BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: fluff33 on November 29, 2012, 10:17:23 PM
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Had this happen in league tonight and cannot find a USBC rule covering this. The last game was close coming down to the 2 anchors. Anchor on left bowls and gets a strike. He steps back to allow the other anchor to bowl. He refuses to go. So anchor on left rolls his second ball and gets 9 and he again steps back to allow the other anchor to bowl. Again he refuses. Anchor on left makes his spare. Now the other anchor decides to go. He gets the double he needs to win the game. I think I remember years ago there may have been a rule stating in a case like this that the bowler on the right goes first. Or it may have been just an unwritten understanding. I am interested on some thoughts on this and how others would have handled it.
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What your thinking of was part of the "bowling etiquette" but not a set rule.
If two players arrived at the approach at the same time, the player on the right goes first. Otherwise whoever arrives first goes first.
Also if two players are at the line and one has a spare, the player with the spare goes first.
Since the player on the left went first, the player on the right I think has the option to wait and allow the other player to finish the frame.
It's kind of a nit picky thing to worry about, I assume somebody is thinking "well if he hadn't waited things would have been different".
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Someone still has to strike or spare
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As has been stated, I'm 99.9% sure there's no rule mandating who has to bowl and when in these situations. Usually, if a bowler wants to wait so that he can see what he'll need, he stays seated or stands back someplace away from the approach and waits for everything to shake out before stepping up to the ball return. I anchor for my teams, and if I'm determined to wait, I'll usually mark down the scores. That way I'm doing something productive in the meantime. Now, the way you described it makes it sound like this other guy walked up to the ball return as if he was ready to go but then refused to do so until the other anchor bowler had finished the frame. Is that how it happened? If so, the guy who did the watching and waiting made an awkward situation out of something that didn't have to be.
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I've always hated that practice. If it's your turn to bowl, BOWL. If you might/probably will need a double, get up and throw your best shots. You're supposed to be doing that anyway. I'm not accusing anyone of sand bagging or anything, but the object is to try your hardest on every shot regardless of what you need in that frame. I understand putting a little more concentration on an important shot, but it shouldn't be dependent on what the other guy might do. It's like the people afraid to bowl next to a split. I've always thought about waiting them out just to make a point.
I don't think there is a rule covering it, but it's just one more thing done to slow things down. There's so little money involved in 90% of most leagues. That one shot you might throw might cost you 50 cents by the end of the year...
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Personally, I'd like to go first and (maybe) get all three strikes. Wanna see if he'll choke on his "strategy".
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I like to go up first when possible and put the heat right back on him/her. If they want to wait and let me throw another shot, that is just another potential "nail in the coffin" I can put on them.
I like the "ways to bowl a match" sometimes. If a guy is going real fast, I am dragging my feet between every shot. If a guy is going slow, I am getting up there as fast as lane clearance will let me.
That is what makes bowling fun: The cat and mouse games during a match
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Maybe the guy wanted to put himself in a pressure situation. Maybe he likes performing under pressure, to get what he needs. There's no rule against waiting. It's not polite, but it's not against the rules. Also, is that any different than the guy that gets on his cell phone, wanders off, and their teammates are busy looking for them?
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I agree with Gene. If the guy wanted to wait, he shouldn't have been near the ball return. If it were me, after I threw my first shot, I would have said, its your turn and probably walked away until he bowled. If the arrow is pointing to you, its your turn !
Sounded to me like he was playing games trying to get into the other players head, and it appeared it worked. I've bowled anchor for many years and I was taught all the tricks by a very good older bowler many years ago. The art of being an anchor and using these trick seem to have died with the older guys when making a spare usually won you the game. Today, most bowlers just get up there and throw 3 strikes and sit down without even looking at the other guy. Different times.
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Again, they're not nice, but head games aren't illegal. If they were, running shots out, slapping your hands, raising your voice, etc etc would be illegal. Don't let someone get under your helmet, and you will be fine.
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Maybe the guy wanted to put himself in a pressure situation. Maybe he likes performing under pressure, to get what he needs. There's no rule against waiting. It's not polite, but it's not against the rules. Also, is that any different than the guy that gets on his cell phone, wanders off, and their teammates are busy looking for them?
Nail on the head with the wanting to put yourself under pressure.
I like the pressure. It's fun and it's good practice. I would have and have done the same thing.
As far as the cell phone thing, yes it's wayyyy different. Deliberately waiting for someone is a lot different than being ignorant of your team and situation and wandering off.
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Of course there's nothing wrong with wanting to wait and see what you need to do. I do that from time to time as anchor man, but, again, I stay seated or back away from the approach. I don't go up to the ball return and just keep telling the other guy, "no, you shoot again."
From the way the OP described it, it kind of sound like that's what this guy was doing. To me, that's making things awkward and/or taking gamesmanship a bit far for league. If you want to wait and see what you need, stay in your seat or hang back away from the approach. That way the other guy isn't wondering whether or not you're ready to go.
Now, I've even seen this go too far the other way as well. I've seen a guy on one team take his shot and then sit down and refuse to bowl until the anchor from the other team comes up to throw his first one. I think that's stupid, too.
I like to win as much as anyone, but I'm not going to go out of my way to "get in the head" of one of my opponents during league. If we were bowling for thousands of dollars, maybe. But as it is, I'll just take my shots, do my best, and hope that I help my team come out on top. Some guys over-think these things big time!
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Agreed, Gene. Don't want to loiter at the ball return.
That being said, I will admit, in a large men's league, there are people that I may not like, that I have to bowl against. In those cases, I love playing head games.
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The head games concept just isn't for me, but that doesn't mean it's wrong. There are certainly some people I enjoy beating more than others. Still, I think it stings just as much when I do it with a smile as opposed to doing it with a scream and crotch chop!
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Best way to get in his head is to throw three and give him a high five on your way to your seat with a wink and a smile.
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Head games only work if you let them... And, frankly, are because the guy trying to employ them is usually unsure about his own ability to perform, so he is hoping you will "cave in" and let him off the hook.
Again, I say throw three strikes and see whose head is still in the game!
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I don't let people get away with that and it has nothing to do with "pressure". I have seen guys watch the other anchor strike out and win the match and they get up there and magically whiff the ten pin while being in the 240's so they can bag a little. No uh uh. Get up there and roll your ball after the guy you're bowling has rolled a ball. There is only ONE reason to wait and that's to bag. You have three balls in the tenth and you should be trying to strike on every one of them irregardless what the anchor man next to you has done.
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Head game or no, as the anchor, your job is to throw 3 in the 10th. Most will do it, not to bag, but to see what they have to do in the tenth. And essentially, what they are saying is "your going to take the pressure off me, because I dont think you can strike out." I've had it happen to me and I've done it, but irregardless, my job is to throw 3.
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Interesting topic. As an anchor I've never given much thought about when the anchor on the other team chooses to make his shots. The usual behavior for an anchor is (if possible) to shot first. That's certainly my preference if it works out.
Sometimes if I start, the anchor on the other team will stay in back of the lanes. If so, no big deal. I finish my business and he'll then take his turn. Sometimes if the other anchor starts I'll do the same. If the game is down to the wire, I like the extra time to focus on the finishing shots. Again, no big deal and I don't remember it ever being an issue.
I'll ask our league president if the issue has ever come up. I'll be surprised if it has.