how many nights I stay at the hotel and if I choose the half day or the full day sessions. Right now, I'm going solo. But hopefully I can get some guys to go for the group lessons.
Anyway, I look forward in hearing anything about this place.....
Tag Team Coaching Success Story 
AKA: addik
Post by: born2bowl2 on September 21, 2011, 02:16:15 PM
I did a full day session with Randy Stoughton and it was worth every penny.
He had me warm up for 10-15 minutes then he began taking video and C.A.T.S. readings. Once he collected enough data we sat down and he explained what I was doing right and what I need improvement on. After that, we got on the lanes and began working on his suggestion. There was a quick lunch break then back to the lanes to continue working.
At the end of the day I received a DVD of the lesson and my C.A.T.S. readings.
I highly recommend requesting Randy as a coach. He was fun and friendly and explained everything in an easy to understand manner.
Post by: Cobalt Bomb on September 21, 2011, 02:20:51 PM
I agree with above wholeheartedly. I spent 2 days there a couple of years ago with Stephen Padilla (now with the USBC). The only thing you might want to consider is breaking it up into half days if you have the time. Bowling for eight hours, even with breaks and video analysis time, is ALOT of bowling.
Post by: bcw1969 on September 21, 2011, 02:31:41 PM
I have been there a few times now(I live in Florida), but so far I have only gone there to practice(no instructor). I have done that for price concerns. It is only 50 dollars for a three hour block, and when you reserve a spot for practice by calling them up, they can put out whatever pattern you'd like to practice on which is neat.
Brad
Post by: Crash7189 on September 22, 2011, 08:26:55 AM
I was at Kegel a few years ago. I learned a lot, not just how to bowl it is worth the money. The cats & Video is an eye opener, I did improve greatly, It gave me a plan on how to play sport patterns. I worked with Joe Slowinski only thing I did not like is Joe wants you to bowl his way. He tried to change a lot with my release My hand physically can do what he wanted to do. because of arthritis but he would not listen to me about that. Overall very good instructor I will do it again when I can get to Fla. Just Remember the 1st rule of bowling there are no rules do let let any force you into something you can not do physically.
Post by: born2bowl2 on September 22, 2011, 08:49:16 AM
I had a unpleasant experience with Joe S. myself.
Joe was instructing a couple on the pair next to me as I was practicing.
My coach (Randy) asked Joe what pattern was put down on my pair. Joe told him it was Highway to Hell. Randy told him that I was scoring well on the pair. Joe told him that I probably just broke down the pattern. Randy told him that before lunch I was striking from outside & that I continued to strike from playing inside. Joe rolled his eyes and walked away.
I found it very impolite and unprofessional to act that way, especially in front of a paying customer.
Post by: xrayjay on September 22, 2011, 09:51:32 AM
The last thing I want is to have someone tell me to be somebody I am not.
Tag Team Coaching Success Story AKA: addik
Post by: Zanatos1914 on September 22, 2011, 10:43:07 AM
Wow -- I find it amazing people would actually pay that amount of money for bowling lesson.. Can we get some avgs..... Also people include if you are playing in open play or sport ....
2 Fingers 4 Life
I Am The 3 Fingers Nightmare
Post by: born2bowl2 on September 22, 2011, 11:02:12 AM
I don’t see anything amazing about paying to improve your game.
No matter how good you are you are, there is always room for improvement.
All the top athletes in the world use a coach.
Post by: Joeyd on September 22, 2011, 12:43:28 PM
.... and I find it amazing that some people bowl with two fingers.. To each their own though, right?
I went to Kegel in January of '08. I did two day-long sessions with Stephen Padilla and everything was great. I learned a ton, got to speak to Del Warren a bit, started learning how to play straighter, and my average has gone up 10 pins.
Jay, you'll definitely find your time at Kegel to be worth it.
Joeyd
www.bowlneba.com
www.buddiesproshop.com
Post by: bazza on September 22, 2011, 01:56:25 PM
Hi all,
I have recently got back from a private half day lesson at Kegel with Coach Joe Slowinski. I'm from Liverpool in the U.K. and i managed to have a lesson while on a Holiday in Orlando. The whole experience was awesome from top to bottom. Brent took the booking and organised everything for me including drilling a couple of balls for me while i was over there.
The lesson was a huge eye opener for me. Coach Joe Slowinski took my lesson and was most polite and attentive throughout the 3 hrs. One of the main benefits of the lesson is with the video analysis and the C.A.T.S. information if coach Joe suggested something you can see instantly after the shot what happened. I personally felt this was most productive, and within about 30 mins of starting i was doing 3 step approach which helped me get the feel for where my late timing issue should be then coach Joe suggested trying a 5 step approach and seeing how we got on.
Well it was like something just clicked into position. it felt odd to start with but after another 30 mins or so it felt great, coach Joe showed me the video footage from the very begining of the lesson with my 4 step approach to where i was upto at that point and it was like looking at a completely different bowler. It was a huge improvement. Coach Jo then gave me a couple of drills to do when im practicing then he started to work on my swing plane. This was far more of a problem and progress on this was much slower and a lot more difficult, the rest of the 3hrs was taken up with this and at the end I felt like i had moved on somewhat.
The lesson finished and i was almost glad because bowling constantly for the 3 hrs had taken it out of me. But the whole experience was superb and i will definately go back for another lesson or two in a year or so. Maybe with a group if i can interest any friends.
In my opinion the $300 plus tax for the private lesson is more than a worth while investment in your game, If i was going to have a couple of lessons i would try to space them out with a day or two to recover inbetween though.
I look at it like this, In the U.K. the $320 for the lesson is the equivilent of 2 low/mid price bowling balls and if the lesson helps me to add 5 pins to my average and helps me with even just one problem then it is well worth it.
To wrap up, all the staff i spoke to were both knowledgeable and also very friendly and approachable. I was amazed at the progress i made with my game in such a small amount of time which i put down to the facilities, the coach and there coaching methods. And I cannot wait to get the chance to go back again and again.
Xrayjay if you want to ask me anything else regarding my time at kegel just pm me.
Barrie.
Post by: RyanRPS on September 22, 2011, 03:44:07 PM
I went there when I was over with our World Youth team when the WYC was on in 2008, and I also got to bowl there myself. The staff are great and the little bit instruction we got was good. It was a shorter than usual lesson I think as, if I recall, all the world youth teams got to play for cheap/free...
I'd be interested to hear from any high average sport players to see what they worked on and if they fel it improved their game much?
Ryan
Ryan Press - Seismic Staff Member
www.seismicbowling.com
Post by: TwoFourEightNineNine on September 22, 2011, 04:50:47 PM
I've gone to Kegel a few times since it was still in Sebring.
First things first the facilities and coaching staff in Sebring, Winter Haven (Maryfran and Vernon), and Lake Wales are first class.
What I will say is that these facilities are not success factories where you pay the money an instantly become a bowling superstar. They help with facilitating the knowledge, vision, and practice routines that will hopefully enable you to bowl well in competition.
Therefore, in essence, what you get out of the training centers is what make out of the training yourself after your visit. I recommend that people go and continue learning and practicing after their visits here.
24899
Edited by TwoFourEightNineNine on 9/22/2011 at 4:52 PM
Post by: Crash7189 on September 23, 2011, 08:54:19 AM
I do suggest Kegel may not be the answer for everyone if you only bowl a house shot do not waste your Money. Find a Local coach. Kegel is best for the Sport shot player the Pro , The serious bowler who knows what it takes to improve to the upper level of this sport. Over the years I have gone to many coaches because they all are different. You the bowler takes from each coach what works best for your game. There is not one way bowl or coach . Find a coach that works best with your game. I am a Silver level coach myself I go to other coaches to help my game and also learn from them on what they know about coaching. I suggest to my students to work with other coaches to improve. I am not the only answer, But you have to make sure you use what works best for you. I have been to Kegel, (Joe S.) Fred Borden, Ron Hatfield, Jeri Edwards , Bill Spigner, Andy Parker, All top level coaches. I have found something each time that helped me with my Game & my coaching . My talent will take me so far, coaching will take me the rest of the way. All bowlers should keep an open mind. The world best bowlers still see a coach. I still work with Fred & Ron They are my mentors for my coaching I could not think of a better group of coaches to learn from. Sorry for the rant but to many bowlers think they know everything but will never challenge them selfs to get better I applaud any one you tries never give up .
Post by: Leroy Taylor on September 25, 2011, 10:14:27 PM
Edited by Leroy Taylor on 9/25/2011 at 10:20 PM
Post by: r534me on September 25, 2011, 11:52:02 PM
Addik,
Were you able to attend Ron Clifton's clinic in July? I am not sure of his style but he has a lot of bowling knowledge.
Post by: xrayjay on September 26, 2011, 10:07:40 AM
Yeah, there's a 4-day camp going on next week at Henderson, NV from Oct. 3-6 with Couch, Kent, and others....$995 includes breakfast and lunch, 3 ebi balls, 2 shirts, and DVD..... It's closer to CA...but, it's during the work week.
Tag Team Coaching Success Story AKA: addik
Post by: xrayjay on September 26, 2011, 10:09:48 AM
I wanted to attend the Ron's clinic, but I was scheduled on that weekend in the hospital. we were short staffed, so calling is sick wasn't an option lol
Tag Team Coaching Success Story AKA: addik
Post by: WIU_Bowling_Coach on September 28, 2011, 04:58:20 PM
Hello all,
I wanted to share a few words to everyone.
All of the coaches, at the Kegel Training Center, base instruction on the biomechanical movements of the best players in the world. In other word, we teach to the same picture and blueprint. As with all coaches, each of us is different. At the KTC, we have the great fortune of having the largest video database of professional and world-class players. As such, we have a great responsibilitity to share our knowledge.
We want your experience to be excellent when visiting the KTC. We are very proud of how much better bowlers become after receiving training in our Lake Wales facility.
We have Computer Aided Tracking as well as video (side, front, rear) and can put down any patterns that you want to bowl on during your stay. And, our facility is the only one in the world in which you can change topography. We have 2+ miles of changes under the lanes which allow us to flatten the lanes like no other place in the world.
My colleagues and I work hard on a day-to-day basis to create new knowledge. We do this by challenging each other through discussion as well as research.
Bowlers come to us from all over the world. And, we are proud of working with all of these visitors. In the last week, I have worked with bowlers from Australia, Columbia, Tennessee and North Carolina.
We are also the site of the Webber International University bowling program.
You can learn more at the Kegel Training Center web site http:www.kegeltrainingcenter.com
P.S., born2bowl2 - When did you visit us? That sounds extremely uncharacteritic and I wanted an opportunity to ask a few questions and make a few comments. It is likely that we made reference to the pattern. I might have mentioned that the pattern had been bowled on previously and had transition. This was not intended to diminish your success bowling on the pattern. We are very serious about informing individuals about the state of the pattern as transition impacts ball motion greatly. Highway to Hell transitions extremely quickly. But, we haven't put Highway to Hell down at the Training Center much recently. Most importantly, I apologize if you perceived my facial expression as "rolling my eyes" as I didn't intend any disrespect. We just don't belittle accomplishment at the KTC. Once again, I apologize if there was any misunderstanding.
P.S.S., Crash7189 - I am sorry I pushed you in a direction that you didn't feel comfortable. We try to make every effort to help each client meet their full potential and migrate to the most efficient way to bowl, based on biomechanical principles. I hope that you will return to see us in the future. Most often, it is easier to bowl with the changes that we recommend. Although, it is a challenge to make changes and it requires work at home to cement the changes.
Joe Slowinski
Master Teaching Professional
Edited by WIU_Bowling_Coach on 9/28/2011 at 5:02 PM
Edited by WIU_Bowling_Coach on 9/28/2011 at 5:05 PM
Edited by WIU_Bowling_Coach on 9/28/2011 at 5:06 PM
Edited by WIU_Bowling_Coach on 9/28/2011 at 5:07 PM
Post by: born2bowl2 on September 28, 2011, 06:55:03 PM
To answer your questions:
I was there January 5, 2011
When I saw your reply I dusted off the DVD I received from Kegel so I could be 100% accurate about what was said. So here is how the conversation went between you and Randy:
Randy: Joe, what was the shot here?
Joe, Highway to Hell
Randy: Highway to Hell....our version of the U.S. Open. That's what you are bowling on.
Joe: Yes 7 & 8
Randy: all this guy has done is strike for the last 2 and a half hours.
Joe: Well.....once you break that down I think it's pretty easy shot.
Randy: he's been all over. He's playing up 7/8 right now. Look at this (I strike). He was playing in around 17/18 a little while ago. Then he moved out to 5 to see what would happen and he started striking from there.
Joe: (hard to hear) sound like you say - that pair is hooking.......this is where you roll your eye and walk away.
Randy: he is making this Furious look like a million bucks.
That is how it went. Both me and my girlfriend noticed your facial expressions. I don't know how you meant it to come across but we both took it as a sign of disrespect.
I'm sure you are a nice guy but that is not how you came across that day.
Post by: WIU_Bowling_Coach on September 29, 2011, 06:26:30 AM
I see it on the calendar now. You were here in 2010, a LH from Chicago. I was working with a couple I have worked with many times.
Once again, I am sorry for the misunderstanding. Please accept my sincere apology about how I came across that day. I am deeply sorry that I came across as disrespectful. This really was not the intent.
The 70+ hour work weeks may have taken a toll on that day.
I hope to see you back at the KTC in the future.
Post by: Crash7189 on September 29, 2011, 08:57:50 AM
To Joe S . Joe I did learn a lot from you . I do use some of your principle's in my coaching. You have made me a better bowler, as the other coaches I have seen. I know every one thinks there methods are the best as they should. I work with a range of students from the beginner to the high ave regional pro. The more I can learn form all the great coaches the better I can be as a Coach & a Bowler. I will never Say I know everything , I do want to learn everything. Thanks For your Help when I was down at Kegel If I can ever get there again I will. In the past I have sent a couple of my Student to see you. A good coach is open minded to there students seeking another opinions. Because it can only make me a better coach. My issue when I was at Kegel I have Arthritis in my hands, I could not get my hand do what you wanted it to do because of the shooting pain thru my wrist & hand when I would bowl. I did say kegel was worth the money . If anything I say what i feel in black & white no BS You did help me a great deal. All I meat to say is Joe believes in his methods and will push you to do them which you should . But Bowling should not hurt is what i meant to get in my case.
thanks again
Post by: milorafferty on September 29, 2011, 09:12:22 AM
Ron's clinic in Woodland was first rate. It was fully booked, so there might be a possibility of getting him back out here to Northern Ca soon. Lonnie and Diana Cavins set up the clinic for Woodland, so you might be able to get your local proshop to do the same.
Post by: born2bowl2 on September 30, 2011, 07:01:55 AM
Hello Joe,
You are somewhat correct. The LH from Chicago was my girlfriend, which also was being coached by Randy.
I fully accept your apology and I understand how a long workweek can affect a person.
I must admit that I left the training center with a negative impression of you but I truly appreciate your apology and I hope to return to Kegel soon.
Thank you,
Gil
Post by: StickZ on September 30, 2011, 10:40:10 AM
so if alot of bowlers who dont have the time or money to travel around to bowl tournaments or regionals shouldnt go to kegel? someone please explain this to me. i know a THS isnt the hardest thing in the world but you still have to make shots consistantly. i have yet to bowl on a house shot where i had 10 boards jus to spray the ball across...I had been thinking hard about saving to go to kegel but with the negative comments coming from a few people in this post, i dont see why i would "waste" my time. sorry that the bowler who bowls every year week in week out, wants to be competitive but doesnt have the time to bowl on sport shots is the dirt on your shoe...
Career High Game: 300x3
Career High Series: 774x2
High Game 09'-10' Season:300
High Series 09'-10':774
KiDSGoTGaMe
Post by: spmcgivern on September 30, 2011, 10:55:00 AM
I hope no one thinks a THS bowler shouldn't go to the Kegel Training Center. They are perhaps the best facility for those bowlers who want to work on their game while bowling on a variety of conditions such as sport bowling conditions. One can bowl on any pattern and tailor a game around that. If all you intend to bowl on is a THS, then perhaps a local coach, or one closer to home is a better option. If after a local coach is used you still want further training, then Kegel would be a great option. Just don't think Kegel is the only way to get quality instruction.
I am not a pro-bowler, but I do play one on BallReviews.com
Post by: newbie101 on October 02, 2011, 05:06:13 PM
Kegel Training Center has a Holiday camp on Dec. 28-30 for $650/person or $1200 for parent/child plus tax.
Includes: Drilled Hi performance Storm/roto grip ball, daily meals, etc. and Pete Weber will be their special guest.
Btw, lodging not included. Seems like a good deal.
I would really love to go but the dates are not convenient...Saw this ads on BTM October issue.
Post by: WIU_Bowling_Coach on October 03, 2011, 01:57:13 PM
Our holiday camp special guest is Pete Weber. For more information, please visit
http://kegeltrainingcenter.com/v2/foEventDetail.aspx?iKodOrganizasyon=155 for more information
The Kegel Training Center trains and works with all bowlers of all abilities and ages. I have personally worked with bowlers from 6 years-old to 85+ years old. We take pride in our training method that have helped bowlers improve significantly. We help bowlers throw their first 600, 700 or 800 series or win titles in major international competitions. From beginners to professional to national teams, we work with the complete spectrum unlike anywhere in the world.
We can help any bowler get better. And, most importantly, we work will all bowlers whether you want to get better on a house shot or learn to become a competitive PBA player.
To illustrate, we recently helped a 64 year old woman improve her physical game so that she can consistently throw faster ball speed efficiently. We were able to increase her ball speed from mid 14s to 17 in 90 minutes. And, as measured by C.A.T.S., her repeatability improved tremendously. Imagine how much higher here scores will be. Most importantly, she will enjoy our great sport more. And, within the same week, we worked with a 13 year-old boy from Columbia who wants to be a better bowler. We are helping prepare four of our Webber International University bowlers for the Pan American Games. And, Amleto Monacelli is with us training this week. Jason Couch is getting his equipped drilled at the KTC in preparation for the tour. From a 110 average beginner to a future PBA hall-of-famer, all train with us.
We enjoy working with all bowlers about realizing their goals. From bowling ball arsenals to biomechanical efficiency of a great physical game and advanced lane play, the Kegel Training Center creates and educates bowling knowledge.
Come on down to Florida. We would love to see all of you at the Kegel Training Center.
For more information on some of our success stories read
Edited by WIU_Bowling_Coach on 10/4/2011 at 4:43 AM
Post by: twisterking on October 04, 2011, 05:49:47 AM
For bowlers living in Europe there is the Kegel Training Center Europe NL which is located in Tilburg, The Netherlands. More info:
Post by: StickZ on October 04, 2011, 08:05:59 AM
yes someone suggested not to go to kegel if you only bowl on a THS...i felt quite disrespected with this comment..i would love to take my game to the "upper level" but I have started a family so i spend money elsewhere but kegel has always been an option to get great coaching and see my game broken down into pieces. sorry everyone is not on your level crash, so whats your name? ill look for you on television on sundays.
Career High Game: 300x3
Career High Series: 774x2
High Game 09'-10' Season:300
High Series 09'-10':774
KiDSGoTGaMe
Post by: spmcgivern on October 04, 2011, 09:57:32 AM
I think to some point going to Kegel for improvement on a THS may be a little overkill.
For one, KTC won't know exactly what your house shot is. There are more variations in THS than the PBA patterns or Kegel patterns. Yes, lane bed, atmospheric conditions, type of oil, etc.... will have an impact, but the general shot is known for the sport patterns.
Second, not saying going to the KTC is a waste of money, but utilizing the local coach as a beginning would be highly recommended. Could be someone who can monitor you for an entire season or summer and really work on your overall game and monitor what methods are working and what methods are not. And it will be a cheaper option most likely.
Now, if you want to go to KTC for a day or two and get great coaching and a plan on what to do to develop your game by great coaches, then go. Just realize for most, it is an expensive endeavor in terms of money and time. Or you may have had some local coaching and wanted to move up in coaching ability, which is fine. And who knows, training at KTC may make you a great bowler and give you the confidence to move to bowling on more difficult conditions and in more difficult tournaments. No matter what you do, if you truly want to improve your bowling, then I salute you and your efforts no matter what they are.
I am not a pro-bowler, but I do play one on BallReviews.com