It's an oft-repeated (and obvious) story, but one week of modern-day scoring obliterates past full seasons of high scores, as this report clearly shows.

http://www.examiner.com/article/grether-s-300-aleshire-s-806-and-2-women-s-700s-reflect-modern-high-score-tempo?cid=db_articles

... and in my area, there hasn't been anything resembling a Sport league in many seasons.

Quote from: gsback on April 22, 2014, 06:07:38 AM

Mighty Fish,

I've read a lot of the things you've written, both informative and plenty of the other stuff where I've wasted more than enough of my limited time in the mornings.  With that in mind, let me try something different; instead of making an assumption of your intent or telling you what I see in your article, let me simply ask you the intent of the article.  Simple answer...nothing long and drawn out.

Dear gsback:

Every weekend (Saturday or Sunday), I publish a report on high scores and accomplishments from each of the seven area centers, and this is the first time I have prefaced such report with a comparison of high scores of previous years.

There was no ulterior motive in my REPORTING of the previous week's high scores, and all of the feedback from LOCAL bowlers (about that article) has been positive. Only in a forum such as this is such a column likely to be criticized, which prompts me to ask: What is YOUR motive for asking me about the "intent" of the article? Just what issue(s) do you take with it?

Obviously, if I used such scoring comparisons (with previous years) in all -- or even a more limited amount -- of such columns, I could understand your "objections" ... but the fact is that such is not the case. And if you don't believe me, here is a link to hundreds of my past columns, and see if you can find anything similar in previous weekly high-score reports. Frankly, I don't see a "problem" although you apparently do.

www.examiner.com/bowling-in-st-petersburg/bill-herald

Forgot about this so will respond.  I enjoy reading most of your stuff.  What I don't enjoy is the BS that seems to follow in the posts, and not by you though eventually you get muddled around in it defending yourself.

My thought in the question was to see what your intention was in making the post and perhaps stating it.  By making a blanket statement you simply invited in all of your house guests that seem to follow you around.  And when that happens, the accusations start about your vendetta against the USBC, etc....etc, and then the thread goes to hell and people can't get through the thread without having to read 5-7 bickering posts until you find one that actually pertains to the original post.

Now, I had no objections in what you wrote.  I commented on a statement made as I too have talked with plenty of people about the golden days.  Hell I bowl with a gut that's closing in on 80 and that's all he talks about....how hard it was.  But, when pressed he does agree on a lot of things that made the shot back then 'workable'.  Sure, technology wasn't what it was, and today your average bowlers are made better because of the shot that's put out there and the balls that people throw today.  But bowlers had their ways of getting to the pocket back then as well.  The bigger difference is more carry today (as a result of soft lanes and strong equipment...sure). 

So again...nothing wrong in what you posted.  Just wish the posts stayed on track, which I guess I know they won't.  Oh well.

I am 66 years old.  It is not just technology.  The knowledge of the bio mechanics of the game has advanced a bunch, just as it has in other sports.  Take a look at instruction manuals from the 60's.  They pretty much told you to throw a hook by putting your thumb at 9 oclock and aiming at second arrow. 

The golden age of bowling was never that golden.  The leaders of the PBA threw away opportunities to make the tour lucrative enough to be viable for more than the top 15 or 20 money winners.  In 1975 I was one of the top players in my city.  I was also a mid level accountant in large local company.  I was making more in my job than all but the top 20 money winners on tour.  1/2 of the guys on tour couldn't have made my scratch league team, but they had nothing better to do, and found sponsors who would put them on tour for various reasons.   

Quote from: mainzer on May 02, 2014, 08:45:52 AM

All of those things contributed to advancing scores not just lane conditions and bowling balls. If you want proof, take a older gentleman that does not understand the technology in a modern high end ball, it won't help his game if he cannot use it properly. It could potentially hurt his game more than help. .

Dear mainzer:

True enough. However, there are also a number of elderly bowlers who -- even in their 50s, 60s and sometimes even in their 70s -- carry higher averages than they did decades ago.

 Bill,

 This is true enough, yet I will go back to the statement I made before, and use that as a reference point.

 I was really good, but much of that "goodness" came from the fact that many/most of the required techniques were things I did NATURALLY, without having to learn how to do them. When something comes as a natural function of your personal physiology, you can become EXTREMELY "good" at that given task. This us why I was very good back then.

 Now, however, the parameters have changed, and they no longer favor my natural abilities, and I will NEVER be as good as those who DO fit the new ones naturally, no matter how much I learn, because it just doesn't come naturally, and I now have to think and work to achieve the results that once were so easy.

 It is also very frustrating to watch people using what I was taught was bad/wrong/incorrect, only to see it work as well, or better, than anything I ever did.

 As an example, there is a younger bowler here. He gets little, if any, lift on the ball. It appears he actually drops the ball at times. He LOVES dry conditions, and his release results in a shot that is just short of a spinner. I call him a twirler.

 He throws the most aggressive ball he can find, drilled as strong as he can get it, twirls the ball up a track dry enough I have to use a urethane ball if I am even going to be close to that same area, and shoots big scores. He currently is averaging around 220, with several 300's this season.

 20 years ago, he would've been lucky to average 160-170, and that's being honest. He does so many things that were "wrong" back then it isn't funny.  Thing is, the environment has changed, and those things are no longer "wrong" enough to keep him from scoring.

 I cannot do what he does, and wouldn't even if I could. It isn't his fault it works now, just like it wasn't my fault what I do worked back then. And, like me, he is just taking advantage of the fact that it is natural for him, easy for him, and it works for him.

 If you want to know my feelings, you can pretty much read anything by Bill Taylor, because many times, my personal feelings are reflected there.

 Bowling has changed, but the "window of scoring opportunity" has been thrown wide open by the advancements that have come along, that have allowed a wider and wider range of abilities to not only become acceptable, but predominant in today's game.

 I WISH IT HAD NEVER CHANGED, but it did.  I wish I could've mastered those changes as well as I did the ones that favored my style, but I could not. And I wish it was still a sport focused on the great bowlers, not a game driven by profit margins, but it isn't.

 

Bill,

 This is true enough, yet I will go back to the statement I made before, and use that as a reference point.

 I was really good, but much of that "goodness" came from the fact that many/most of the required techniques were things I did NATURALLY, without having to learn how to do them. When something comes as a natural function of your personal physiology, you can become EXTREMELY "good" at that given task. This us why I was very good back then.

 Now, however, the parameters have changed, and they no longer favor my natural abilities, and I will NEVER be as good as those who DO fit the new ones naturally, no matter how much I learn, because it just doesn't come naturally, and I now have to think and work to achieve the results that once were so easy.

 It is also very frustrating to watch people using what I was taught was bad/wrong/incorrect, only to see it work as well, or better, than anything I ever did.

 As an example, there is a younger bowler here. He gets little, if any, lift on the ball. It appears he actually drops the ball at times. He LOVES dry conditions, and his release results in a shot that is just short of a spinner. I call him a twirler.

 He throws the most aggressive ball he can find, drilled as strong as he can get it, twirls the ball up a track dry enough I have to use a urethane ball if I am even going to be close to that same area, and shoots big scores. He currently is averaging around 220, with several 300's this season.

 20 years ago, he would've been lucky to average 160-170, and that's being honest. He does so many things that were "wrong" back then it isn't funny.  Thing is, the environment has changed, and those things are no longer "wrong" enough to keep him from scoring.

 I cannot do what he does, and wouldn't even if I could. It isn't his fault it works now, just like it wasn't my fault what I do worked back then. And, like me, he is just taking advantage of the fact that it is natural for him, easy for him, and it works for him.

 If you want to know my feelings, you can pretty much read anything by Bill Taylor, because many times, my personal feelings are reflected there.

 Bowling has changed, but the "window of scoring opportunity" has been thrown wide open by the advancements that have come along, that have allowed a wider and wider range of abilities to not only become acceptable, but predominant in today's game.

 I WISH IT HAD NEVER CHANGED, but it did.  I wish I could've mastered those changes as well as I did the ones that favored my style, but I could not. And I wish it was still a sport focused on the great bowlers, not a game driven by profit margins, but it isn't.

Dear Juggernaut:

Actually, I can totally identify with what you are saying. I, too, was really good, and I was the best league and tournament bowler in my area prior to the scoring explosion. But, like your situation, much of that "goodness" came from instinct and the natural execution of proper techniques.

As you also indicate, changing "parameters" of the high-scoring era no longer favored my natural abilities, and I was unable to successfully adjust my game to the new conditions, even though a large number of my peers was able to do so. And, indeed, it was frustrating to see people using techniques that I considered "bad/wrong/incorrect" (as you stated) suddenly being able to beat me by 10 or 20 pins a game.

I note your example of the bowler now averaging around 220, but whom you indicate would have been lucky to average 170 on old-time conditions, and obviously, that's a result of the changing scoring environment. And I don't begrudge the fact that such bowlers are utilizing what "works" now, and I agree that it wasn't the fault of you or I that we formerly did what worked back then.

I also agree with your comment about Bill Taylor, and like you, I agreed with almost everything he said or wrote. I was fortunate to have had the opportunity to personally meet and talk to Mr. Taylor on a number of occasions, and he claimed that he appreciated my style of bowling writing.

Agreeing with your summation, I, too, wish that things hadn't changed, but accepted the reality that it did. And like you, I never was able to master the changes that worked to the benefit of others.

It should be obvious that I agree (and identify) with your above-quoted post.

Please note that not one thing in the prior paragraph said anything about scoring levels. which I consider to be largely irrelevant in the evolution of the game

This quote and the last post by Juggsy should be framed and be the first post after some guy with an agenda ever posts a "scoring pace" article again.  No matter who posts it.   

I don't think bowling is in a unique category here with increased scoring.  Look at many of the other sports....

Olympics - many world records were set at the latest winter and summer games
Baseball - high scoring games...more home runs
Football - higher scoring and much more passing
Golf - even with many golf courses lengthened, the scores are better
Etc

Bowling is not alone in this regard.  Many of the people playing in sports today use science, technology an improvements in health and medicine to take there game to the next level.  For many of the athletes today, it is their full time job unlike years ago where athletes would take jobs in the off season or even work during the season to make a living.

And no, I do not agree with cheating to try an gain an advantage.