BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: thewhiz on December 31, 2016, 01:13:55 PM
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What is the most aggressive ball out right now? The one that would handle the most oil?
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Many to pick from
Hammer Scandal
Columbia Tyrant
coming soon - Track Mako
then the king will be the Hammer Gauntlet......
Info coming Jan 5th
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The Cash (Radical) coming out on the 17th of January is supposed to be the strongest ever to this point. Then there's the Pitbull (DV8) and the Absolute Nirvana (Brunswick) at the top of the lines for the rest of the Big B family.
Motiv has the Jackal Ghost releasing on the 18th of January. Roto Grip has the No Rules, and Storm has the Alpha Crux. I think the top of the current 900 Global and AMF lines are the Inception and Great Escape respectively. Not sure if the Dream Big is still in production otherwise that would be the 900 Global candidate.
Dave listed the EBI family heavy oilers. Not much to add there besides Ebonite's Maverick, although that's more of a downlane monster than a snow tire like the rest of the balls mentioned. They also have the Warrior Supreme though which is nice.
I don't think you would notice a ton of difference between any of them. Just go with whatever brand you're most comfortable with and make sure the drilling and surface compliment the reaction you want to see. Personally I would probably go for the Cash if I needed something like this (I don't, Absolute Nirvana has it covered), but I'm on a bit of a Brunswick high at the moment given the last few balls I've gotten from the Big B family.
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T
I don't think you would notice a ton of difference between any of them. Just go with whatever brand you're most comfortable with and make sure the drilling and surface compliment the reaction you want to see. Personally I would probably go for the Cash if I needed something like this (I don't, Absolute Nirvana has it covered), but I'm on a bit of a Brunswick high at the moment given the last few balls I've gotten from the Big B family.
If you look at the hook ratings of oiler tests over the past 2 years, at least those performed by BJI, the Radical Guru line has been king. Radical's own throwbot comparisons, though labeled as biased by some, show greater hook by their Guru's than others. In my personal experience with the Gurus in PBA competition and sport leagues, the hype is real.
Still, I agree the CoorZero that there won't be a ton of difference between the different brands. If you're brand loyal, go with the company you're comfortable with.
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Storm Lock, Motiv Jackal Ghost/ LE.
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You need to look in which covers last the longest. A study shows that after 20 games, the Radical balls shine up quicker (study was done by Radical) than their competition. This means more surface adjustments to keep your desired reaction. Small things to keep in mind when purchasing oilers.
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Any strong ball in this conversation most likely has a dullish cover.
Any of them will need ball maintenance after every time you use it
Additionally, it may require de-oiling and surface touch up frequently.
If you are a low rev person or higher ball speed and want some help getting ball motion, then these could be for you
Also - ball strength is measured by overall motion, some can be much earlier than others, I know the Columbia Tyrant had strong midlane and downlane motion, it may not look like what you have in mind
Other balls have all the motion downlane
Consumers must want them as all of the brands are making them now....
They get stronger with each release it seems
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How does no one have a picture or details of this Hammer Gauntlet yet??
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Even though it's an older ball, I love my 2 Midnight Scorchers on floods. It is too bad no one else made a ball with a full size core with particle over a straight urethane base....great control up front and no jumpiness in the backend, but I guess most people prefer longer & then stronger.
Brad
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How does no one have a picture or details of this Hammer Gauntlet yet??
(https://www.ballreviews.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1371.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fag281%2FRyBlakely1%2FGauntlet_zps8pyeek0t.jpg&hash=2cb00a86aaefd633805ee11eef0f7af0d82827f2)
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How does no one have a picture or details of this Hammer Gauntlet yet??
(https://www.ballreviews.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1371.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fag281%2FRyBlakely1%2FGauntlet_zps8pyeek0t.jpg&hash=2cb00a86aaefd633805ee11eef0f7af0d82827f2)
Looks like a Haywire! Lol. I was expecting reds and blacks to be used based on the name.
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Think Scandal - like
with asymmetric core
a big hit during ball testing
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You need to look in which covers last the longest. A study shows that after 20 games, the Radical balls shine up quicker (study was done by Radical) than their competition. This means more surface adjustments to keep your desired reaction. Small things to keep in mind when purchasing oilers.
Interesting. Would you have a link to the study you're referencing?
To Dave's initial point, I've never seen an oiler that doesn't shine up to some degree when used on true heavy oil. I used my Guru Supreme for 6 straight games on 47' Chameleon in a Regional recently, and it didn't shine up to any unusual level. Certainly not any more than my Ebonite Pivot or Storm Marvel S would in similar use.
Anyway, link please, if available.
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The Hammer Gauntlet has the identical color scheme to my Wicked Encounter. I loved that ball!!!
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Right now, the most aggressive ball in the Global family is the Inception, but on the AMF side, there's the Great Escape and soon the Night Hawk Stealth. GE is assym, F81 cover, NHS is F78, symmetrical.
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You need to look in which covers last the longest. A study shows that after 20 games, the Radical balls shine up quicker (study was done by Radical) than their competition. This means more surface adjustments to keep your desired reaction. Small things to keep in mind when purchasing oilers.
Interesting. Would you have a link to the study you're referencing?
To Dave's initial point, I've never seen an oiler that doesn't shine up to some degree when used on true heavy oil. I used my Guru Supreme for 6 straight games on 47' Chameleon in a Regional recently, and it didn't shine up to any unusual level. Certainly not any more than my Ebonite Pivot or Storm Marvel S would in similar use.
Anyway, link please, if available.
As you can see in the video, the Radical ball starts with the lowest overall grit and finished with the highest overall grit after 20 games. This tells everyone that you have to really maintain radical covers to keep its initial reaction. I wonder why a shot was not taped with each ball showing initial reactions? Possibly becuase of the overall loss of reaction that would have been noticed.
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Scandal and No rules are the balls to get for oil..
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Scandal and No rules are the balls to get for oil..
What has been your personal experience with the Scandal? What volumes of oil have you had the most success?
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keep in mind, this a 42' high volume pattern and he has some decent ball speed
https://youtu.be/YEw5zAejKrk
I think this vid is better because it shows some different styles, although look how deep they are on THS, the last guy in the video is the reason why the manufacturers are making all these hook monsters
https://youtu.be/gvnorB4WN90
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I think this vid is better because it shows some different styles, although look how deep they are on THS, the last guy in the video is the reason why the manufacturers are making all these hook monsters
https://youtu.be/gvnorB4WN90
Currie is my hero! A true BOSS 8)
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As you can see in the video, the Radical ball starts with the lowest overall grit and finished with the highest overall grit after 20 games. This tells everyone that you have to really maintain radical covers to keep its initial reaction.
I think the point of the video was to show that with their cover chemical reaction, the change in RA surface values has less impact than you'd otherwise experience. Even though the Guru had the highest overall grit value after 20 games, it still maintained more hook than the others. If anything, that says you can get away with less maintenance (although I'd never do that).
I wonder why a shot was not taped with each ball showing initial reactions? Possibly becuase of the overall loss of reaction that would have been noticed.
Fair point. I can only relay my personal experience with the original Guru and Guru Supreme in long blocks with fresh surfaces (500/1500). I've been able to use both ball for entire 8 game tournament blocks without a noticeable reduction in reaction. I'm hard pressed to remember almost any other ball I've owned that didn't have some reduction, where flush pocket hits slowly degrade to washouts.
In looking at all three Radical videos, I own and still use 3 of the comparison balls used -- the Hammer Deadly Aim, Ebonite Pivot, and Columbia Swerve. I prep all the same as I do with the Gurus for heavier oil patterns -- Siaair 500/1500. With the same prep, none exceed the performance of the Gurus. The Hammer Deadly Aim is the same turkey that video#1 clearly exposed. The Columbia Swerve is initially very close, but within a few games, the ball shines up quickly and starts to noticeably lose some backend punch. The Ebonite Pivot is also very close, and maintains it's reaction longer than the Swerve. I really like the durable hybrid cover on the Pivot, and would buy more for storage if they were still in production. The hook shape compliments the Gurus well.
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keep in mind, this a 42' high volume pattern and he has some decent ball speed
https://youtu.be/YEw5zAejKrk (https://youtu.be/YEw5zAejKrk)
I think this vid is better because it shows some different styles, although look how deep they are on THS, the last guy in the video is the reason why the manufacturers are making all these hook monsters
https://youtu.be/gvnorB4WN90 (https://youtu.be/gvnorB4WN90)
Video#1 used Stone Street, which is an easier Kegel recreational pattern. Video#2 is a fresh THS as you noted. The problem is, with those patterns, a competent bowler should be able to get similar results with almost medium strength ball. Recreational patterns make most balls look similar.
The true test of an oiler is how it reacts on a longer flatter pattern. How the ball reacts front to back, where you're looking for the ball to pick up optimally in the transition. My experience with the Scandal is that it doesn't react well on flatter conditions, regardless of what surface I try. When it exits the longer flat, it doesn't read the limited back end friction well. It's laboring to pick up when it should be reading the dry.
I've taken my Scandal up to 4000 and can play walled THS shots effectively. But that's not what I bought Hammer's premier oil ball for. I have at least 10 other balls I'd use first on a THS.
BTW, if you want to push a Hammer oil ball, look at the Rebel Solid. After watching a Hammer staffer throw lights out with one, I had my own drilled up last week. This ball exceeds all expectations. I've only thrown few games on a fresh THS, but it's one of those balls you know is winner. It provides more hook than 95% of bowlers will ever need. At it's price point, it should be one of the more discussed balls on the forum.
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As you can see in the video, the Radical ball starts with the lowest overall grit and finished with the highest overall grit after 20 games. This tells everyone that you have to really maintain radical covers to keep its initial reaction.
I think the point of the video was to show that with their cover chemical reaction, the change in RA surface values has less impact than you'd otherwise experience. Even though the Guru had the highest overall grit value after 20 games, it still maintained more hook than the others. If anything, that says you can get away with less maintenance
This is why is said you have to maintain the surface to "keep its initial reaction." Are you saying that there is not a noticeable difference between 600 grit and 3900 grit finishes? The ball will be much cleaner and more angular. So more maintenance is needed to keep the sidewalk chalk 600 grit box finish. That is all.
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Longer heavier flat oil masks a lot of the difference in RA values. Despite the hype of hook monsters, nothing hooks in true oil, regardless of effective grit. You're looking for effective transition in the limited friction you have to work with front-to-back. All I'm saying is in my personal experience, I can effectively use the Gurus on the fresh, and also as the lane oil transitions throughout the block. They don't seem to be as impacted as my other oilers by cover absorption and RA value changes.
The message from the videos is that even after 20 games with no maintenance, the Gurus hooked more than the comparison balls. I think any reasonable bowler would be happy with the ending hook of the Gurus from game one.
In any case, whatever you throw, if you care about your equipment, especially heavy oil covers, you clean and touch up the surface after every serious use.
Look, I'm not a Radical staffer or amateur Radical homer. But I am a ball whore who throws different company balls with an open mind. There are balls from Storm, Columbia and Hammer I could also sing the phrases of. As examples, the Storm Rocketship and the Columbia Swerve FX are exceptionally good at what they're designed for. I don't understand the chemistry, but the ongoing results (for me) have spoken for themselves.
For oilers, it's hard to find fault with the Gurus, and now the Mix. It's nothing to get defensive about.
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(https://media.giphy.com/media/2dJ5Iait4QrW8/giphy.gif)
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LOL.....