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Author Topic: USBC ball regulations  (Read 4743 times)

Dogtown

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USBC ball regulations
« on: May 12, 2014, 12:04:18 PM »
USBC doesn't realize the implications of what they are doing.  This is an attempt to regulate 2-handed bowlers.  They think two handers can put 2 weight holes in the ball and call one a thumb hole, regardless of where it is.

My argument is "SO freaking what".  What advantage does increasing the differential in a bowling ball do for them?  If nothing else it hurts them because their rev rate is SO dominate.  They don't need more performance out of a ball.  One handed bowlers have just as many exotic drill patterns; double thumb, motion hole, rico, USA, rev leverage, Danny Wiseman pattern and on and on and on.

If they are truly against two handed bowling, make a rule against it.  Don't use ball regulations to try and tip toe around it.

I would love to here JustRico chime in on this!!!!

 

Gizmo823

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2014, 12:14:00 PM »
It could also be an attempt to placate one handed bowlers who are whining about something they don't know anything about.  This is just good PR for USBC, they appease a lot of complainers by appearing to make something fair, but in the grand scheme of things not really accomplish anything.  But then again, this is out of my league, I can't imagine 2 weightholes actually helping a 2 hander in the first place, but again that's a situation I've never had to deal with or speculate about before. 
What would you be if you were attached to another object by an inclined plane, wrapped helically around an axis?

Dogtown

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2014, 12:32:01 PM »
I don't like having 3 sets of ball regs for different style bowlers.

If you throw it with a thumb, you follow ball spec A
If you throw without a thumb, then you follow ball spec B
If you throw without any fingers or thumbs, then you follow ball spec C

How can you be fair, if different style bowlers have to go by different ball specifications?. 


Gizmo823

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2014, 12:39:06 PM »
I agree.  Makes it tougher to track and tougher to enforce or police.  I also don't like the smoke and mirrors in place of education.  However, a lot of the time if you tell the truth and try to educate, most people think you're blowing smoke up their ass anyway . .
What would you be if you were attached to another object by an inclined plane, wrapped helically around an axis?

storm making it rain

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2014, 12:54:49 PM »
If there is no advantage to shifting the thumb hole as "some" two-handers do.  My question would be WHY do they do it??  There has to be some advantage no??

Joe Cool

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2014, 01:08:25 PM »
People do a lot of things that don't necessarily give them an advantage just because they think it does (or might).  It does seem like this is targeted towards a very small number of bowlers, but may end up harming a much larger group than intended.
Hit the pocket and hope for the best

Gizmo823

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2014, 02:24:22 PM »
Well there's a theoretical advantage perhaps, whether it's realistic or applicable is a different story.  The last thing most two handers need is a more dynamic/earlier/sharper reaction, which is what I imagine would happen.  Or in other words, what they think is helping them may be hurting them because there's a misconception that a stronger ball reaction is better. 

If there is no advantage to shifting the thumb hole as "some" two-handers do.  My question would be WHY do they do it??  There has to be some advantage no??
What would you be if you were attached to another object by an inclined plane, wrapped helically around an axis?

Maine Man

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2014, 02:33:07 PM »
The majority of bowlers (obviously not the top teir players) can't hit the same 3-4 board area from shot to shot, so I'm not sure why they would worry about how the change in the thumb hole / weight hole rule would affect them (and their ball dynamics) more than their own inaccuracy.
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storm making it rain

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #8 on: May 12, 2014, 02:40:06 PM »
Let's take Belmo for an example.  Some of his layouts the thumb is WAY right of his grip center line.  He NEVER uses his thumb (even on spares) so my question is why they choose to lay a ball like that if it doesn't do anything to help him.  Now I believe it won't hurt him at all perfromance wise, but with the knowledgable people he has in his corner, there HAS to be an advantage to layout his stuff like that.  If there weren't there would be no need to do it.  I mean it could be just as simple as they needed to get excess weight out to comply with the weight rules.  Or it could be to give him a ball roll you couldn't get with the "thumb" hole staright up and down his grip line.  Who Knows..

ImBackInTheGame

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #9 on: May 12, 2014, 02:55:39 PM »
If there is no advantage to shifting the thumb hole as "some" two-handers do.  My question would be WHY do they do it??  There has to be some advantage no??

MOST Two handed bowlers shift their "thumb" hole to get it out of the flare zone.  Jason has mentioned this himself back when I was a member of the IAB Circle.

txbowler

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #10 on: May 12, 2014, 03:33:52 PM »
I don't know how many of you have ever been to a PBA tour stop, either bowling or just watching.

I would have to say the top 25 bowlers on the tour "most" of the time on any given pattern, hit the pocket 95% of the time.

It is not like watching league.

All of these guys are so good, they all have the pocket.

What they are seeking is carry.

Carry is the difference between TV show vs. just cashing.

At their level, they are looking for every conceivable advantage they can find. 

As you read in other posts, a lot of pros donate balls to the youth after a stop.  Well when they drilled up 10-20 that week looking for carry, they need to do something with them, as they start the process over again on the next stop.

And if a weird layout with someone calling an extra hole a "thumb" hole when in reality there is no freaking way they could put their thumb into it gives them carry (probably due to their talent), some jealous bowlers are going to fuss that it is because of the layout which a bowler who uses his thumb cannot duplicate.

It is sort of like the old plastic ball tournaments I used to bowl in the 90's.  As part of your entry fee, you were given a white dot.  You had to drill it over label.  Now it's just the talent of the bowler vs. the talent of the bowler.

No equipment advantage of any kind. 

Before this rule, true or not, it was being viewed as an equipment advantage.




Dogtown

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #11 on: May 13, 2014, 08:05:13 AM »
Keep this in mind, they can put the thumb hole wherever they want, regardless if they can actually get their thumb in it.  But once they do, the center of span is based on that location.  At that point, the ball has to meet USBC specs for side, top and finger/thumb weight based on the center of grip point, regardless of where it is.  Put all the holes you want in the ball, it still can only have 1 ounce side, 1 ounce finger/thumb and 3 ounces top-weight.  A 15lb ball weights 240 ounces.  You're allowed to shift 1/240th of the balls weight to the side and/or fingers/thumb and 1/80th top or bottom.  Where's the advantage? 
« Last Edit: May 13, 2014, 08:10:07 AM by Dogtown »

Dogtown

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Re: USBC ball regulations
« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2014, 08:14:19 AM »
I'm willing to bet there is not a single layout a 2-handed bowler can do that someone with a thumb couldn't duplicate and get the same performance numbers out of the ball.

Someone with the Blue Print software maybe able to confirm this.